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4,104 posts in this topic

To the general collector out there that does not know of this forum, they were oblivious to the story of the Meyers and their techniques. When the first books started surfacing they actually had good sales results. Metro featured them in their auctions. They were a novelty. GA and SA super keys grading 9.4 some even in 9.6. No one had really seen any restored books look so pristine and grade so high before. Plus CBCS was new to the game, opinions hadn't been formed yet. Then more and more copies started showing up, in even higher grades. People stopped showing as much interest and prices took a hit.Today the general collector does not care for these books anymore and those that bought them can't get rid of them, even at rock bottom prices.

Edited by Gotham Kid
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46 minutes ago, Gotham Kid said:

To the general collector out there that does not know of this forum, they were oblivious to the story of the Meyers and their techniques. When the first books started surfacing they actually had good sales results. Metro featured them in their auctions. They were a novelty. GA and SA super keys grading 9.4 some even in 9.6. No one had really seen any restored books look so pristine and grade so high before. Plus CBCS was new to the game, opinions hadn't been formed yet. Then more and more copies started showing up, in even higher grades. People stopped showing as much interest and prices took a hit.Today the general collector does not care for these books anymore and those that bought them can't get rid of them, even at rock bottom prices.

As I'm among the ignorant, can you shed light on what their techniques actually are? Are they using photocopying for example?

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10 minutes ago, Flex Mentallo said:

can you shed light on what their techniques actually are?

Most of it is mentioned by the Meyers themselves in the link Dean supplied (starting page 10)

 

Edited by Gotham Kid
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54 minutes ago, Flex Mentallo said:

As I'm among the ignorant, can you shed light on what their techniques actually are? Are they using photocopying for example?

The primary questionable technique they use is to paint and infill any damaged areas and then essentially though not exactly lacquer over the entire surface. This achieves two goals; hiding the exact nature of the underlying work and giving the surface a perfectly flat appearance with no detectable downgradeable defects.

As far as the photocopy question - the coating hides the work so there is no way of knowing for certain. The restorers say no. CGC says that is one of the reasons they discontinued grading those books.

Edited by MrBedrock
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Re leaf casting and conservation, the examples I've noticed had leaf cast infills with no artwork added on them. I think if the artwork was recreated on the cast parts it would be categorised as restored. If that's right it makes sense - the raw leaf casting is only playing the role of returning structural integrity to the book.

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7 hours ago, MrBedrock said:

Thanks Capt. Obvious. And so has Dean. 

Maybe, but at least he took the effort to explain the reasoning behind his opinion.

If you're aware of facts that would show his reasoning is faulty, or have no different facts but can provide more persuasive reasoning of your own, you should do so.

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7 hours ago, MrBedrock said:
8 hours ago, tth2 said:

I don't know, there's a very strong sheep mentality amongst collectors when it comes to CGC. 

Fortunately there are the enlightened lone wolves like yourself to set straight those who blindly follow the collective company mindset. 

I have no idea why you're directing all this hostility at me.

I was collecting for a long time before CGC came around.  I haven't changed certain of my opinions about comics just because CGC has a different opinion.  I agree with lots of things that CGC says, but it doesn't mean I have to accept everything they say as gospel.  I don't understand why you have a problem with that.

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10 hours ago, MrBedrock said:

It is also completely reversible with no loss of original material. I don't think CGC categorizes leaf casting as conservation but there is definitely an argument to be made that they should.

If there is no CT, they call it conservation. 

9F18D051-54DF-40A0-8058-74E144160DDA.jpeg

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6 hours ago, Gotham Kid said:

To the general collector out there that does not know of this forum, they were oblivious to the story of the Meyers and their techniques. When the first books started surfacing they actually had good sales results. Metro featured them in their auctions. They were a novelty. GA and SA super keys grading 9.4 some even in 9.6. No one had really seen any restored books look so pristine and grade so high before. Plus CBCS was new to the game, opinions hadn't been formed yet. Then more and more copies started showing up, in even higher grades. People stopped showing as much interest and prices took a hit.Today the general collector does not care for these books anymore and those that bought them can't get rid of them, even at rock bottom prices.

FYI I’ve seen cgc grade books with resto by the Meyers. It’s amazing and interesting how a perception of their work has effected the entire market for restored books. It wasn’t long ago when most restorers wanted to make books look NM. With improved techniques and technology, restoration will only continue to improve.

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7 minutes ago, AnkurJ said:

FYI I’ve seen cgc grade books with resto by the Meyers.

Those were their first tryouts before they took things to the next level.

Edited by Gotham Kid
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9 minutes ago, AnkurJ said:

Found a 9.4 from last year 

Detective 33

as per Heritage description:

This is the single highest-graded copy. This artistically accomplished, professionally restored comic book is the product of many hours of intricate artisanship, once unseen on the vintage comic book market. As recently as 2015, extensively restored comic books seldom received grades above 9.0. Higher grades are now seen on the market.

Could CGC have started accepting stuff from the Meyers again ? They probably could if the Meyers worked their art but not to the point of exaggeration. Looks like they found that balance.

Edited by Gotham Kid
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2 hours ago, tth2 said:

I have no idea why you're directing all this hostility at me.

It isn't hostility, Tim. It is derision, laced with skepticism, with a side order of snide.

But I will still respect you in the morning. 

Edited by MrBedrock
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1 hour ago, Gotham Kid said:

Again, how can parts from one book joined to another be considered 'Conservation' ???

 

Yeah...it should definitely be in a green label with the married parts.  Who know's maybe it was a QA mistake.

Ultimately, they do disclose all the work that's been done on the book right there on the label notes so … hard for me to get riled up or think that they're somehow being shady.

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1 hour ago, szav said:

Yeah...it should definitely be in a green label with the married parts.  Who know's maybe it was a QA mistake.

Ultimately, they do disclose all the work that's been done on the book right there on the label notes so … hard for me to get riled up or think that they're somehow being shady.

The labels do carry a market perception beyond the notes though. Married cover or something like Trimming is a “scarlet letter” that will affect the market perception of the Conserved label.

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15 hours ago, MrBedrock said:

I think you are completely wrong in your assumptions, but I won't spend the time to explain why. 

As we all know, there is a world of difference between thinking something and actually knowing something. hm

I am just rather surprised that although you think I am completely wrong, you actually know that I am completely right in terms of my post above.  :baiting:  lol

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