Why do so many of you think the hobby is 'dying'???

[Guest]

Just because there are no new readership into the hobby doesn't mean that there won't be a demand for comics. Looking at the ebay prices for some back issues (especially CGC) I would say the market is alive, strong and kicking,

 

I think there will be a strong demand for back issue comics for many decades to come. As long as superheroes are in the mainstream people will COLLECT back issues.

 

Just because new readership is gone doesn't mean the hobby is dead...I mean look at antiques and other collectibles.

 

They don't make antiques and vintage cars anymore, but people still collect them! (Actually, because they don't make them anymore, makes them all that more collectible!)

 

I think comics is moving away from being a nickle and dime 'kids' hobbie to being a SERIOUS adult hobby. Kids won't be collecting then anymore, but who cares??? ... as they get older (and has more money) and are done with video games they WILL collect comics, if not something else.

 

"Collecting" will ALWAYS be a part of the human psyche. If its not antiques, comics, coins or belly button lint...it'll be something else. I feel that as long as the desire to collect is within the human spirit, there will be a demand and a place for comics.

 

And comics unlike antiques, stamps and coins is aided by the fact that comic characters are embeeded in the mainstream! Ask a 100 Americans if they know who Spider-man and SuperMan is, then ask them if they know what a Louis XV arm chair looks like, or what's the difference between a 1901 Quarter vs. a 2001 quarter is....u see what i'm getting at?

 

So relax and enjoy the hobby....because it'll be around for quite a while.

[aardvark88]

I both agree & disagree. When a line or title gets cancelled (e.g. Whiz, Capt Marvel, ECs, pulps), the prices will remain stagnant or decline for decades. Comicdom needs a constant influx of new, younger collectors who will mature/get full-time jobs so we current collectors will have someone to sell our paper collectibles to 5 yrs fr now.

On the other hand, American icons like Elvis Presley & Marilyn Monroe seem to never run out of new collectors for movie posters, lobby cards, bubblegum cards, movie memorabilia/costumes , records, signed items, mag covers, etc.

[greggy]

I agree. There are so few dealers who can solely survive on back issues. With no new readership, where will the new buyers of back issues come from. Like you said, once anything gets cancelled, the demand and prices normally decrease due to the lack of exposure. See how the prices of most mini series decreases once they end regardless of how well drawn or written they are! Also, a majority of comic stores rely on the new readers to pay the bills. Without them, how are they going stay open and supply the back issues?

[clobberintime]

I think the entire back issue market is built on the new reader. In 1972 I was a new reader/collector and I was hooked - I found my smack at age 7! And what I buy now is what I loved then because it reminds me of then. Some of the stupidest prices i have paid have been for bronze age books just because it was the first issue of hulk I bought or something like that. And i believe a lot of folks who collect feel the same - they are buying for nostalgia reasons. i also love to buy the stuff that I could not afford while I was in school all those years. With less new buyers and 100x more preservation now, there will be more high grade books from the last 20 years available - that old supply and demand problem. I sure hope comics continue into the future and maybe all the great video games and movies will spark readership.

[greggy]

Yes, unless the buyers are total investors, most buyers of back issues remember comics from their youth and tend to search out those books when they can afford them when they are older. Take me for example, I just happen to remember more DCs from my youth and certain books specifically. Therefore, that is why I prefer to collect DCs rather than Marvels. It has nothing to do with the relative quality but what my memories of the books on the racks. I have basically bought the few books in high grade that I remember owning when I was much younger. They are not exactly key issues but it brings back good memories when I see the cover. Personally, I haven't read any new comics for years until the Dark Knight series this year but I know that the health of the hobby depends on the new readership!

[comicinvestor-migration]

Yes, unless the buyers are total investors, most buyers of back issues remember comics from their youth

 

This is a basic truth about collectibles and comics in particular. Without any "new blood" coming in, back issues are bound to stagnate at some point in the future.

 

And as we have learned so very hard in the past, you cannot count on the "new investors" to keep the hobby going long-term. Without a real interest in comic collecting and nostalgia, they're just paper in a box, and virtually impossible to hold John Doe Investor's attention for very long.

 

That's why I feel that CGC was in some ways a contrived method for some long-time dealers to cash-out with a bang. CGC could be viewed as the "last gasp" of an industry that is going to hit a downswing in the not-too distant future.

 

I'm not being negative, just realistic. We're all gonna be worm-food someday and from the kids I know, comics will never, ever be a part of their life any more than phograph records would be.

[Rickdogg]

Bronzie,

 

That is exactly what happened with me. As a kid I couldn't afford comic books I wanted, so I just played sports day & night. As I got older, I of course had more money & started making huge purchases on stuff that I have always liked. For example car related items. Last year I started my "real comic collection" because as a kid I couldn't afford all of the expensive items that I couldn't afford as a kid.

[comicinvestor-migration]

Ricky, do you mean that you never bought any comics off the shelf and just suddenly went into a comic shop and bought your first book ever?

[Rickdogg]

No, as a kid I bought stuff off the shelf to read & to keep in HG. Of course the books I bought are all junk now.

[comicinvestor-migration]

Just making sure, as this is quite different from what Bronzie is proposing. Kids don't buy/can't afford comics these days and it's adults that are keeping it afloat.

 

Kids won't be collecting then anymore, but who cares??? ... as they get older (and has more money) and are done with video games they WILL collect comics, if not something else.

 

I don't agree with this, since other than speculator madness (ie. CGC) there is no reason why a non-comic person would suddenly become a hardcore collector. This is spurious logic and it's far more likely that Little Johnny (who's now a VP) would be buying VGGC (Video Game Grading Corporation) 10.0 copies of a rare game cart they used to play as a kid.

 

Whatever these younsters collect when the become adults, it'll be something they enjoyed as kids or have some sort of link to. That takes comics right out of the mix.

[Rickdogg]

True. I really wasn't agreeing or disagreeing with what bronzie said since I didn't really read his whole post I believe that people tend to go back to their childhood & buy stuff that they wanted as kids. That's why I am into GI Joe, transformers, & thundercats.

[Guest]

OK then explain to me antiques, coins and other collectables....

 

If you look at the broad collecting populus, most antique and coin collectors...etc are in their 30-50's. I KNOW these collectors weren't around when the Louis XIV furniture was in style or when Victorian oil lamps were in use or when the ultra rare Liberty head coins were in circulation. But for some reasons these objects are highly prized and are worth hundreds and thousands....and are HIGHLY sought after.

 

 

 

 

[delekkerste]

>>"Whatever these younsters collect when the become adults, it'll be something they

enjoyed as kids or have some sort of link to. That takes comics right out of the mix."

 

I completely agree with that. Which is why I have argued that the comic collecting

hobby has a "graying" problem like other old-fashioned pastimes like stamp and coin

collecting. It is also why I think this Movie Hype speculation is complete and utter

horse&@#$. Little Johnny, after seeing the Spider-Man movie, is far more likely to ask his

parents to buy him the new Spidey video game than he is to start going to the local comic

shop every Wednesday to get his latest Spidey comic fix. And he sure as @#&*$ isn't going

to start saving up $15,000 of allowance money so he can buy a CGC 9.4 copy of ASM #14.

 

By the way, CI, I'm back from my extended European vacation and am ready to rejoin you in

antagonizing the members of this Board. Hoo hahahahahahahahahaha (that's evil maniacal

laughter in case you were wondering).

 

Gene

[delekkerste]

>>"OK then explain to me antiques, coins and other collectables...."

 

I think it is important to distinguish between pop culture items and items with more universal

appeal. Sure, today's coin collectors weren't around when Double Eagles were minted back

before 1933, but who out there can't relate to MONEY? Who out there has never used a POSTAGE

STAMP? What household doesn't have FURNITURE (antique or not)?

 

On the other hand, people have a plethora of pop culture and entertainment options to choose

from, and for many, that does not and has never included comic books. In today's digital age,

the influx of fresh young blood into the comic hobby is a drip, maybe a trickle at best.

 

Gene

[comicinvestor-migration]

OK then explain to me antiques, coins and other collectables....

 

Okay, here's a capsule guide for you:

 

Many of the longest term antiques/collectibles also have an ACTUAL USE. I have relatives that collect valuable antique furniture, but it is also (gasp) used on special occasions, or is at least on display in the form of cabinets or curios.

 

It's the same with antique cars. Unfortunately I don't own one, but I have friends that do, and they still take that puppy out on the odd weekend and tool around.

 

Comics, as many non-collectors will tell you, are basically a pile of paper with no real use other than reading. If you really want to read ASM #1, then pick up one of the myriad reprints for 50-cents and you're set. I don't think anyone would be willing to sell me a fully-functioning antique car or Victorian cabinet knock-off for 50-cents.

 

Comics, like coins and sportscards, count on collectors who have a deep passion for their instrinsic value and will feel satisfied with their $20K purchase with it tucked safely away in a vault and probably unseen for years at a time. That's a tough nut to crack, and counts on far more than investment return to make it a go.

 

Now let's look at coins. I go to shows sometimes with older relatives and let me tell you, most of those guys can't get around the showroom floor without mechanical aids. This is a dying hobby, at least for the really valuable items. In a few decades, it'll be the exact same with sportscards, comics and virtually any other collectible that requires passion to collect, yet is ignored by kids.

 

Kids don't experience it in their youth, therefore collecting it has no meaning. On the other hand, that same kid-turned-adult may lay down some serious cash for a classic car to drive to golf matches, or his wife may talk him into an antique dining room set for their house. $20K for an ASM #1? Me no think so.

[comicinvestor-migration]

By the way, CI, I'm back from my extended European vacation and am ready to rejoin you in antagonizing the members of this Board.

 

Welcome back, and it's actually been relatively sedate. I think the depressed prices on 98% of CGC comics (other than the 9.6-9.8 cream of the speculator crop) has them a bit worried.

 

Don't wake the Giant!!

[chrisfuccione]

If your not growing your dying. Any hobby needs new blood to replace people who loose intrest or die off. CHRIS

[Mutantcollector]

Comics, like coins and sportscards, count on collectors who have a deep passion for their instrinsic value

 

I agree with you on this CI, but I also don't think that if kids don't buy comics when they are young, that they won't collect them as adults. Comics, unlike sportcards and coins do not have to rely as much on nostalga for people to develop this passion. I think passion for collecting comics is developed by reading them and it doesn't matter if they start reading them as a kid or an adult. Of course, then you have to ask if adults will start to read them even if they never read them as kids.

[Mister_Comics]

If a person wasn't involved with the collectable item at some point in time in their early age, they won't start collecting for just the sake of collecting it later.

 

Let me explain. My friend use to play around with camera's all the time when we were kids. One day we're at a flea market and he see's this old camera he use to use. So he buys it and that turned him into a collector of cameras. Hes got a bunch of cameras from all ages. Ones he grew up with and old ones before our time. As for me I couldn't care less about buying a old camera. I never was interested in them. Why should I be now.

 

Point is, if a kid never reads a comic, he may never be a collector later in life.

 

I see less kids reading comics. This is why I say the hobby is dying. Right now us old timers are keeping the hobby alive. Once we go I don't think it well last. Unless the comic industry does something to change and gets kids to read comics again.

[comicinvestor-migration]

If a person wasn't involved with the collectable item at some point in time in their early age. They won't start collecting for just the sake of collecting it later.

 

Well said, and I would also add that it's pretty well open game on what effect childhood has on collecting patterns (as your camera example shows) and that we should not think that the "next wave" of collector trends will have anything to do with us.

 

Remember back when you were a kid; did the vast majority of adults think comic collecting was a worthwhile pursuit? Did your Mom or Dad really think they were important or would someday be worth tons of cash? That's the key everyone forgets: comics won't be highly collectible or valuable in the future, mainly because they are now.

 

Remember reading all those "Get Rich on Coins and Stamps" ads your disposable comics? Those were hot then, and it's quite ironic that kids read about them in the next hot collectible. The times are a' changing.

 

If you've got kids, chances are you're looking at (or just threw out) the next big thing (whatever that is) and don't even know it.