eBay buyer wants to return my raw book after CGC'd, if the grade is less than what I stated on the listing... 2 2

[Buzzetta]

3 hours ago, RockMyAmadeus said:

I use the "Good-Fine-Psychedelic" grading system for comics. Never had a return using it.

So "groovy" and "far out" ? 

Which reminds me... I have to start deciding if I am actually going to go to Citi Field next weekend.  I might pick up a single ticket at the last minute. 

 

[oldrover]

24 minutes ago, Buzzetta said:

So "groovy" and "far out" ? 

 

[Ride the Tiger]

19 hours ago, ADAMANTIUM said:

How much of a grade drop are we talking?

Just for fun did you ask him if it came back higher, would he have contacted you?  seriously don't do that and just refund once you get the book back, but what grade drop?

Just what I was thinking. If the book grades higher will the buyer give you more money for it? I swear the whole comic buying/selling industry has turned to poop.

[Brian48]

Out the f*r’s name so everyone can block him. 

[Buzzetta]

5 hours ago, Buzzetta said:

So "groovy" and "far out" ? 

Which reminds me... I have to start deciding if I am actually going to go to Citi Field next weekend.  I might pick up a single ticket at the last minute. 

 

I want to add that next week is Eternal Con on Long Island. It's probably cheaper to go see the Dead. 

[James J Johnson]

9 hours ago, Buzzetta said:

Here is what I "think" it comes down to.   Do not list that you accept returns on eBay.   It gives the seller an extra layer of protection. 

A direct excerpt from the Ebay community discussion and help forums re: Returns

"Ebay is a complete joke.

I had an auction that clearly stated no returns accepted. The buyer opened a case and ebay decided in his favor. I called to ask them how the buyer could possibly win the case when it says no returns accepted and they basically told me that they side on the buyers most of the time. He told me that no returns accepted basically means nothing at all."

[Buzzetta]

57 minutes ago, James J Johnson said:

A direct excerpt from the Ebay community discussion and help forums re: Returns

"Ebay is a complete joke.

I had an auction that clearly stated no returns accepted. The buyer opened a case and ebay decided in his favor. I called to ask them how the buyer could possibly win the case when it says no returns accepted and they basically told me that they side on the buyers most of the time. He told me that no returns accepted basically means nothing at all."

Yet, I am living and breathing proof that the flip side exists. 

[James J Johnson]

3 minutes ago, Buzzetta said:

Yet, I am living and breathing proof that the flip side exists. 

Ebay must spin a roulette wheel to decide when to side with a seller. When it hits on double zero.

[ADAMANTIUM]

8 minutes ago, James J Johnson said:

12 minutes ago, Buzzetta said:

Yet, I am living and breathing proof that the flip side exists. 

Ebay must spin a roulette wheel to decide when to side with a seller. When it hits on double zero.

I had to return a book that was sent to me in a priority box with bubble wrap around from side to side, not top to bottom of the slab. No cardboard. It had a good sized dent in the box..

Anyway the slab (the newest style) had split in half, and i could slide the slab off the bottom and top as it was completely severed....

It was a Iron Fist #14 in 9.4 too, I felt bad for the seller, but "had" to return, as I wasn't confident a simple reholder was any longer going to do the trick.

 it wasn't the time to ask the seller about PayPal 3% fee's, but I felt bad, don't know that I could have done anything to make it better though or that it was even my fault....

the whole thing was a drain  

[Buzzetta]

12 minutes ago, James J Johnson said:

Ebay must spin a roulette wheel to decide when to side with a seller. When it hits on double zero.

No, I just keep at it. 

Here is how I look at it... and I have to admit that I learned this the hard way.   Here is my AHA moment. 

Some insufficiently_thoughtful_person of a buyer was buying something from my personal account and said there was a problem.  I processed the return.  A couple of months later they had the exact same issue buying something on the other account that I manage. They did not know the two were related.  This was for jewelry.  The problem sounded familiar so I checked my notes and sure as ESS they were the same person. 

I got ruthless. 

And I kept at it.

Here is my personal philosophy.  I don't mind the bad press.  I have no problem being badmouthed across the internet.  If you are trying to play games I do not want you as a customer anyway. So... I can either stand up and take a hit or I can allow this type of behavior to continue and pass it along to the next person. 

 

[Buzzetta]

4 minutes ago, ADAMANTIUM said:

I had to return a book that was sent to me in a priority box with bubble wrap around from side to side, not top to bottom of the slab. No cardboard. It had a good sized dent in the box..

Anyway the slab (the newest style) had split in half, and i could slide the slab off the bottom and top as it was completely severed....

It was a Iron Fist #14 in 9.4 too, I felt bad for the seller, but "had" to return, as I wasn't confident a simple reholder was any longer going to do the trick.

 it wasn't the time to ask the seller about PayPal 3% fee's, but I felt bad, don't know that I could have done anything to make it better though or that it was even my fault....

the whole thing was a drain  

And I would have taken that back no questions asked. That actually happened to me with a first Silver Age Spectre. 

I did the 1092/1095 double box with bubble wrap. The buyer said he knew I did the right thing buy showed me that the box was destroyed upon arrival and the slab shattered. 

I took it back.  I filed a claim and received the full amount from USPS. I have the book.

Even if I did not receive the claim from USPS that is mine and the cost of doing business. 

There is so much that I would love to post... but it might not be a good idea  

[kav]

28 minutes ago, Buzzetta said:

And I would have taken that back no questions asked. That actually happened to me with a first Silver Age Spectre. 

I did the 1092/1095 double box with bubble wrap. The buyer said he knew I did the right thing buy showed me that the box was destroyed upon arrival and the slab shattered. 

I took it back.  I filed a claim and received the full amount from USPS. I have the book.

Even if I did not receive the claim from USPS that is mine and the cost of doing business. 

There is so much that I would love to post... but it might not be a good idea  

oh it's a good idea all right

[Beige]

16 hours ago, Buzzetta said:

Here is what I "think" it comes down to.   Do not list that you accept returns on eBay.   It gives the seller an extra layer of protection. 

No,no it does not Buzz.

 

Ebay will side with the buyer every time unless you can PROVE their claim is fraudulent.

You can list 'I don't accept returns' all day - and ebay will open up a case regardless as soon as a buyer requests a return.

 

[Buzzetta]

48 minutes ago, Beige said:

No,no it does not Buzz.

 

Ebay will side with the buyer every time unless you can PROVE their claim is fraudulent.

You can list 'I don't accept returns' all day - and ebay will open up a case regardless as soon as a buyer requests a return.

 

At this point all I will say is what I have already said.  See above. 

I don’t know what else to tell you. Person wanted to recently return something that says no returns because they say they just don’t like it. I called eBay and eBay sided with me.   Originally they filed it as item not described.  Yet... all it took was a phone call. 

 

Edited June 17, 2019 by Buzzetta

[kav]

24 minutes ago, Buzzetta said:

At this point all I will say is what I have already said.  See above. 

I don’t know what else to tell you. Person wanted to recently return something that says no returns because they say they just don’t like it. I called eBay and eBay sided with me.   Originally they filed it as item not described.  Yet... all it took was a phone call. 

 

Remember folks ebay is often all over the map on stuff.  One guy says cant help ya you call and speak to someone else and they say absolutely we can fix this situation for you sir.  I have no reason to doubt Buzz.  I will say the odds are against the seller as there are endless stories on the boards of seller being forced to bite the bullet.

[theCapraAegagrus]

You have his address. You know what to do...

[F For Fake]

19 hours ago, ADAMANTIUM said:

I had to return a book that was sent to me in a priority box with bubble wrap around from side to side, not top to bottom of the slab. No cardboard. It had a good sized dent in the box..

Anyway the slab (the newest style) had split in half, and i could slide the slab off the bottom and top as it was completely severed....

It was a Iron Fist #14 in 9.4 too, I felt bad for the seller, but "had" to return, as I wasn't confident a simple reholder was any longer going to do the trick.

 it wasn't the time to ask the seller about PayPal 3% fee's, but I felt bad, don't know that I could have done anything to make it better though or that it was even my fault....

the whole thing was a drain  

It truly sucks when a both the seller and the buyer are honest folks doing their best to be fair, but something crappy happens in the process. There was nothing for you to feel personally responsible for, and you felt bad because you're a good guy, but you were absolutely in the right to ask for the full refund or everything coming your way. I have been selling on eBay for 20+ years. The lesson I learned long ago was that it is the seller's responsibility to make sure that the item arrives to the buyer exactly as described. I do everything I can do in packing the item to make sure it arrives safely, but if USPS screws up or there's an act of God or whatever, even if it's not my fault, I'm still on the hook for it. Luckily I've only had a handful of items damaged/destroyed over the years, and in most of the cases I had the forethought to cover them with USPS insurance, and they paid up. It's always a hassle and a pain in the neck, but it's the only way to handle things. As the buyer, you have the right to expect the item to arrive as described and not be on the hook for any sort of cost if that isn't the case. If an item is damaged in transit, or if I missed something in grading, I will take the return, no problem. And even if I stand by the grade but the buyer doesn't agree, I will still generally take the return, because I want the buyer to be happy. But this has limits, and I don't take returns based on buyer's remorse. While it is true that eBay sides with the buyer 90% of the time, I have also had eBay side with me on "item not as described" cases. It has only happened a couple of times, and no, I don't have examples on hand, but it's still true.

 

[F For Fake]

And on the flipside, as a buyer, I expect the item to arrive safely and as described.  When requesting a refund for a damaged item, the key is, I think, trying to be understanding and polite when pointing out the issues with the seller. Often, if an item is damaged, it may not really be the seller's fault. They may have done their due diligence in packing, but, hey, things happen. It's important to not go off all guns blazing and assume that the seller is a jerk or an insufficiently_thoughtful_person, or worse, someone trying to defraud you. A couple of months ago I got a good deal on a couple of hard to find X-men posters that I'd been waiting a long time to track down. I was very excited to get them. Seller was very communicative and pleasant. Suddenly there was a delay in the posters arriving, the status wasn't updating on the USPS site. This is usually not a good sign. Finally, the posters arrived, and sure enough, the box (he used a long thin box instead of a tube) was bent directly in half. I took pictures of everything before I even opened the package up and afterwards, and sent them to the seller. He was dismayed, obviously. But in the end, he sent me a full refund and told me to keep the posters. It sucked for him to be out the money and merch, and I felt for him as a seller myself. But at the same time, I wasn't going to pay for this stuff that had been destroyed. I think the key to having the return go smoothly was that I approached him with empathy. It does wonders, kids. Don't be a jerk and assume everyone is trying to rip you off, and more often than not, everyone will act like a grown-up and things will be worked out correctly.

[Ride the Tiger]

5 hours ago, TwoPiece said:

You have his address. You know what to do...

Flaming bag of dog poop on the front stairs?

[MGsimba77]

To the OP- Did you guarantee a numerical grade in the description? Some shoppers don't bother to closely look at the scans or are not well read on on the ins & outs of grading. 

I was tempted on an X-Men 120 on Ebay that was described as a NM+ but then took a blow up of the scan. It appeared to have a very thin crease on one of the front corners only visible by blowing up the scan on that corner in the "desktop" ebay version so decided to pass. A crease alone may exclude it from being a 9.6 or 9.8 which is what nm+ is. Wasn't worth the risk. 

Ebay leaves too much buyer discretion in cases of "not as described"