How many submissions does it take to get to the center of a 9.9 or perfect 10? 2 2

[VintageComics]

The problem is that CGC standards shift.

I've seen 9.8's that should be 9.9's and visa versa.

I've gotten several 9.9's (never a 10.0) and I think I know how to choose them but they seem resistant to giving them out.

[kav]

I remember the oldest SA 10.0 I think it was Thor 156 and I think it was donated by Rozanski after being graded.  The grader interviewed said something like we looked and we just couldn't find the slightest flaw so we gave it a 10.  When a book gets to the upper stratosphere it gets a minute inspection and a lot of attention focused on it.  People may think they have some 10's but maybe CGC inspection is a bit more thorough.

Edited March 13, 2019 by kav

[theCapraAegagrus]

36 minutes ago, kav said:

I remember the oldest SA 10.0 I think it was Thor 156 and I think it was donated by Rozanski after being graded.  The grader interviewed said something like we looked and we just couldn't find the slightest flaw so we gave it a 10.  When a book gets to the upper stratosphere it gets a minute inspection and a lot of attention focused on it.  People may think they have some 10's but maybe CGC inspection is a bit more thorough.

Registration matters, too, right? I don't think they give 9.9s or Gem Mints out to books that aren't perfectly centered. Some may not agree with that practice, but I do. Alignment plays a small part in grading.

[kav]

Just now, TwoPiece said:

Registration matters, too, right? I don't think they give 9.9s or Gem Mints out to books that aren't perfectly centered. Some may not agree with that practice, but I do. Alignment plays a small part in grading.

I have no knowledge of this but it makes sense.  The collecting world is littered with the broken dreams and shattered hopes of people who think their grading skills are equal to CGC and think they get 'unfair grades'.

[90sChild]

1 hour ago, kav said:

I remember the oldest SA 10.0 I think it was Thor 156 and I think it was donated by Rozanski after being graded.  The grader interviewed said something like we looked and we just couldn't find the slightest flaw so we gave it a 10.  When a book gets to the upper stratosphere it gets a minute inspection and a lot of attention focused on it.  People may think they have some 10's but maybe CGC inspection is a bit more thorough.

That's an interesting story.  When I wonder how many modern-age collectors send in their hot off the press books though, it makes me wonder how many of those could even possibly have flaws.  There has got to be people out there picking the very best examples ouf of the shipments of 100+ copies, sending in perfectly centered, no production tears, never even opened books too.  If the 9.9 / 10.0 was really a perfect designation I just think there would be more of them.  Maybe not on silver age books like you say but certainly on moderns.  The issue I have is how inconsistent the whole thing is.  Which makes it unreliable, in my opinion.

[kav]

16 minutes ago, 90sChild said:

That's an interesting story.  When I wonder how many modern-age collectors send in their hot off the press books though, it makes me wonder how many of those could even possibly have flaws.  There has got to be people out there picking the very best examples ouf of the shipments of 100+ copies, sending in perfectly centered, no production tears, never even opened books too.  If the 9.9 / 10.0 was really a perfect designation I just think there would be more of them.  Maybe not on silver age books like you say but certainly on moderns.  The issue I have is how inconsistent the whole thing is.  Which makes it unreliable, in my opinion.

My LCS buddy says they are rare because books get printed, they get handled, they are put in a box with not a whole lot of care, they are not specially packed and get jostled in shipping.  The slightest jostle can put minute dings on spine of an entire stack.  As for the people who think they have all these 9.9 and 10.0's in their collection they are just looking at their books and coming to that determination.  What CGC does, on the other hand is have 2 or 3 people, more if it might be a 9.8 and up candidate, examine the books.  3 heads are better than one they say.

[lonetree]

508 Submissions = (4) 9.9's = .08%

[kav]

If CGC gave out 9.9 and 10.0 and even 9.8 the way people wanted, they wouldnt be especially rare or valuable and the whole point of wanting them would vanish.  If there were pages of 10.0 for every modern on ebay they wouldnt sell for much.  There would be no WOW factor in a 9.9 or 10.0.  It would then be a so what factor.  
Be careful wut you wish for.

[RockMyAmadeus]

2 hours ago, 90sChild said:

That's an interesting story.  When I wonder how many modern-age collectors send in their hot off the press books though, it makes me wonder how many of those could even possibly have flaws.  There has got to be people out there picking the very best examples ouf of the shipments of 100+ copies, sending in perfectly centered, no production tears, never even opened books too.  If the 9.9 / 10.0 was really a perfect designation I just think there would be more of them.  Maybe not on silver age books like you say but certainly on moderns.  The issue I have is how inconsistent the whole thing is.  Which makes it unreliable, in my opinion.

You're not wrong. 

I was at a con in San Diego on Sunday, and overheard a couple of dealers say "oh, yeah, you can't get a 9.9 or 10 unless you just send it directly from the printer to CGC."

I chuckled to myself, and didn't bother to correct them. Obviously, that's not true.

It is true that many, many, many people don't check their books as thoroughly as CGC might.

It's also true that CGC does not give out those grades as often as plain ol' statistical distribution suggests they should. This does not mean, as someone in upper management at CBCS thought I was saying, that there is some sort of "quota." It simply means that, looking at the distribution of grades, the 9.9s and 10s are clearly, obviously artificially low. 

[kav]

That post made me chuckle to myself.

[HighRadArt]

Just read a description on feebay for a book that made me chuckle as well.

9.8 NM/M Beautiful book with a touch of rust on the staples. 

I have to admit I had a similar MA book that was hammered (9.2 I think).  Had to look at the graders notes because I couldn't find the flaw. "Rust on bottom staple" 

[Darkowl]

Out of all the times I've submitted modern books to CGC, not once have I ever recieved anything higher than a 9.8. 

The very first comic I ever submitted was a Walking Dead 1. I bought it when they first hit the shelves, and I immediately bagged/boarded it, and I don't think I ever read it. It was honestly the nicest looking book I'd ever seen, basically flawless. It came back as a 9.8, but I was still happy about that.

Btw, this is the only 9.9 in my collection, and the only 9.9 I've ever seen in person. It doesn't look any better than the Walking Dead 1 I had. Would love to see a 10 in person for comparison sake.

 

[kav]

3 minutes ago, Darkowl said:

Out of all the times I've submitted modern books to CGC, not once have I ever recieved anything higher than a 9.8. 

The very first comic I ever submitted was a Walking Dead 1. I bought it when they first hit the shelves, and I immediately bagged/boarded it, and I don't think I ever read it. It was honestly the nicest looking book I'd ever seen, basically flawless. It came back as a 9.8, but I was still happy about that.

Btw, this is the only 9.9 in my collection, and the only 9.9 I've ever seen in person. It doesn't look any better than the Walking Dead 1 I had. Would love to see a 10 in person for comparison sake.

 

Wow whats the value of a book like that?

[ADAMANTIUM]

2 minutes ago, kav said:

Wow whats the value of a book like that?

Lol I remember that book going for and set around $2,000 + a couple of years ago... I wonder what it is now too

6 minutes ago, Darkowl said:

Out of all the times I've submitted modern books to CGC, not once have I ever recieved anything higher than a 9.8. 

The very first comic I ever submitted was a Walking Dead 1. I bought it when they first hit the shelves, and I immediately bagged/boarded it, and I don't think I ever read it. It was honestly the nicest looking book I'd ever seen, basically flawless. It came back as a 9.8, but I was still happy about that.

Btw, this is the only 9.9 in my collection, and the only 9.9 I've ever seen in person. It doesn't look any better than the Walking Dead 1 I had. Would love to see a 10 in person for comparison sake.

 

In all fairness I know where your coming from, I've submitted straight off the shelve once on 2 books, one was 9.6 and the other 9.8.

While a 9.8, 9.9, & and 10 might look the same side by side in a slab, the insides count toward the grade too

I've often thought that may be why some of my books come back lower because there were pinholes inside

[kav]

18 minutes ago, ADAMANTIUM said:

Lol I remember that book going for and set around $2,000 + a couple of years ago... I wonder what it is now too

In all fairness I know where your coming from, I've submitted straight off the shelve once on 2 books, one was 9.6 and the other 9.8.

While a 9.8, 9.9, & and 10 might look the same side by side in a slab, the insides count toward the grade too

I've often thought that may be why some of my books come back lower because there were pinholes inside

I always wondered wut would happen if someone carefully used a pen to change an I to a T on several words on the inside.  Grader would have to read the book to catch something like this!  Or wut about color touch on the inside-it would take forever to cheque every book 4 that!

Edited March 14, 2019 by kav

[ADAMANTIUM]

1 minute ago, kav said:

I always wondered wut would happen if someone carefully used a pen to change an I to a T on the inside.  Grader would have to read the book to catch something like this!

That's what I originally thought cgc did

But that can't be but idk, I think they do that kind of research outside of grading to just research what is known... but like I said idk

[Mercury Man]

On 3/12/2019 at 3:59 PM, wolverine180 said:

Just send in some batwangs for 9.9s and 10.0s

The grader must have been looking long and hard at those to find a perfect 10.....(see what I did there).

[ADAMANTIUM]

Like do they check for these 9.8/9.6/9.4 comics for fingerprints or finger bends on the inside before they grade?

[Mercury Man]

9.9 is such a useless grade.  Oh it's almost perfect butttttt....... (that is what your 9.8 should be for then, since millions of your graded books come out 9.8, especially moderns. 

[DavidTheDavid]

CVA is where I'd place my suspicions. It seems that they would have competing interests. On the one hand, to have any integrity they need to adhere to some standards, which seems even more opaque than CGC's shifting standards. On the other hand, if someone submits a stack of slabs and you want to appease that customer, you're going to make sure they get at least one sticker. All conjecture of course, but it's another turn-off to me.