Avengers: Endgame SPOILERS 1 1

[Prince Namor]

If I’m a producer and I have a choice between making another Ant-man movie or a solo Wasp movie vs a new MCU X-men movie... it’s no contest. 

[Prince Namor]

1 minute ago, Bosco685 said:

Oh, I agree. And fans of the X-Men are going to expect to see some of these characters show up.

I just felt it was a miscategorization of what Kevin Feige said about the X-Men films and characters.

👍

[bb8]

7 hours ago, MYNAMEISLEGION said:

I didn't bring up BP and DS as they will hopefully continue their 3 picture arc, but they will tell their own stories more likely, and not build up to a Team like the Avengers Intitiative did.  Antman/Wasp will get their 3rd act. Not sure if they stick around past that. Just being practical, Rudd is 50, Cheadle is old, War Machine is likely done. Not to mention, who's gonna be upgrading all this IM style tech without Stark? Prof Hulk might stick around for bit.  IfF they did introduce Silver Surfer, you've a lot closer to the early Defenders Roster, and with Valkyrie to boot.  The Defenders non-team concept fits better with the less tightly affiliated remaining MCU characters than the Avengers concept in the absence of Cap, Thor, IM.  Those are the only 3 characters that never did a stint with the Defenders. I agree Silver Surfer would be a tough solo film, unless they really went serious with some sort of space opera type story.

I think we might be underestimating just how 'lightning in a bottle' this run ending with Endgame has been. RDJ anchoring as Iron Man can't be overstated. Hemsworth's and Evan's development also. I think Endgame may end up being the highwater mark of the super-hero genre. I just don't see this continuing as successfully with the heavy hitters leaving. Thor is left. That's about it. I'm not sure if I can see Brie Larson, Boseman or even Cumberbatch headlining the MCU going forward. We have to remember that the MCU has been the exception rather than the rule with movie franchises. Most others have fallen flat. Continuing at the same pace seems, to me, impossible.

That said, I don't think it's doomed. I just don't know if we'll ever see anything at this level again. It's unprecedented.

[Prince Namor]

19 minutes ago, bb8 said:

I think we might be underestimating just how 'lightning in a bottle' this run ending with Endgame has been. RDJ anchoring as Iron Man can't be overstated. Hemsworth's and Evan's development also. I think Endgame may end up being the highwater mark of the super-hero genre. I just don't see this continuing as successfully with the heavy hitters leaving. Thor is left. That's about it. I'm not sure if I can see Brie Larson, Boseman or even Cumberbatch headlining the MCU going forward. We have to remember that the MCU has been the exception rather than the rule with movie franchises. Most others have fallen flat. Continuing at the same pace seems, to me, impossible.

That said, I don't think it's doomed. I just don't know if we'll ever see anything at this level again. It's unprecedented.

Probably not. But with a dip in box office from Age of Ultron there was a point half way thru where everyone thought ‘super hero fatigue’ has set in and people were growing tired of all of this and where could they go from here, etc., so...

Safe bet is to wait another 8-10 years to see.  Whole new group of young fans coming of age, growing up with a new generation of heroes... you never know. 

[MyNameIsLegion]

16 minutes ago, bb8 said:

I think we might be underestimating just how 'lightning in a bottle' this run ending with Endgame has been. RDJ anchoring as Iron Man can't be overstated. Hemsworth's and Evan's development also. I think Endgame may end up being the highwater mark of the super-hero genre. I just don't see this continuing as successfully with the heavy hitters leaving. Thor is left. That's about it. I'm not sure if I can see Brie Larson, Boseman or even Cumberbatch headlining the MCU going forward. We have to remember that the MCU has been the exception rather than the rule with movie franchises. Most others have fallen flat. Continuing at the same pace seems, to me, impossible.

That said, I don't think it's doomed. I just don't know if we'll ever see anything at this level again. It's unprecedented.

I very much agree here- and I also believe Disney is content to play the long game - there is no rush to replace Wolverine or bring in the X-men. Disney did not buy Fox for their Marvel movies rights, not even a blip on the balance sheet. They are going to hopefully do some cloud seeding of new characters and storylines like they did in phase 1. They may not break a billion dollars for the next couple of years but they will still be making money. 

[valiantman]

39 minutes ago, bb8 said:

I think we might be underestimating just how 'lightning in a bottle' this run ending with Endgame has been. RDJ anchoring as Iron Man can't be overstated. Hemsworth's and Evan's development also. I think Endgame may end up being the highwater mark of the super-hero genre. I just don't see this continuing as successfully with the heavy hitters leaving.

While there have been similar statements made before and here we are with a super-hero movie larger than any of the prior "nothing will be bigger than..." proclamations, I'm inclined to agree. There are two major things that future super-hero movies would have to overcome that seem impossible to replicate:

1) This is the 2nd half of a "cliff-hanger" movie that was 21-movies-in-the-making.  Even if we had another improbable string of 21-in-a-row-build-up, it would still be "been there, done that" for a future 22nd-big-finale super-hero movie.

2) The arguments for and against "virtue signaling" and "more diversity" are basically irrelevant because Endgame DID provide representation (in some form) for those looking for it. Combine the fact that this is a "win" for all categories of people/heroes with the 22nd-in-a-line argument from 1) above and you're going to have another example of "been there, done that" for signaling/diversity in future movies.

All-time "highest" movies like Gone With The Wind, Star Wars (1977), Titanic, Avatar, etc., (the list: https://www.imdb.com/list/ls026442468/ ) only achieve(d) the highest-heights by being a "perfect storm" of a number of things that don't repeat for that genre/generation afterward.

Edited May 1, 2019 by valiantman

[zosocane]

55 minutes ago, bb8 said:

I think we might be underestimating just how 'lightning in a bottle' this run ending with Endgame has been. RDJ anchoring as Iron Man can't be overstated. Hemsworth's and Evan's development also. I think Endgame may end up being the highwater mark of the super-hero genre. I just don't see this continuing as successfully with the heavy hitters leaving. Thor is left. That's about it. I'm not sure if I can see Brie Larson, Boseman or even Cumberbatch headlining the MCU going forward. We have to remember that the MCU has been the exception rather than the rule with movie franchises. Most others have fallen flat. Continuing at the same pace seems, to me, impossible.

That said, I don't think it's doomed. I just don't know if we'll ever see anything at this level again. It's unprecedented.

Excellent post.  But I will reach the opposite conclusion.  Expect even better from the MCU for 2020 leading to 2029, which will likely culminate with the Secret Wars (1984) saga -- which the Russo brothers have recently said they very much want to do.  Feige & Co know that their formula works, and now they will perfect it and push the envelope in new ways over the next 10 years.  So what do they have to work with over the next 10 years?  Thor (Hemsworth), Hulk (Ruffalo), Black Panther (Boseman), Strange (Cumberbatch) and Captain Marvel (Larson) will provide a solid base of star power.  After Endgame, audiences care about these characters/actors more than ever before.  MCU left a big door open with the original Cap (Evans) going back to what should be WWII.  Meaning there's no reason Evans won't come back for one WWII-era film to anchor the Invaders as a way to get NAMOR introduced into the MCU.  Audiences will go bananas when they see Namor.  And as for introducing new characters, let's see what Feige has in the cupboard to play with:  DR. DOOM.  The FANTASTIC FOUR (the Human Torch and the Thing will be big audience draws -- I will cry tears of joy when Hulk fights the Thing (it WILL happen).  The INHUMANS, done correctly (can you imagine audiences' reaction over Black Bolt on the big screen?).  ANNIHILUS and the Negative Zone.  GALACTUS.  Did I say Galactus?  Galactus will cause audiences to forget about Thanos very, very quickly.  The SILVER SURFER.  All this, without even getting into some team called the X-MEN.  Or WOLVERINE.  And you know that somewhere, CHANG CHI is going to be complemented by IRON FIST and LUKE CAGE.  More celestial stuff?  The ELEMENTALS.  NOVA and ADAM WARLOCK.  Because Thor seems to be a new Guardian (or Asgardian) of the Galaxy.  I can go on and on.  Will Marvel Studios find actors with the gravitas of Downey or the respect that Evans now commands?  I think so.  We remember when Evans was cast as Cap, and there were more than a few raised eyebrows.  No one had heard of Hemsworth; look at him now.  Look at how a terrific actor like Cumberbatch took on the Dr. Strange role, which tells us how Marvel Studios is an absolute powerhouse in terms of commanding top-actor respect ... and cutting big checks.  Remember really good actor Ed Norton doing the 2008 Hulk film, just a few months after Iron Man I?  He's off the radar now.  I'm sure Norton regrets how he handled himself before the studio 10 years ago.  Anyway, I can go on and on, but there is a massive, massive arsenal for Feige to tap into, and new actors will fill many of these roles, and become legendary for it.  So, 10 years from now, it's going to be the end of another mega-epic ride.

 

[ExNihilo]

8 minutes ago, zosocane said:

Excellent post.  But I will reach the opposite conclusion.  Expect even better from the MCU for 2020 leading to 2029, which will likely culminate with the Secret Wars (1984) saga -- which the Russo brothers have recently said they very much want to do.  Feige & Co know that their formula works, and now they will perfect it and push the envelope in new ways over the next 10 years.  So what do they have to work with over the next 10 years?  Thor (Hemsworth), Hulk (Ruffalo), Black Panther (Boseman), Strange (Cumberbatch) and Captain Marvel (Larson) will provide a solid base of star power.  After Endgame, audiences care about these characters/actors more than ever before.  MCU left a big door open with the original Cap (Evans) going back to what should be WWII.  Meaning there's no reason Evans won't come back for one WWII-era film to anchor the Invaders as a way to get NAMOR introduced into the MCU.  Audiences will go bananas when they see Namor.  And as for introducing new characters, let's see what Feige has in the cupboard to play with:  DR. DOOM.  The FANTASTIC FOUR (the Human Torch and the Thing will be big audience draws -- I will cry tears of joy when Hulk fights the Thing (it WILL happen).  The INHUMANS, done correctly (can you imagine audiences' reaction over Black Bolt on the big screen?).  ANNIHILUS and the Negative Zone.  GALACTUS.  Did I say Galactus?  Galactus will cause audiences to forget about Thanos very, very quickly.  The SILVER SURFER.  All this, without even getting into some team called the X-MEN.  Or WOLVERINE.  And you know that somewhere, CHANG CHI is going to be complemented by IRON FIST and LUKE CAGE.  More celestial stuff?  The ELEMENTALS.  NOVA and ADAM WARLOCK.  Because Thor seems to be a new Guardian (or Asgardian) of the Galaxy.  I can go on and on.  Will Marvel Studios find actors with the gravitas of Downey or the respect that Evans now commands?  I think so.  We remember when Evans was cast as Cap, and there were more than a few raised eyebrows.  No one had heard of Hemsworth; look at him now.  Look at how a terrific actor like Cumberbatch took on the Dr. Strange role, which tells us how Marvel Studios is an absolute powerhouse in terms of commanding top-actor respect ... and cutting big checks.  Remember really good actor Ed Norton doing the 2008 Hulk film, just a few months after Iron Man I?  He's off the radar now.  I'm sure Norton regrets how he handled himself before the studio 10 years ago.  Anyway, I can go on and on, but there is a massive, massive arsenal for Feige to tap into, and new actors will fill many of these roles, and become legendary for it.  So, 10 years from now, it's going to be the end of another mega-epic ride.

I think this is an overly optimistic view of the situation.  There's no denying that Marvel lucked out with RDJ, Hemsworth, and Evans.  Each came with their own question marks.  Can RDJ overcome his troubled reputation?  Is the guy who's only notable movie was a 5 minute clip as Kirk's father REALLY gonna be Thor?  Chris Evans, the goofball is supposed to be Cap?  Does he have the authority to stand up to a star like RDJ?  Like, I said, we thankfully got lucky that these guys all developed into the roles on screen.  And just as important to me, that they developed outstanding personalities off screen.  RDJ IS Tony Stark.  Chris Evans IS Captain America.  If we're really honest with ourselves, I don't see Benedict Cumberbatch being nearly as marketable on and off screen.  Brie Larson is growing on me with her press tour, but the on screen character leaves A LOT to be desired.

And why do people keep insisting on the 1984 Secret Wars?  Hickman's Secret Wars is a far more compelling story that can be more easily adapted to screen.  I think Eternals (not Elementals, whatever that is) is going to further develop the cosmic universe that the Guardians have started.  Nova will certainly make an appearance.  But I wouldn't expect the Inhumans to make an appearance...not after the god awful TV failure.  The key to all of this is finding actors that truly embody the characters.  Without charismatic actors/characters, casuals won't care as much.  The movies would still be profitable, but you're not looking at $1B without them.  And yes, I've seen people point to the success of Black Panther and Captain Marvel.  These were one off's that were spurred on because of the social conversation that came out of it.  I know so many casual moviegoers who were never really interested in comic movies who saw Black Panther because "everyone was talking about it."  And the same with Captain Marvel.  (Honestly, those groups that flooded Rotten Tomatoes to downvote those movies actually helped increase the number of viewers)

Will Marvel pursue another connected story?  Yes.  Will it happen soon?  No.  This is something that will be built up again, first by developing characters that we are attached to, and then through interconnected stories.  How successful the new climax turns out to be though is entirely dependant on those actors and how likeable they are in the eyes of moviegoers.  And if for whatever reason, those first few movies fall flat out of the gate...expect that connected story to get pushed back.  You do it right, or you don't do it at all.

[@therealsilvermane]

1 hour ago, MYNAMEISLEGION said:

They are going to hopefully do some cloud seeding of new characters and storylines like they did in phase 1. They may not break a billion dollars for the next couple of years but they will still be making money.

But they've been doing just that for the past few years already! As far as cloud seeding, GOTG Vol 2 teased Adam Warlock and there's still the question of Rocket's origin. Ant-Man and the Wasp gave us a closer look at the Quantum Realm. Black Panther introduced vibranium. Captain Marvel opened up the galaxy maybe even more than GOTG did. Multi-dimensions were only touched upon in Doctor Strange. Endgame left as many loose ends as were tied. What's in Thor's future? Where is Gamora? How is Gamora? Will Sam Wilson be able to live up to wielding the Shield? What about Vision? Will there be an Avengers team after all this?

And everybody(exaggerating) is saying the sky's falling because Tony Stark is dead/RDJ is out or Cap/Chris Evans is retired. I bet Kevin Feige ain't sweating. Four of the past five non-Avengers MCU movies made near a billion or well over. And know what? In none of them was I thinking "wow, this movie would be so much better if Robert Downey Jr or Chris Evans showed up to crash the party." Thor Ragnarok, Black Panther, Captain Marvel, and the Guardians were able to carry their own story without an assist from "the anchors of the MCU" so-called. And none of those movies had anything to do with Thanos trying to get an Infinity Stone, either. But, the one non-Avengers movie, Spiderman Homecoming, that did get an assist from Tony Stark and Steve Rogers, was okay, but didn't necessarily hit it out of the park, didn't make a billion dollars, and I'm not sure I'd even call it the best Spider-Man movie, though Tom Holland is great and has starry eyed high school kid locked down.

As far as I see it, the MCU's future is solidified. And I'm not talking about long time comic book readers, but the rest of the world. As Tony Stark said in Endgame, "We need new blood." They have it, and there's more in the bank. All they have to do is keep making compelling movies. As long as Feige and other equally competent people are at the forefront, I don't see any reason why they won't. 

Make mine Marvel.

[ExNihilo]

4 minutes ago, @therealsilvermane said:

And everybody(exaggerating) is saying the sky's falling because Tony Stark is dead/RDJ is out or Cap/Chris Evans is retired. I bet Kevin Feige ain't sweating. Four of the past five non-Avengers MCU movies made near a billion or well over. And know what? In none of them was I thinking "wow, this movie would be so much better if Robert Downey Jr or Chris Evans showed up to crash the party." Thor Ragnarok, Black Panther, Captain Marvel, and the Guardians were able to carry their own story without an assist from "the anchors of the MCU" so-called. And none of those movies had anything to do with Thanos trying to get an Infinity Stone, either. But, the one non-Avengers movie, Spiderman Homecoming, that did get an assist from Tony Stark and Steve Rogers, was okay, but didn't necessarily hit it out of the park, didn't make a billion dollars, and I'm not sure I'd even call it the best Spider-Man movie, though Tom Holland is great and has starry eyed high school kid locked down.

The litmus test will be seeing how well Black Panther 2 and Captain Marvel 2 do now that the whole "omg first Black/female Marvel hero" thing is no longer driving audiences into theaters.  They'll still make bank ($800M+), but will they surpass the $1B by their predecessors?

[@therealsilvermane]

9 minutes ago, ExNihilo said:

The litmus test will be seeing how well Black Panther 2 and Captain Marvel 2 do now that the whole "omg first Black/female Marvel hero" thing is no longer driving audiences into theaters.  They'll still make bank ($800M+), but will they surpass the $1B by their predecessors?

What's been driving people to the theaters is first and foremost the Marvel Studios brand. At this point, Marvel could make a Howard the Duck movie and it'd probably make almost a half a billion. Seriously. In the case of Black Panther and Captain Marvel, that was already at least half the box office gross. Fans of the brand. That they were both good movies and got good word of mouth also helped as it does with any flick. But what added even more to that was Disney knowing its audience and potential audience, and catering to underserved demographics of people who go to movies.

With Black Panther, trolls and Comicsgaters cried "SJW!" and "identity politics!", while Disney was looking at a rising population of African American consumers ready to spend money on a Black Panther movie, and with Captain Marvel, they saw a world population of about 8 billion people, half of them women, and a decent percentage of them ready to see a solo female hero in this Marvel universe, even one hardly anyone knew anything about. Both movies were good by simply hiring decent directors, casting well, and following a tried and true Marvel formula. And now the audiences are there for the sequels, cross-over movies, whatever.

These people know what they're doing.

[ExNihilo]

23 minutes ago, @therealsilvermane said:

What's been driving people to the theaters is first and foremost the Marvel Studios brand. At this point, Marvel could make a Howard the Duck movie and it'd probably make almost a half a billion. Seriously. In the case of Black Panther and Captain Marvel, that was already at least half the box office gross. Fans of the brand.

I'm not saying, nor did I imply this wasn't the case.  All I'm saying is that growing and developing this franchise has been a massive undertaking that is equal parts tremendous writing, production, directing, acting, and a bit of luck.  Goodwill takes years to build and for me, it wasn't until Guardians where I was ready to be like "alright, whatever Marvel puts out, I've got faith."  By the same token, it only takes a few flops for that goodwill to disappear.  Who would have ever thought that we'd be in this questionable Star Wars phase?  It only took the failures that were The Last Jedi and Solo to completely scrap the Star Wars Story's they had planned.  The Boba Fett story disappeared and now we're getting a Disney+ show.  Star Wars will continue to be a profit driver and they will most definitely have more movies in the near future, but some missteps did cause them to step back and re-evaluate where they wanted to take the franchise.

Marvel is in that place where they're currently like Pixar in its early years...hit after hit after hit after hit.  And much like Star Wars, the films will continue to make money hand over fist, but i prefer to take the cautiously optimistic approach towards future saga's.

And no matter what anyone says, this journey we've been on from Iron Man to Endgame will not be repeated again.  This is the first time something like this has been put together and it's been simply amazing.  And because it's the first, it will always have that additional emotional memory going for it.  Like, I don't mean Marvel won't do another big arc (they will), it just won't quite elicit the same reaction as Infinity War/Endgame.  It's like seeing a magic trick.  The first time it completely blows your mind.  The second time you're still shocked/amused...but just noooot quite to the same extent.

[234wallst]

MCU will continue to prosper as they long as they keep telling interesting and entertaining stories.  I think they've already proven it's not the starting material that matters (example GotG) - it's what you do with it. 

Fiege/Gunn: Guardians of the Galaxy!

World (Thanos): I don't even know who you are.

Fiege/Gunn (Wanda): Oh you will!

Look at Sony/Fox/WarnerBros having some of the biggest names in the genre at their disposal, yet still faltering in comparison.  One is selling quality, the other is trying to milk an established brand.  Even Star Wars turned off the most loyal fans with 1/2/3/8 (for some throw 7 in there as well).

[JazzMan]

 

[Prince Namor]

1 hour ago, ExNihilo said:

Who would have ever thought that we'd be in this questionable Star Wars phase?

 

We are NOT in a questionable Star Wars phase. Episode 9 will be a Billion Dollar movie. One of only 39 ever made.

1 hour ago, ExNihilo said:

It only took the failures that were The Last Jedi

 

Last Jedi was a Billion Dollar movie. One of only 39 ever made. It was NOT a failure and Disney certainly doesn't consider it a failure.

1 hour ago, ExNihilo said:

and Solo to completely scrap the Star Wars Story's they had planned. The Boba Fett story disappeared and now we're getting a Disney+ show. 

 

They haven't scrapped the majority of what they had planned. Episode 9 comes out this December. Rian Johnson's trilogy is still on. The Weiss and Benioff trilogy is still on. 

1 hour ago, ExNihilo said:

Star Wars will continue to be a profit driver and they will most definitely have more movies in the near future, but some missteps did cause them to step back and re-evaluate where they wanted to take the franchise.

 

They released Solo too early.

1 hour ago, ExNihilo said:

Marvel is in that place where they're currently like Pixar in its early years...hit after hit after hit after hit.  And much like Star Wars, the films will continue to make money hand over fist, but i prefer to take the cautiously optimistic approach towards future saga's.

And no matter what anyone says, this journey we've been on from Iron Man to Endgame will not be repeated again.

2

THIS specifically was not planned from the outset. It grew as it grew.

1 hour ago, ExNihilo said:

  This is the first time something like this has been put together and it's been simply amazing.  And because it's the first, it will always have that additional emotional memory going for it.  Like, I don't mean Marvel won't do another big arc (they will), it just won't quite elicit the same reaction as Infinity War/Endgame.  It's like seeing a magic trick.  The first time it completely blows your mind.  The second time you're still shocked/amused...but just noooot quite to the same extent.

I guess we'll find out in 10 years.

[40sJohn]

5 hours ago, bb8 said:

I think we might be underestimating just how 'lightning in a bottle' this run ending with Endgame has been. RDJ anchoring as Iron Man can't be overstated. Hemsworth's and Evan's development also. I think Endgame may end up being the highwater mark of the super-hero genre. I just don't see this continuing as successfully with the heavy hitters leaving. Thor is left. That's about it. I'm not sure if I can see Brie Larson, Boseman or even Cumberbatch headlining the MCU going forward. We have to remember that the MCU has been the exception rather than the rule with movie franchises. Most others have fallen flat. Continuing at the same pace seems, to me, impossible.

That said, I don't think it's doomed. I just don't know if we'll ever see anything at this level again. It's unprecedented.

This.  Even though I hope it's not what happens.  I agree that they caught lightning in a bottle, mainly with the actor choices.   When Iron Man first hit theaters, I thought "no way" this will be a hit.  In no way, shape or form, did I think that Iron Man was an A-list character worthy of a movie and I collected Iron Man as a kid. However, once I watched the movie on DVD, I thought it was great and that was solely due to RDJ's performance.  He brought the cool factor to the character.  My wife didn't give two craps about superhero movies, except for Batman, until Iron Man and it was mostly because of RDJ. Marvel continued to hit the mark on the actors they selected for Cap, Thor and Black Widow.  All of the actors were just cool.  That is hard to replicate, especially when you are looking to find actors that available for multiple movies over a ten year period.     

What we have to trust is the ability of Feige and others to properly cast the future characters and keep the current ones under long term deals.  Maybe this is just the start.  We all love good stories and when those stories are fashioned together in a overall arc that reveals itself piece by piece, it's attractive.  My guess is that Black Panther is the key.  Marvel tapped into something big with him and the portrayal of Wakanda.  With this arc completed, Marvel has surely earned credibility with casual movie goers, so let's see if extends into some relatively unfamiliar characters.

Edited May 2, 2019 by 40sJohn

[ExNihilo]

6 minutes ago, Chuck Gower said:

We are NOT in a questionable Star Wars phase. Episode 9 will be a Billion Dollar movie. One of only 39 ever made.

If I recall correctly, the original plan was to alternate new episodes and "Star Wars Stories" every other year.  We got episode 7, followed by Rogue One, followed by episode 8, and then Solo.  We were supposed to get a Boba Fett movie and whatever else.  I haven't heard what's on slate for 2020, but the initial plan called for something and if they're going to hit that deadline, they need to get started on it soon.  All I'm saying is that the path isn't as clear as it seemed to be a year ago.  Financially, Star Wars will make money on the strength of its name alone.

Part of the problem is probably on Kathleen Kennedy.  There seems to have been some creative issues during the filming of Rogue One, Solo, and on TLJ.  I think this is why they went back to JJ Abrams to close out the trilogy.  Honestly, the fact that Rian Johnson is getting a trilogy doesn't seem particularly well received amongst fans.

[ExNihilo]

13 minutes ago, Chuck Gower said:

Quote

  This is the first time something like this has been put together and it's been simply amazing.  And because it's the first, it will always have that additional emotional memory going for it.  Like, I don't mean Marvel won't do another big arc (they will), it just won't quite elicit the same reaction as Infinity War/Endgame.  It's like seeing a magic trick.  The first time it completely blows your mind.  The second time you're still shocked/amused...but just noooot quite to the same extent.

I guess we'll find out in 10 years.

I should have been clearer.  If this arc is like a 10, then any future 10 year arc, would be like a 9.9999999.  It could be an amazing story and cast, but the Iron Man to Endgame arc will always have the distinction of being the first to walk this path.

[I like pie]

Agreed Star Wars is in a downturn. I'll probably still see the next one. Couldn't be worse than TLJ.

[Prince Namor]

2 hours ago, ExNihilo said:

If I recall correctly, the original plan was to alternate new episodes and "Star Wars Stories" every other year.  We got episode 7, followed by Rogue One, followed by episode 8, and then Solo.  We were supposed to get a Boba Fett movie and whatever else.  I haven't heard what's on slate for 2020, but the initial plan called for something and if they're going to hit that deadline, they need to get started on it soon.  All I'm saying is that the path isn't as clear as it seemed to be a year ago.  Financially, Star Wars will make money on the strength of its name alone.

1

Disney CEO Bob Iger straight out said it - we put Solo out too soon. We need to put enough space between these projects so that people don't get tired of it. That's the only change of how they're doing it. 

2 hours ago, ExNihilo said:

Part of the problem is probably on Kathleen Kennedy.  There seems to have been some creative issues during the filming of Rogue One, Solo, and on TLJ.  I think this is why they went back to JJ Abrams to close out the trilogy.

 

There are those who WANT very badly to believe that, but the vision of what they've wanted to do with this has been there since she took over and continues on now. They wanted JJ to do all three from the beginning. He just wanted to be free to work on his own projects. They got him back to do the final movie. He has openly praised the -script Rian did for episode 8, particularly Kelly Marie Tran's character Rose Tico. 

2 hours ago, ExNihilo said:

Honestly, the fact that Rian Johnson is getting a trilogy doesn't seem particularly well received amongst fans.

TLJ made over a billion, and Episode 9 will make over a billion - what the vocal minority wants isn't of much interest to the makers of billion dollar movies.