Seeding bins at a convention - how do you do it? 4 4

[FineCollector]

I'm expecting to set up a table for the first time at a small, local con in March.  I don't expect to do it regularly, I just hope to move enough volume that I don't have to do it again for a while!

I'm having trouble pricing the books.  I know what things are worth, and I'd like to price on the low end, but I'm concerned about the dealers coming in and clearing out the bins before the doors open.  I know I should be happy just to make a sale, but I really dislike a few of the local guys.  They price sky high and don't offer deals, so I have no desire to feed them cheap books.  They don't want to develop a reciprocal relationship, they just pick the bones and move on.  The other dealers are decent joes that I have a good relationship with, but those few stinkers spoil it for everyone.  My "favorite" is a guy who lost his wife because he lives like a hoarder for comics.  His house is floor to ceiling boxes of drek in most rooms, because he doesn't sell anything.  He stocks comics at some of the local card stores, and charges 50-100% markup for run filler and keys alike, while complaining no one buys back issues.  He makes money off the weekly books, but he's in debt, so no deals to be had.

The last show attracted a lot of novice collectors, and I hate that the city doesn't have a store with moderately priced back issues.  The locals end up buying anyway for lack of a better option, but it's not healthy for the market.  If I'm going to make space and clear out stuff, I'd like some control over who's getting it, and not just toss it into the air and walk away.  My ideal price is low enough to make customers happy, and high enough to prevent the books from getting vultured early, but that's not easy.  I can always deal down, but if I match the scummy dealer pricing on the sticker, that just makes my small booth unappealing.  I don't have a reputation as a seller, so I'd just be another overpriced jerk.

My strategy will be to forgo the wall of keys, and keep everything in the boxes.  I want people flipping through the bins to have the enjoyment of saying, "oh!  the keys are still in the run!" and give them the joyous feeling that they're getting to an untouched box (even though I've had my paws all over it!).  I'm hoping that'll entice some people to take some issues around the keys, because I'd do the same.  The key collectors are still going pick things out, but that's unavoidable.  Theft is more of a risk with this model, but I don't have anything over $200, so it's worth a shot.

Everyone's display has to be completely set a half hour before doors open, so there's no avoiding dealers fishing around in my stuff before the show starts.  If you seed your bins with deals, do you load them at the beginning of the show and hope they last, or refill as the show goes on?  I can't keep the boxes closed, or show up late, and there's a clause in the contract that selling is open to the public, so I can't tell anyone to go take a hike.  I don't want to ask for trade, because the local vultures don't have anything I want, and if they do, I'll get roasted by their ridiculous markup.

I'm not going to get my way, but I'm wondering what people think anyway.

[RockMyAmadeus]

 

[mysterio]

5 hours ago, FineCollector said:

I'm expecting to set up a table for the first time at a small, local con in March.  I don't expect to do it regularly, I just hope to move enough volume that I don't have to do it again for a while!

I'm having trouble pricing the books.  I know what things are worth, and I'd like to price on the low end, but I'm concerned about the dealers coming in and clearing out the bins before the doors open.  I know I should be happy just to make a sale, but I really dislike a few of the local guys.  They price sky high and don't offer deals, so I have no desire to feed them cheap books.  They don't want to develop a reciprocal relationship, they just pick the bones and move on.  The other dealers are decent joes that I have a good relationship with, but those few stinkers spoil it for everyone.  My "favorite" is a guy who lost his wife because he lives like a hoarder for comics.  His house is floor to ceiling boxes of drek in most rooms, because he doesn't sell anything.  He stocks comics at some of the local card stores, and charges 50-100% markup for run filler and keys alike, while complaining no one buys back issues.  He makes money off the weekly books, but he's in debt, so no deals to be had.

The last show attracted a lot of novice collectors, and I hate that the city doesn't have a store with moderately priced back issues.  The locals end up buying anyway for lack of a better option, but it's not healthy for the market.  If I'm going to make space and clear out stuff, I'd like some control over who's getting it, and not just toss it into the air and walk away.  My ideal price is low enough to make customers happy, and high enough to prevent the books from getting vultured early, but that's not easy.  I can always deal down, but if I match the scummy dealer pricing on the sticker, that just makes my small booth unappealing.  I don't have a reputation as a seller, so I'd just be another overpriced jerk.

My strategy will be to forgo the wall of keys, and keep everything in the boxes.  I want people flipping through the bins to have the enjoyment of saying, "oh!  the keys are still in the run!" and give them the joyous feeling that they're getting to an untouched box (even though I've had my paws all over it!).  I'm hoping that'll entice some people to take some issues around the keys, because I'd do the same.  The key collectors are still going pick things out, but that's unavoidable.  Theft is more of a risk with this model, but I don't have anything over $200, so it's worth a shot.

Everyone's display has to be completely set a half hour before doors open, so there's no avoiding dealers fishing around in my stuff before the show starts.  If you seed your bins with deals, do you load them at the beginning of the show and hope they last, or refill as the show goes on?  I can't keep the boxes closed, or show up late, and there's a clause in the contract that selling is open to the public, so I can't tell anyone to go take a hike.  I don't want to ask for trade, because the local vultures don't have anything I want, and if they do, I'll get roasted by their ridiculous markup.

I'm not going to get my way, but I'm wondering what people think anyway.

You can’t control what people are going to do with stuff they’ve legally purchased, so it’s not really worth the energy to worry about that. That being said, price the books at a level you’ll be happy selling them, to anyone. If you get your price then so be it. When it comes to the dealers that you would prefer not to deal with, just let them know that the sticker is the price whether they buy one book or 20 boxes. That’ll usually dissuade those types, as they want a super discount in my experience. But if they pay your price then take their money and move on. 

Just don’t be surprised when the first guy through the boxes, dealer or regular customer, plucks all those keys and nothing else. It’s the nature of the beast these days. Price them at a level you’re comfortable letting them go. 

[1Cool]

I'd be interested to hear how it goes.  My only doubt will be the general mind set when people don't see a wall full of keys when they approach your booth.  I find a bunch of regular joes don't really look at the keys but I think they like to look at the pretty books and they may just pass on by if you have nothing but long boxes on a couple tables.  Theft is so much easier in the boxes and when you lose 2 or 3 $150 books it can kill a good Con.  The format most full timers use has been developed over decades and although I do believe it can be tweaked I'd stick with the tried and true in this case.

[Murphman13]

9 hours ago, FineCollector said:

I'm expecting to set up a table for the first time at a small, local con in March. 

Everyone's display has to be completely set a half hour before doors open, so there's no avoiding dealers fishing around in my stuff before the show starts.  If you seed your bins with deals, do you load them at the beginning of the show and hope they last, or refill as the show goes on?  I can't keep the boxes closed, or show up late, and there's a clause in the contract that selling is open to the public, so I can't tell anyone to go take a hike.  I don't want to ask for trade, because the local vultures don't have anything I want, and if they do, I'll get roasted by their ridiculous markup.

I'm not going to get my way, but I'm wondering what people think anyway.

Why? Because of the 30 minute rule? As you load in keep the lids on your boxes and cover them with a bed sheet. Once you are fully unloaded and moved your vehicle organize your booth and if anyone asks if they can remove the lids and look tell them you're not open yet, your not organized and would they please come back a little later. You're not lying. If you are still somewhat covered up 30 min before the show opens I doubt anyone will say anything to you as long as you're making an effort to get ready.

There is a downside. You may be protecting yourself from the dealers you don't like but you are also stopping other dealers and collectors with a dealers pass from seeing your stuff. And that may mean lost sales and building relationships with customers you might want to work with in the future.

[Bird]

I have done three local shows and won't do it again without a wall because people just pass you buy or don't look through enough to see the good stuff. Why not just be honest and say to those "bad" dealers that you want to trade but know their prices are too high to make a deak worthwhile or that you have had a hard time making deals with them in the past so best to just move on. Not everyone has to like you! An earlier poster also said to tell them no bulk deals right off the bat, that should work as well.

But I agree, price the books and do not care who buys them, is isn't worth the stress on what should be a fun day for you!

[Artboy99]

to prevent dealers from scooping all the better stuff you simply tell them your booth isn't "open" yet and that you are only open when the show is open. Fellow dealers will have to be at their booths at that time.

Make sure you tape the insides of your boxes: flaps to the outer walls of the box. Common theft method is to pull a desired comic up from the box then put it back in the box but put the comic(s) in between the flap and the wall to the outside of the box and push the comic down. Now the comic is out of your sight and stolen.

[1Cool]

27 minutes ago, Artboy99 said:

to prevent dealers from scooping all the better stuff you simply tell them your booth isn't "open" yet and that you are only open when the show is open. Fellow dealers will have to be at their booths at that time.

Make sure you tape the insides of your boxes: flaps to the outer walls of the box. Common theft method is to pull a desired comic up from the box then put it back in the box but put the comic(s) in between the flap and the wall to the outside of the box and push the comic down. Now the comic is out of your sight and stolen.

I had a dealer use that method at a small local con (NEO Con I believe) and it really didn't do much.  He had a swarm of dealers at his booth at exactly open time and by the time the general public got back to his booth he had sold all the under priced books to dealers or resellers.  I understand the concept of trying to give collectors a deal you really can't 100% distinguish what people will do with a book when they leave so just price your books and say no bulk discount if you want to keep dealer purchases to a minimum.  Steal will get grabbed fast no matter what you do and most of the time those steals will go to other dealers or resellers.

Edited January 9, 2019 by 1Cool

[smithdatura]

11 hours ago, FineCollector said:

I'm expecting to set up a table for the first time at a small, local con in March.

Where and when is this show?  See you're based in Gatineau - could be interested in coming to check it out and say hi if timing works.

[RCheli]

If a dealer wants to pay your price, sell that comic to them. Often, before the show starts is the only time dealers have to go around the room and look at stuff. 

If I have $100 on a comic, does it matter who buys it?

But as others said, some sort of display is necessary. And you don't always have to have the most expensive stuff on there; you just need comics that are going to stop people. One of the books I regularly put up on my wall is Amazing Spider-Man #410. It has a great Carnage cover and really stops people in their tracks. I usually price it at $15-20, depending on how nice the copy is. I have a lot more comics in my individually-priced stock more than $20, but they're not going to stop people from walking around the room.

As far as how you want to price, this is what I do:

$1 boxes (bagged, no boards); $3 boxes (bagged and boards; yellow sticker); $5 boxes (bagged and boards; green sticker); individually priced (bagged and boards; price sticker)

The days of individually pricing boxes and boxes of books are over for me. And you also have to think if you want to maximize how much you can get for any specific comic vs if you want to sell them pretty quickly. I'm more than happy to sell books for $3 and $5 that are worth a lot more

[SOTIcollector]

11 hours ago, FineCollector said:

I'm expecting to set up a table for the first time at a small, local con in March.  I don't expect to do it regularly, I just hope to move enough volume that I don't have to do it again for a while!

I'm having trouble pricing the books.  I know what things are worth, and I'd like to price on the low end, but I'm concerned about the dealers coming in and clearing out the bins before the doors open. 

The last show attracted a lot of novice collectors, and I hate that the city doesn't have a store with moderately priced back issues.  The locals end up buying anyway for lack of a better option, but it's not healthy for the market.  If I'm going to make space and clear out stuff, I'd like some control over who's getting it, and not just toss it into the air and walk away.  My ideal price is low enough to make customers happy, and high enough to prevent the books from getting vultured early, but that's not easy.  I can always deal down, but if I match the scummy dealer pricing on the sticker, that just makes my small booth unappealing.  I don't have a reputation as a seller, so I'd just be another overpriced jerk.

My strategy will be to forgo the wall of keys, and keep everything in the boxes.  I want people flipping through the bins to have the enjoyment of saying, "oh!  the keys are still in the run!" and give them the joyous feeling that they're getting to an untouched box (even though I've had my paws all over it!).  I'm hoping that'll entice some people to take some issues around the keys, because I'd do the same.  The key collectors are still going pick things out, but that's unavoidable.  Theft is more of a risk with this model, but I don't have anything over $200, so it's worth a shot.

Everyone's display has to be completely set a half hour before doors open, so there's no avoiding dealers fishing around in my stuff before the show starts.  If you seed your bins with deals, do you load them at the beginning of the show and hope they last, or refill as the show goes on?  I can't keep the boxes closed, or show up late, and there's a clause in the contract that selling is open to the public, so I can't tell anyone to go take a hike.  I don't want to ask for trade, because the local vultures don't have anything I want, and if they do, I'll get roasted by their ridiculous markup.

I'm not going to get my way, but I'm wondering what people think anyway.

When I see somebody who has no wall books, I assume they have cheap bulk stuff that I'm not interested in, and I move on.  The only thing that would get me to stop is if I could tell at a glance that it's a relatively "unpicked" collection.  Other people may have a different approach; I'm just saying I'd probably spend some money at your booth if I stopped there, but I might not even stop.

Theft can be a concern, especially if you're working solo.  I've started taking a GoPro to shows, and placing it prominently on my wall rack with its wide-angle lens capturing the entire booth.  I like to think it's some sort of a deterrent.  If you have one or something like it, you may want to consider taking it.

Lots of good advice here already:  price the books at prices you're happy with and don't offer a sweetheart bulk deal to the dealers you'd prefer not to sell to.  Set up but leave the tops on the boxes as long as you're allowed.

I'd also suggest not pricing your keys too cheaply.  If your run does get cleaned out of all its keys, you'll have a much tougher time of it if you ever decide to sell the rest of the run in bulk.  You'll end up with only pennies per book for the rest.

Best of luck!  I hope you have a great show, and your books go to the right homes.

 

 

 

[spreads]

I can't wait to plunder your dollar books and have them re-priced in my boxes before the show starts!

[Shawnismaximus]

I've sold at only one convention. I didn't have a wall (I would have liked to have had one, I just didn't have anything available to use as a wall to attach comics to. Any cheap suggestions?). I had 12 longboxes of well organized and labelled comics with a big sign behind them that read "Most comics $1 each". I also had a stand full of Graphic Novels for $5 each (and we're talking Canadian dollars, so that is pretty cheap). I had a box full of Archie digest comics for 50 cents each and a little box full of cool stickers for 25 cents each. A bunch of cool Star Wars pop figures for way cheaper then they sell online. I literally had one guy pick up a Pop figure I was selling and say "You know this is worth like thirty bucks right?" And I said "Oh really, well the sticker says 8 dollars so you can have it for that." then he DIDN'T BUY IT!

Most people walked right past my booth. It was painful to see someone walk past my booth and start digging into someone elses long boxes. I looked around and was literally the best priced vendor at the con but most people skipped right past me. 

Anyways the point of this rant is that I realized I had designed my booth around what I would like out of a vendor. I'm all about cheap dollar books. But that's not what a lot of people want these days. So next time I'm putting up a wall of all the expensive books, bringing less dollar books, and diversifying more into toys, clothing ect. As most people seem to be either casual fans or key hunters. 

 

 

[blazingbob]

1 minute ago, Shawnismaximus said:

I've sold at only one convention. I didn't have a wall (I would have liked to have had one, I just didn't have anything available to use as a wall to attach comics to. Any cheap suggestions?). I had 12 longboxes of well organized and labelled comics with a big sign behind them that read "Most comics $1 each". I also had a stand full of Graphic Novels for $5 each (and we're talking Canadian dollars, so that is pretty cheap). I had a box full of Archie digest comics for 50 cents each and a little box full of cool stickers for 25 cents each. A bunch of cool Star Wars pop figures for way cheaper then they sell online. I literally had one guy pick up a Pop figure I was selling and say "You know this is worth like thirty bucks right?" And I said "Oh really, well the sticker says 8 dollars so you can have it for that." then he DIDN'T BUY IT!

Most people walked right past my booth. It was painful to see someone walk past my booth and start digging into someone elses long boxes. I looked around and was literally the best priced vendor at the con but most people skipped right past me. 

Anyways the point of this rant is that I realized I had designed my booth around what I would like out of a vendor. I'm all about cheap dollar books. But that's not what a lot of people want these days. So next time I'm putting up a wall of all the expensive books, bringing less dollar books, and diversifying more into toys, clothing ect. As most people seem to be either casual fans or key hunters. 

 

 

One of the more "realistic" posts in this thread.  I ask myself do sellers ever take a step outside of themselves,  look at their booth and ask why would a buyer stop there?  Seeding boxes?  Is there a big sign on the wall saying good books are in the boxes?  Don't people realize how lazy most buyers are?  The reason they buy wall books is that they can "SEE THEM".  Nobody has all day to go box diving.  If you are priced fairly then the person will buy more.  What do those boxes look like?  Mylars?  poly bags taped?  Presentation is a lot more then people realize.  How you present your material is sometimes more important to buyers then being the cheapest.  If the books aren't in order,  no grades,  just prices then you are making the buyer work harder.  

[shortboxed]

I keep my short boxes closed until doors open. After that, I don't care if dealers buy from my booth or a con attendee. But I like keeping my full inventory that I painstakingly curated for the show to be available to con attendees.

As a collector, I've been to many shows (often the first one through the doors) only to find that all the "good books" and deals have already been snatched up by dealers during setup.  So this is simply my way of giving the attendees a fair shot at what I think is a nice selection of very fairly priced books. 

[justafan]

I would wait to seed the good stuff until later in the show. go ahead and seed it with a few minor keys for the dealers especially in boxes that appear to not be organized.

then once the show really gets going start seeding it with the better stuff. try not to let the scummy dealers see you but invite the other dealers you like to see what updated goodies you have at the end of the show.

that way if dealers pick you clean it's only the weaker stuff and you may get a bulk deal out of one of the disorganized drek boxes.

as the show goes on and you see folk's picking out the keys you can guage whether or not it's working or if they are only buying keys.  if you see a fan of one run of books buying multiples, you can then offer him some keys from that run from this hidden box you just happen to have been holding back.

as a buyer whose time is worth more than money, I prefer organized long boxes with books that are bagged and boarded.  I hate wasting my time so if books are unbagged/boarded and disorganized I will save you for last which usually means not going to your booth at a large con. at a smaller show I may make it back to you.

Yes, wall books pull me in but if the boxes are a mess I will keep walking. if you have no wall books but instead have clearly labeled alphanumerically organized boxes that don't look like they've been stored in a leaky basement and not overstuffed to the point where I can't dig through without bending or damaging the books then I will stop and rummage through.

[blazingbob]

A Dealer is a "customer" just like everybody else.  Only difference is that I paid for a booth to get in early.  My shopping hours are before the show opens.  I don't have the luxury of shopping during the show hours for long periods of time.  So basically you are losing me as a "customer".  I spend lots of money if the material is priced fairly.  In all of the years I've been doing business dealers outspend retail customers at least 10 - 1.  So that one book you sell to the retail customer you might have sold me 9 others.  Try to put away your "resentment" of all the good deals being gone before you set up on the other side of the table.

The other thing to consider is that when customers are coming to a show there is no "first shot".  Everything is on my website,  the first "shot" guy can go to my website and reserve books long before the show opens.  If the "good deal" is gone it is because you didn't go to my website first.

I don't hide books in boxes.  

The "Seeding good books in boxes game" only works if everyone is "playing" and knows who is doing it.

Edited January 9, 2019 by blazingbob

[Alawson453]

Is already been pointed out earlier and I totally agree, first you need a wall.   My reason is that i don't want keys or semi keys in Excellent condition being handled in a box by someone who is rough and not concerned as to how they handle keys day a book with a really difficult dark cover that shows stress lines easily.  

And people will be more likely to at least stop and view what you have,  at that point if they show interest in a specific book you may be able to suggest other items in your table boxes that might also appeal to them and generate additional sales. 

Lastly, I have found my best area of sales at shows lately to be my bosses that are priced at $3 each or 2 for $5.  These boxes I fill with anything valued from $5-$25 whether it's Silver, Bronze or Modern but it's usually slow moving stuff.   I find the average sale is usually $20-$25 and all I have to do is keep refilling the boxes as new shows come up. 

As I stated at the beginning a lot of what I have written has been said already and from what I have read you really couldn't get any better advice than you can from this room full of experts that most have tried every method saleswise and willing to share with you.

Kudo to all for helping out a fellow dealer!

 

Edited January 9, 2019 by Alawson453
Spelling

[RCheli]

1 minute ago, Alawson453 said:

Lastly, I have found my best area of sales at shows lately to be my bosses that are priced at $3 each or 2 for $5.  These boxes I fill with anything valued from $5-$25 whether it's Silver, Bronze or Modern but it's usually slow moving stuff.   I find the average sale is usually $20-$25 and all I have to do is keep refilling the boxes as new shows come up. 

 

Common Bronze and Copper books do not sell at guide. In fact, you can see those dealers with boxes after boxes of those issues priced at $5-20, and they bring the same stuff every con. I'm more than happy to sell these books at $3 each. You don't make as much profit, but they sell consistently. It's better to make less money now that carry that stock around for two years to make more.

[Alawson453]

2 minutes ago, RCheli said:

Common Bronze and Copper books do not sell at guide. In fact, you can see those dealers with boxes after boxes of those issues priced at $5-20, and they bring the same stuff every con. I'm more than happy to sell these books at $3 each. You don't make as much profit, but they sell consistently. It's better to make less money now that carry that stock around for two years to make more.

What I meant is by the time customers finish going through my $3 boxes they usually end up spending at least $20-$25.