Why don’t grading companies/collectors consider Marvel Age 97 the first appearance of Darkhawk?
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140 posts in this topic

40 minutes ago, RockMyAmadeus said:

I'm sure you know this, but others may not know that in Warlord #131, the preview (which was called the "Bonus Book" by this point) the first DC Liefeld story is found. It's not good, of course, but for a couple of minutes in the very early 90s, it was hot. Or...rather, "hot."

How can you forget the pinup in Boris the Bear #5? It's pure magic!

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ASM 365 came out 3 months before SM 2099 #1.  That's a long time in between a preview so maybe the length of time plays a large factor in why ASM 365 is more valued as that particular first appearance.  

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On 6/28/2019 at 1:35 PM, Broke as a Joke said:

ASM 365 came out 3 months before SM 2099 #1.  That's a long time in between a preview so maybe the length of time plays a large factor in why ASM 365 is more valued as that particular first appearance.  

It could just be that it's an anniversary issue in a very collectible title.

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On 6/25/2019 at 5:37 PM, Broke as a Joke said:

hm

If a character made his or her first appearance back in the 70's, 80's in one of those Hostess ads would that qualify?  

How did this question go unrecognized?!? Broke, do you have an example in mind? The heroes were always established (Captain America), but the villains were usually totally random, from street thugs to c-list-looking villains. How cool would it be to read an old back issue and find...

Image result for hostess comic book ads

Holy cow, it's Liam HEMSworth! I need to go to bed. 

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Maybe the easiest way to defeat Thanos would have been to give him a Hostess Fruit Pie. Even the Infinity Gauntlet could not stand before the almighty fruit pie!

Edited by Jeffro™
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On 6/19/2019 at 3:02 PM, F For Fake said:

 

Also, I did buy a copy of MA97 in a lot for about 10 cents and then sold it for $25 a couple of days later, so, hey, keep bringing us these new first appearances. As long as they sell, I don't care if they're "real" or not. 

When they pump, we dump! :wink:

Edited by Coverless 9.8
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This is your brain on this thread: fried.

Seriously, folks here can not distinguish between a first appearance in a comic story and an AD in a comic or a publisher’s promotional materials?  WTF?

Every time I see this debate It is clear we have speculators trying to manipulate the market by hyping something as being what it is not.  Sad.  

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20 hours ago, Harry Stone said:

I think ive read about 40 pages of message boards and I still can’t find the print run for Darkhawk 1 and Marvel Age  97. If anyone has this info it would be super helpful. Thank you! 

You're not going to find that, because publishers don't announce the print runs. The best you're going to be able to do is find if the estimated sales were reported by the distributors that supplied comic shops at the time, and the distribution statements that they regularly published at the time in the comics. But those were for newsstand distribution, and they don't mention specific issues

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The presses ran on Marvel Age, but they were more often considered promotional material, not "real" comics, back when they were issued (a lot of them free with Diamond Previews from subscription services), so I think a lot of copies were discarded/destroyed before people finally realized there was collector value to them. Certainly most Darkhawk #1's got a bag and board at some point. The Marvel Age DH preview, not as much.
I just dug this one out in keeping with the "these were ephemera"  theme. I was able to pick up a closing LCS' Marvel Age stock about 10 years ago. None of them were bagged. This one made it through OK, but I think I have some more I bought in a unlabeled box and am hoping they're in better shape. Certainly the one I got from my sub service when it was new should be.

I loved Marvel Age, and started to save them from about #20 on so I have a decent collection, although I missed plenty towards the end, which was about 10 years later, with #140

As a kid without a lot of money, they looked like comics, had actual comics sometimes, great covers usually, and were cheap! 

I really liked the annuals. They went all-out on those.

 

 

 

darkhawk - Copy.jpg

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On 11/26/2020 at 9:30 PM, jdandns said:

The presses ran on Marvel Age, but they were more often considered promotional material, not "real" comics, back when they were issued (a lot of them free with Diamond Previews from subscription services), so I think a lot of copies were discarded/destroyed before people finally realized there was collector value to them. Certainly most Darkhawk #1's got a bag and board at some point. The Marvel Age DH preview, not as much.
I just dug this one out in keeping with the "these were ephemera"  theme. I was able to pick up a closing LCS' Marvel Age stock about 10 years ago. None of them were bagged. This one made it through OK, but I think I have some more I bought in a unlabeled box and am hoping they're in better shape. Certainly the one I got from my sub service when it was new should be.

I loved Marvel Age, and started to save them from about #20 on so I have a decent collection, although I missed plenty towards the end, which was about 10 years later, with #140

As a kid without a lot of money, they looked like comics, had actual comics sometimes, great covers usually, and were cheap! 

I really liked the annuals. They went all-out on those.

 

 

 

:frustrated:

Marvel Age has collector value?  I still have nightmares of having to leaf past countless marvel ages while rummaging in quarter boxes as kids.  They arent even comics!  :frustrated:

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5 hours ago, waaaghboss said:

Marvel Age has collector value?  I still have nightmares of having to leaf past countless marvel ages while rummaging in quarter boxes as kids.  They arent even comics!  :frustrated:

An "unwritten rule" of collectibles is that something once considered worthless will eventually have value. 

Promotional materials and reprints-from-the-first-five-years seem to be the losers-turned-into-winners from the 1990s.

The outcome isn't easy to predict, though, because most things considered worthless remain worthless. :foryou:

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On 11/25/2020 at 8:48 PM, GeeksAreMyPeeps said:
On 11/25/2020 at 12:18 AM, Harry Stone said:

I think ive read about 40 pages of message boards and I still can’t find the print run for Darkhawk 1 and Marvel Age  97. If anyone has this info it would be super helpful. Thank you! 

You're not going to find that, because publishers don't announce the print runs. The best you're going to be able to do is find if the estimated sales were reported by the distributors that supplied comic shops at the time, and the distribution statements that they regularly published at the time in the comics. But those were for newsstand distribution, and they don't mention specific issues

The problem with Statements of Ownership is that they very rarely cover the first few issues of a title. Also, they only contain numbers for the average and the latest issue and the only numbers for specific methods of distribution are for mail subscriptions (because that's why the document exists).

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9 hours ago, waaaghboss said:

Marvel Age has collector value?  I still have nightmares of having to leaf past countless marvel ages while rummaging in quarter boxes as kids.  They arent even comics!  :frustrated:

But they look like comics and can be hyped to mislead newbie suckers!

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1 hour ago, Lazyboy said:
10 hours ago, waaaghboss said:

Marvel Age has collector value?  I still have nightmares of having to leaf past countless marvel ages while rummaging in quarter boxes as kids.  They arent even comics!  :frustrated:

But they look like comics and can be hyped to mislead newbie suckers!

Sadly true

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On 11/25/2020 at 11:04 AM, sfcityduck said:

This is your brain on this thread: fried.

Seriously, folks here can not distinguish between a first appearance in a comic story and an AD in a comic or a publisher’s promotional materials?  WTF?

Every time I see this debate It is clear we have speculators trying to manipulate the market by hyping something as being what it is not.  Sad.  

You don't distinguish the difference at all between an ad and a book with the character on the cover and a story about the character inside?

I think Thor 229 and others are just an ad. 

Marvel Age 12 and 97 I would put much higher then just an ad. 
(Although 12 is more a prototype .)

 

 

Edited by fastballspecial
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8 hours ago, Lazyboy said:

But they look like comics and can be hyped to mislead newbie suckers!

It's such bs to infer that people who buy different stuff than you are all just dupes being swindled out of their money. Tastes evolve, markets change. Stuff sells because people like to collect it.  I for one would be way more stoked to find a nice ma97 than a darkhawk #1 and I'd venture to guess most here would be too.  And not just because it's his first published appearance, it's a way better cover.

 

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30 minutes ago, skrank said:

It's such bs to infer that people who buy different stuff than you are all just dupes being swindled out of their money.

It might be, if not for the fact that many hucksters are over-hyping garbage in the name of their own profit. This isn't organic change, it's every bad thing anybody ever said about Wizard, on crack and cranked up to 11.

30 minutes ago, skrank said:

 Tastes evolve, markets change. Stuff sells because people like to collect it.  I for one would be way more stoked to find a nice ma97 than a darkhawk #1 and I'd venture to guess most here would be too.

Good for you. Collect how you want.

30 minutes ago, skrank said:

 And not just because it's his first published appearance

No, it is absolutely not.

30 minutes ago, skrank said:

 it's a way better cover.

(shrug)

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1 hour ago, fastballspecial said:

You don't distinguish the difference at all between an ad and a book with the character on the cover and a story about the character inside?

I suggest that you read that post again.

1 hour ago, fastballspecial said:


I think Thor 229 and others are just an ad. 

Marvel Age 12 and 97 I would put much higher then just an ad. 
(Although 12 is more a prototype .)

It's all just advertising, but different types.

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