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Avengers: Endgame SPOILERS
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Started by paperheart,

890 posts in this topic

@therealsilvermane

@therealsilvermane

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, ChasingKingKirby said:

Disagree totally.  Where's the star power?   Cap and Iron Man ARE the Avengers.  Don't forget, Thor's gone too.  And so is Natasha and Vision.   We're left with the supporting cast to reform the team.  Ugh.   Outside of Tchalla, you can't support a big budget movie with that crew.  Teenage Spidey is entertaining.  Cap Marvel is way over powered and has the personality of drying paint.  Professor Hulk is annoying and pinning for Nat.  Who leads the new team?  

Sam was absolutely the wrong person to give the shield too.   His gimmick is entertaining and hard to replace.  It also made no sense.   He gives the shield to a guy that's been missing in action for five years that Cap has known for a couple years instead of his lifelong friend that is one of the best hand to hand combat fighters in the MCU?   I just don't get it.

"Lord, you give them eyes but they cannot see." - Gene Hackman, 1978

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theCapraAegagrus

theCapraAegagrus

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1 minute ago, Bosco685 said:

What the Red Skull noted to Thanos in Infinity War was the following: "The Stone demands a sacrifice. In order to take the Stone, you must lose that which you love. The Soul... for a soul."

 

To sacrifice something, I would think you have to consciously give something. Not that person falling on a sword to help you unconsciously make that decision because you can't do it yourself. Then that isn't a sacrifice.

The universe/Vormir/Celestials accepted the "sacrifice". Get over it!

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Bosco685

Bosco685

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Just now, TwoPiece said:

The universe/Vormir/Celestials accepted the "sacrifice". Get over it!

It isn't consistent with the setup from Infinity War what was required. So 'get over it' is kind of a weak discussion point.

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theCapraAegagrus

theCapraAegagrus

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Just now, @therealsilvermane said:

"Lord, you give them eyes but they cannot see." - Gene Hackman, 1978

Feige told us a long time ago that he likes The Avengers because they "rotate rosters".

Iron Man and Cap are not The Avengers.

Spider-Man, Doctor Strange, Ant-Man, Black Panther, etc are tons of "star power" for future Avengers films.

And, Thor isn't gone. He has the friggin' Bifrost in Stormbreaker.

I guess your quote makes more sense than trying to show them the light...

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theCapraAegagrus

theCapraAegagrus

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Just now, Bosco685 said:

It is.

Murder is more sacrificial than suicide?

"The center of Celestial life" makes me think that they decide what is or is not a "sacrifice". Red Skull could simply not understand the correct English words to convey. He is German, after all.

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Antpark

Antpark

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5 minutes ago, TwoPiece said:

What the Red Skull noted to Thanos in Infinity War was the following: "The Stone demands a sacrifice. In order to take the Stone, you must lose that which you love. The Soul... for a soul." 

If we want to get pedantic and parse words:

"The Stone demands a sacrifice" - Natasha sacrificed herself

"In order to take the Stone, you must lose that which you love." Clint certainly loved Natasha

"The Soul ... for a soul." Natasha's soul was the price paid for the Soul stone to come into being.

Clint was able to take it afterwards because of the love and loss he felt from Natasha sacrificing herself. 

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Bosco685

Bosco685

Posted
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1 minute ago, TwoPiece said:

Murder is more sacrificial than suicide?

"The center of Celestial life" makes me think that they decide what is or is not a "sacrifice". Red Skull could simply not understand the correct English words to convey. He is German, after all.

:roflmao:

You anti-German you.

:baiting:

You're just mad Captain Marvel didn't fight all the battles.

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theCapraAegagrus

theCapraAegagrus

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I would argue that if you think there are "many plot holes", then you need to see the movie again.

There would appear to be at least a couple of branches in time, created by specific "time-altering" actions, but there aren't really any seemingly true "plot holes".

The obviously new branches in time:

  • Loki possessing the Tesseract.
  • 2014 Thanos and Co. from 2014.
  • Cap remaining in 1970.

Do all of these instances exist in only one branch in time? Idk.

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Bird

Bird

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Black Panther should lead them. Team is Black Panther, Ant-Man & The Wasp, Hulk, Doctor Strange, Falcon Cap, & maybe War Machine with Captain Marvel, Dr Strange and Spidey in and out as required. Who did I leave out?

The attractiveness of the team depends on the villains and situations they are in. The early scenes of Civil War showed how to srite a bunch of heroes doing street stuff and keeping it all interesting so if they do it like that it could work.

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ChasingKingKirby

ChasingKingKirby

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2 minutes ago, TwoPiece said:

Feige told us a long time ago that he likes The Avengers because they "rotate rosters".

Iron Man and Cap are not The Avengers.

Spider-Man, Doctor Strange, Ant-Man, Black Panther, etc are tons of "star power" for future Avengers films.

And, Thor isn't gone. He has the friggin' Bifrost in Stormbreaker.

I guess your quote makes more sense than trying to show them the light...

Movie numbers don't lie...   Outside of Black Panther, who has a billion dollar franchise?   Spidey is the closest and his trend line is down...   I'm talking star power.   Not team chemistry.   I'm not saying it can't work, but I think this is the end of this kinda blockbuster for awhile.

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@therealsilvermane

@therealsilvermane

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7 minutes ago, Bosco685 said:

He did. But he didn't provide this sacrifice. It was forced on him by Natasha's self-sacrifice and emotional ending.

As I said, according to Jim Starlin's Adam Warlock stories, the Soul Stone is almost alive and hungers. "A soul for a soul" totally works with Jim Starlin's interpretation as well as the MCU's. I don't think every sacrifice for the Soul Stone has to be some violent murder like Thanos did with Gamora. It can also be the situation with Clint and Natasha. It counts.

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theCapraAegagrus

theCapraAegagrus

Posted
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Just now, Bird said:

Black Panther should lead them. Team is Black Panther, Ant-Man & The Wasp, Hulk, Doctor Strange, Falcon Cap, & maybe War Machine with Captain Marvel, Dr Strange and Spidey in and out as required. Who did I leave out?

The attractiveness of the team depends on the villains and situations they are in. The early scenes of Civil War showed how to srite a bunch of heroes doing street stuff and keeping it all interesting so if they do it like that it could work.

I don't think Professor Hulk is doing any more Avenging. One of his arms is basically useless.

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Bosco685

Bosco685

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1 minute ago, Antpark said:

If we want to get pedantic and parse words:

"The Stone demands a sacrifice" - Natasha sacrificed herself

"In order to take the Stone, you must lose that which you love." Clint certainly loved Natasha

"The Soul ... for a soul." Natasha's soul was the price paid for the Soul stone to come into being.

Clint was able to take it afterwards because of the love and loss he felt from Natasha sacrificing herself. 

It could. If sacrifice meant someone takes away that which you love. But then is that sacrificing something? Endgame went with the easier path. It is what it is. But to tell others 'just go with it' is oversimplifying the act portrayed.

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