Do creators charge too much for signatures?
3 3

450 posts in this topic

19,311 posts
13 hours ago, Blastaar said:

I bought a superman #50 batman #50 from him at a con that he signed for $100 total, I asked if he could throw a quick remark on it he said "That'll be $300". He looked down at my two little boys on each side of me and drew a batman and superman on them for free. The benefits of bringing children! They are getting older and losing their "cuteness", I need to capitalize while I can!

Or bring along a pretty girl. Works great for baseball players...:banana:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19,930 posts

If they charge too much people will stop paying. If adams charges $50 to sign books and people are paying, I guess it is not too much? A lot of these guys (not so much Adams who I assume is worth several million and can make a living cranking out head sketches at $350 a pop until physically unable) need to make whatever they can while they can. They don't have pensions (not that many do nowadays). I don't blame them one bit. Look at George Perez. Your health can go bad quickly. Soon he will be unable to see what he is drawing. Nursing care is expensive. Assisted living is expensive. An older person who wants to live decently but needs nurses or assisted living can easily spend $10-$15,000 a month depending on their needs. Not to mention his wife. You don't want to be old and broke. A friend of mine's father is a lawyer, 76. Always made a good living, but 3 divorces (he lost the family home each time), alimony, and child support for 2 kids cut into any ability to save. He now has parkinsons and will soon be unable to work. He is looking at having to be roommates with his adult daughter because he cannot afford to live on his own on social security. Getting old sucks.

RMA, dunno why you are confused. You're 46. If you plan on getting old you should think about this stuff if you haven't already. But I suspect you have thought about it. These guys need to make a living somehow. I know it makes getting your SS books more expensive, but that's life. I am not going to begrudge some guy/gal who has created some lasting stuff in pop culture some bucks when ho hum lawyers in my neck of the woods are getting paid $800-$1200 an hour for their time.

 

Edited by the blob

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19,930 posts
1 hour ago, jsilverjanet said:

Does X charge too much for Y

If you have then money no

if you don't then yes

Should Artists charge for a signature? it's up to them if they do, it's up to us if we want to pay it.

The real question that has been asked that I'm sure you branching this thread from, is should creators charge more if the signature is being witnessed for CGC thus becoming a Yellow graded book. The answer is no.

Why should a creator charge someone more if the book is going to be graded? What does it matter to them? Because they think they are missing out on funds? That's silly and has been explained multiple times. a creator who think that they are missing out on funds should just  get their own books graded and sell them direct. Campbell has started selling his variants signed and graded by CGC. If they want the money they should do the work.  

Signature on a book $5 fine

Signature for a graded book $30 INSANE

 

 

Maybe some of them are doing just that? Maybe just not as obviously, maybe through intermediaries? And if they are, your CGC SS books signed by them compete with their's, so why shouldn't they charge more to compensate for that?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
56,033 posts
7 minutes ago, the blob said:

And if they are, your CGC SS books signed by them compete with their's, so why shouldn't they charge more to compensate for that?

Because it's none of their business what someone else does with that someone else's property.

Charging different prices for the exact same service, at the exact same time, in the exact same place, based on nothing more than information which the service provider is not entitled to know is discrimination, as you well know. It is "accepted" because collectors behave like addicts.

Edited by RockMyAmadeus

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49,549 posts

If I do a logo for someone I charge 0.  If I was doing one for a major corporation that they were going to use to make a bundle, I'd charge $5000.  Totally ok to charge diff amounts for diff folks.  Someone getting a raw signed $5.  Slabbed-well they are most likely gonna sell so $100.  

Edited by kav

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19,930 posts
1 minute ago, RockMyAmadeus said:

Because it's none of their business what someone else does with that someone else's property.

Charging different prices for the exact same service, at the exact same time, in the exact same place, based on nothing more than information which the service provide is not entitled to know is discrimination, as you well know. It is "accepted" because collectors behave like addicts.

Your SS book competes with their SS book if they are selling them (or may have plans to sell them down the road) meaning they may get less $ for it. So they charge more. The raw signature does not compete with the SS book in the same way. So they charge less. This is Economics 101. And the "market" seems to be allowing it. I thought you were all about the free market?

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49,549 posts
1 minute ago, the blob said:

Your SS book competes with their SS book if they are selling them (or may have plans to sell them down the road) meaning they may get less $ for it. So they charge more. The raw signature does not compete with the SS book in the same way. So they charge less. This is Economics 101. And the "market" seems to be allowing it. I thought you were all about the free market?

 

 

Yes and the proof that it is ok for them to charge different amounts is they are doing it.  And the cops aren't showing up to stop them.

The end.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
33,312 posts
2 minutes ago, kav said:

If I do a logo for a friend I charge 0.  If I was doing one for a major corporation that they were going to use to make a bundle, I'd charge $5000.  Totally ok to charge diff amounts for diff folks.  Someone getting a raw signed $5.  Slabbed-well they are most likely gonna sell so $100.  

Sure, but those are (sort of) one off scenarios.   You cannot expect creator(s) to know if the guy in line is a "fanboy" or "facilitator".  

The premiums that have been paid by "us" (collectors) for sig series books, well, they noticed that.  So they started charging more for their sigs.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19,930 posts

With that said, do shows pay these guys to come and sign? If part of your $50 a day price for commiccon is paying all this talent to show up I understand why it is annoying to be charged an arm and a leg for it when these sigs used to be free.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49,549 posts
Just now, chrisco37 said:

Sure, but those are (sort of) one off scenarios.   You cannot expect creator(s) to know if the guy in line is a "fanboy" or "facilitator".  

The premiums that have been paid by "us" (collectors) for sig series books, well, they noticed that.  So they started charging more for their sigs.  

Sorry I edited my comment-not just for friends but anyone asks me I will draw for free.  If it's a big money maker then I charge.  Not really a one off as I have done hundreds of these things.  True the creator cant always know but in cases where they do know-ok to charge more.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
56,033 posts
3 minutes ago, the blob said:

Your SS book competes with their SS book if they are selling them (or may have plans to sell them down the road) meaning they may get less $ for it. So they charge more. The raw signature does not compete with the SS book in the same way. So they charge less. This is Economics 101. And the "market" seems to be allowing it. I thought you were all about the free market?

This is not correct, for all sorts of reasons. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49,549 posts
1 minute ago, the blob said:

With that said, do shows pay these guys to come and sign? If part of your $50 a day price for commiccon is paying all this talent to show up I understand why it is annoying to be charged an arm and a leg for it when these sigs used to be free.

 

They used to be free till people started using the free stuff to line their pockets.  Creators, as would any one, said 'wait a minute-'

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19,930 posts
1 minute ago, chrisco37 said:

Sure, but those are (sort of) one off scenarios.   You cannot expect creator(s) to know if the guy in line is a "fanboy" or "facilitator".  

The premiums that have been paid by "us" (collectors) for sig series books, well, they noticed that.  So they started charging more for their sigs.  

Fanboys have financial issues too and wind up selling stuff they didn't want to sell. A creator has to assume it will eventually hit the market. I didn't want to sell my SA keys 10-15 years ago. I planned on keeping them a lot longer. When I bought most of them I thought I would always have the kind of income where I never needed to sell any good books,  but life got in the way. I would have been better off keeping almost all of them.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49,549 posts
2 minutes ago, the blob said:

Fanboys have financial issues too and wind up selling stuff they didn't want to sell. A creator has to assume it will eventually hit the market. I didn't want to sell my SA keys 10-15 years ago. I planned on keeping them a lot longer. When I bought most of them I thought I would always have the kind of income where I never needed to sell any good books,  but life got in the way. I would have been better off keeping almost all of them.

 

You beat me to it.  Creators can go 'ok I dont know if this is a fanboy or flipper.  Hell with it I'll just charge everyone $50 from now on'.  Then if he sees a known flipper- $100.

Edited by kav

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19,930 posts
1 minute ago, RockMyAmadeus said:

This is not correct, for all sorts of reasons. 

Because you say so? Anyway, this might be the third time we have engaged in this same debate so I am tuning out. I am perplexed how a guy who is in favor of $2 an hour wages in the USA if that is what the market will bear is enraged by guys charging what the market will allow for totally unnecessary luxury stuff. If you feel that it is unfair that you as a pure collector get charged a flipper premium for a SS book then befriend these creators and let them know you're different so that you should get the non-CGC rate. Admittedly, you have an uphill battle, but I am sure Kav will happily charge you his non-CGC rate!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49,549 posts

The flippers have squeezed out the fanboys, to some extent.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49,549 posts
1 minute ago, the blob said:

Because you say so? Anyway, this might be the third time we have engaged in this same debate so I am tuning out. I am perplexed how a guy who is in favor of $2 an hour wages in the USA if that is what the market will bear is enraged by guys charging what the market will allow for totally unnecessary luxury stuff. If you feel that it is unfair that you as a pure collector get charged a flipper premium for a SS book then befriend these creators and let them know you're different so that you should get the non-CGC rate. Admittedly, you have an uphill battle, but I am sure Kav will happily charge you his non-CGC rate!

I'll draw anything to get people to like me!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19,930 posts
1 minute ago, kav said:

I'll draw anything to get people to like me!

Not so sure about that, but whatever makes you happy. Provided that I am not negatively impacted by it in any way, of course.

Edited by the blob

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49,549 posts
2 minutes ago, the blob said:

Not so sure about that, but whatever makes you happy. Provided that I am not negatively impacted by it in any way, of course.

Well the more people like me, the less like they have available for anyone else so-

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
56,033 posts
3 minutes ago, chrisco37 said:

Sure, but those are (sort of) one off scenarios.   You cannot expect creator(s) to know if the guy in line is a "fanboy" or "facilitator".  

Even if they did, it would still be irrrelevant, because:

1. It's a signature, not work-for-hire. 

2  It's no one's business what someone else chooses to do with their property.

3. The "friend" could use that "logo" and potentially make millions of dollars off of it, while the "corporation" could commission the work, decide it doesn't suit them, and shelve it forever. What someone *may* use it for is none of the service provider's business. 

4. The idea that "they are most likely gonna sell for $100" is no bearing on the conversation, for the reasons stated elsewhere ad nauseum. The "$100" isn't for the signature.

5. No one has a problem with creators signing their friends' books for free. 

The arguments supporting discrimination are all bad ones, and eventually, the addicts will wake up and stop it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
3 3