Detective Comics #33...shift in value focus...? 0

[RockMyAmadeus]

So, something that occurred to me that I hadn't considered before: as, admittedly, stories and storylines have lost ground in importance related to first appearances, would it stand to reason, if this trend continues, that the importance of 'Tec #33 will evolve to focus on the (relatively important) first appearances of Thomas & Martha Wayne, and Joe Chill, rather than being the first time Batman's origin is told...?

Seems a rather bizarre thing to me, but...I can't help but think that the market's obsession with "first appearances" over "classic stories" will trickle down even to this mega of mega-keys. 5 years ago, I would have considered such a thought to be quite ridiculous...of course, it's the origin of Batman that drives the value of this book, not the first appearance of characters who are officially dead throughout nearly the entirety of Batman's existence. But now....I'm not so sure anymore.

Thoughts...?

[Jaydogrules]

Bad example.  

Along with the other pre-Robin Tecs, the "value" is in the classic cover.  

-J.

 

 

[kav]

17 minutes ago, Jaydogrules said:

Bad example.  

Along with the other pre-Robin Tecs, the "value" is in the classic cover.  

-J.

 

 

Yes it's a subsidiary factor like Action #1 is first app of jonathan and martha kent but that has no impact on value.  Ps I wasnt aware batman origin wasnt in detective 27?

[Buzzetta]

I think that the book has already gathered a storm of interest because of the story it tells, the classic cover, as well as being a pre-Robin Tec.  There is already heavy desire for that book  With the first appearances of the Waynes and Joe Chill featured in the book that is just an added bonus. 

Now if we are talking about a book like Action 83 which features the first appearance of Hocus and Pocus then we have a different outcome.  The book is desirable because it is a WWII early Action book and maintains a desirability factor of moderate to low range.  It is definitely a book that will climb in value if it is revealed that Hocus and Pocus are the most powerful beings in the DC Cinematic Universe, which given the state of the DCU is a legitimate possibility.  

Edited September 18, 2018 by Buzzetta

[comicdonna]

6 minutes ago, kav said:

Yes it's a subsidiary factor like Action #1 is first app of jonathan and martha kent but that has no impact on value.  Ps I wasnt aware batman origin wasnt in detective 27?

Tec 27 is the 1st appearance of Batman.  I don't think the origin story is in there.  

[RockMyAmadeus]

52 minutes ago, Jaydogrules said:

Bad example.  

 

It's the only example I'm concerned with.

[woowoo]

What abought the first app of   Tec 27

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 18, 2018 by woowoo

[kav]

1 hour ago, woowoo said:

What abought the first app of   Tec 27

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

PLUS first app of Bat-suit, Wayne Manor and a bunch of other stuff!!!!

[kav]

Action #1: first app Superman, Clark Kent, Lois, Krypton, Jor el, Lara, rocket that brought him to Earth, Jonathan and Martha Kent, Superman using his powers, on and on-

[RockMyAmadeus]

4 hours ago, Buzzetta said:

I think that the book has already gathered a storm of interest because of the story it tells, the classic cover, as well as being a pre-Robin Tec.  There is already heavy desire for that book  With the first appearances of the Waynes and Joe Chill featured in the book that is just an added bonus. 

 

Not in dispute. It's a thought exercise. What would happen if the first appearances of the Waynes and Joe Chill stopped being an "added bonus" and STARTED being the focus of the value of the book...?

Too strange? Too wacky? 

In this market, I'm beginning to wonder.

[woowoo]

36 minutes ago, kav said:

Action #1: first app Superman, Clark Kent, Lois, Krypton, Jor el, Lara, rocket that brought him to Earth, Jonathan and Martha Kent, Superman using his powers, on and on-

You forgot

 

[sfcityduck]

46 minutes ago, RockMyAmadeus said:

Not in dispute. It's a thought exercise. What would happen if the first appearances of the Waynes and Joe Chill stopped being an "added bonus" and STARTED being the focus of the value of the book...?

Too strange? Too wacky? 

 

Yes.

But, I'm already aghast that D33, featuring the origin of Batman and a very cool cover with Batman wearing a gun holster, is already considered a second tier "pre-Robin tec" compared to some of the other covers.  I blame CGC.  This hobby is more and more resembling two dimensional coin and baseball card collecting than the comic collecting hobby I knew in the 70s and 80s which focused on interior stories.  

[Buzzetta]

3 hours ago, RockMyAmadeus said:

Not in dispute. It's a thought exercise. What would happen if the first appearances of the Waynes and Joe Chill stopped being an "added bonus" and STARTED being the focus of the value of the book...?

Too strange? Too wacky? 

In this market, I'm beginning to wonder.

Oh, I don't think it is a dispute at all.  It is an interesting point but I feel an extreme example.  I feel that books like Tec 33 have a more limited circle of potential buyers than a book like the aforementioned Action 83 (I cannot really think of another example at 5am).  This is due to the price that Tec 33 commands. Therefore, those people will always determine why the book is special and will command the premium it does. If anyone out there ever wanted a Tec 33 at this point and had the means to do so, then I believe that they would have gotten it already.  I don't think the sudden declaration of a Thomas and Martha Wayne as pivotal or desireable characters shift the needle in any significant way. 

However, I think you really have something there, and in growing proportion with the lower the value of a book.  After all, originally NM98 was a desirable book not because of the first Deadpool but because of Liefeld and the whole leading into X-Force thing.   That is a book where the first appearance outshone the storyline and the art as the years went on.  So I believe that it has to do with the pricing that a book already has. 

Ha... Don't know why this just popped into my head because it is a poor example in comparison.  However, one day Strange Tales 97 might explode if Marvel in its infinite wisdom ever decides to have Aunt May reveal to Peter that he has an older cousin from Ben's side of the family who they also took in at one point. That cousin, Linda Brown was a mutant mermaid and should be found. That would make the Aunt May and Uncle Ben in ST97 the same May and Ben of Spider-man fame. 

[miraclemet]

seems like "origin story" books holding a premium is a thing of the past.... trying to think of a book that still holds a premium due to the presence of the origin story (assuming the 1st appearance is elsewhere and the origin story has not been told yet)

[ADAMANTIUM]

5 minutes ago, miraclemet said:

seems like "origin story" books holding a premium is a thing of the past.... trying to think of a book that still holds a premium due to the presence of the origin story (assuming the 1st appearance is elsewhere and the origin story has not been told yet)

Marvel Preview 2 is all I can think of, and that is mostly in 9.8 condition....

[woowoo]

1 hour ago, miraclemet said:

seems like "origin story" books holding a premium is a thing of the past.... trying to think of a book that still holds a premium due to the presence of the origin story (assuming the 1st appearance is elsewhere and the origin story has not been told yet)

Superman 1

[miraclemet]

2 minutes ago, woowoo said:

Superman 1

would be tough to parse out what percentage of the value is in it being the 1st issue of a title that has run for 70 years, vs the value around the issue having the first "full" Superman Origin...

 

and then you have to consider like 'tec 33, Superman 1 is the first appearance of Jonathan and Martha Kent, who were far more consequential in Superman's life vs Batman's (dead) parents. 

[kav]

15 minutes ago, miraclemet said:

Martha

 

[woowoo]

38 minutes ago, miraclemet said:

would be tough to parse out what percentage of the value is in it being the 1st issue of a title that has run for 70 years, vs the value around the issue having the first "full" Superman Origin...

 

and then you have to consider like 'tec 33, Superman 1 is the first appearance of Jonathan and Martha Kent, who were far more consequential in Superman's life vs Batman's (dead) parents. 

I think Pa and Ma Kent was the character's first appearance in 1938 Action comics 1 and in Superman 1 introduces Superman's adoptive parents Mary kent was the name she got.

I just read the 1st page of Action 1 and the kent's are not mentioned  So your right Superman 1 was there 1st app

Edited September 18, 2018 by woowoo

[kav]

1 minute ago, woowoo said:

I think Pa and Ma Kent was the character's first appearance in 1938 Action comics 1 and in Superman 1 introduces Superman's adoptive parents Mary kent was the name she got.

yep and pa kent was called pop kent