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The troubled fixation on MCU vs DCEU competition
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44 posts in this topic

Competition between DC and Marvel has been long-standing since the companies existed parallel to one another. The unhealthy side of the MCU vs DCEU debate took it to a new level as the internet and social media empowered easier access to outlets that could reach a larger audience for such topics, and to any level of extreme thinking.

But how one-sided can it be? Is it just the fans taking shots at one another to make it clear only their company can be on top?

An example of how such fixations can bleed into reviewer opinions is this Vulture piece when the writer was part of the reporters visiting the Justice League set to take on Zack Snyder about their concerns.

VULTURE: Zack Snyder Faces His Haters on the Set of Justice League (June-2016)

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So when Snyder called over all his skeptics for an on-the-record chat, I had to laugh: Among the iPhones thrust into his face to record the conversation was one emblazoned with Captain America’s shield, a detail that sums up everything you need to know about what Snyder’s movies are up against and why the studio had invited us here for what proved to be a very unusual set visit.

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Our meeting took place on Leavesden’s Stage C, which was draped with so much green screen that if you had to look at it all day, you’d probably desaturate your movies, too.

It's clear the writer is not a fan of the DCEU films up to that point, Zack Snyder's approach, nor the darker side of the DC stories. Though the green screen comment is interesting. As if he had visited the Age of Ultron set two years prior... green screen city.

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But is it limited to just the reviewers and tracking sites taking sides? At times, the creators and cast members can allow themselves to be pulled into such fixation.

Anthony Mackie is so dedicated to the MCU, he is known to take regular shots at the other side to convey how much he loves Marvel. To the point he will tell a reviewer if they like a film from the DCEU, you may as well give up your career and have awful taste.

Although at times he is just doing it for fun to trash talk (how I took it), some fans can pounce on this and take it further to support their preferred studio and actors. The Russo Brothers, on the other hand addressed this professionally about  wanting to make a great film no matter any competition.

But even Anthony Mackie admits in other interviews there really is no fixation on beating DCEU movies (4:11), and no - MCU cast members are not sitting around beating down such films. He even notes how there are people assuming this is what they do during filming, which he doesn't understand.

And it sure isn't an MCU thing, as David Ayer allowed himself to be pulled into such debates in the most extreme of ways. Though later on he apologized for this extreme statement.

As much as Zack Snyder has been attacked for his dark DCEU films, he has publicly stated being a fan of Marvel films. Even recently admitting at the 2019 Zack: Snyder: The Director's Cuts event he is a fan of the Avengers films. So a positive statement.

 

Even worse is when the critics reveal how much they dislike the direction of a company's properties in film, wanting 'the other side' to do it like their beloved company. Though some make it so personal, it feeds into their unbiased reviewer expectations (Joanna Robinson - Senior Writer, VanityFair.com).

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Or, even worst when it becomes so personalized to convey their dislike of a franchise approach, it is a total fixation on a given creator (Lindsay Ellis - Channel Awesome film reviewer; Priscilla Page - Birth.Movies.Death film reviewer; Jordan Hoffman - The Guardian TV & film critic).

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so rather than the focus on healthy competition to up each other's standards leading to more impressive films, it becomes a mix of hate and harsh statements detracting from the positive feelings such films should bring in the end. Even the darkest of films meant to deliver a positive experience in the end.

So with all that, are we in a better place because of such influences and approaches or just more at odds with one another? Is there a better approach without making it so personal to question someone's mental abilities, intent (love when I am accused of fudging numbers to make DCEU films look better), or even what they appreciate?

Edited by Bosco685
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2 minutes ago, RedRaven said:

I think it breaks down to trying to generate hate-bait clicks on social media.

THAT I see much more nowadays.

Comic Book Resources and Screen Rant make it a common practice to post something inflammatory as a headline, which then when you read the article it turns out to be fan rumors or typical hate topics. Or, just misleading to drive clicks.

In the case of MIB's recent hard start, it implies only Will Smith could save the franchise versus taking two good actors and plugging them into a solid story. Plus, it ignores the behind-the-scenes creator fights that now are coming out as having disrupted the production and intended story.

 

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I always look down upon people who perpetuate the MCU vs Worlds of DC mentality. All of the people I know IRL have healthy interest in both franchises.

Surprisingly, my younger brother recently told me that he prefers DC's darker tone of universe. It surprised me, because he never came off as that interested in Snyder's stuff when he was still employed by WB as a director. This came up when I asked if he'd want to see Shazam, and he said "no", "because it looks too bright and cheesy".

I love the contrasts between the MCU and Snyder's Worlds of DC. I want a world where both healthfully exist. I don't want DC to pander to the MCU tone-tards and make their movies full of puns and lack of stakes. It's a huge reason why I love the Russo Bros, because they brought us The Winter Soldier, Infinity War, and Endgame, which are all easily the "darkest" MCU offerings.

Snyder is a genius. Shame on those at WB who couldn't see this, and shame on the "fans" that trash him. He didn't write BvS, and as you can see with his Ultimate Cut, he did a fantastic job with what he had to work with.

Both cinematic universes have studs and duds. Suicide Squad sucks. GotG Vol. 2 sucks. Man of Steel is a masterpiece. So is The Winter Soldier. Shame on you if you fanboy on one side of the aisle.

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27 minutes ago, Broke as a Joke said:

Aquaman was DC's biggest hit yet, and that fell in the "light-hearted" category so I can see how they would be looking to get away from the Snyder strategy going forward.

Can't beat em', join em'.

IMO Aquaman almost perfectly fit into Snyder's vision for Worlds of DC.

While it was bright in color - the tone of the movie was very on-par with Snyder's stuff. It's why critics still didn't like it.

Snyder wouldn't never had a drum-playing octopus in his Aquaman, though. He did approve of Wan's film. AFAIK he still hasn't watched the dreaded Justice League.

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50 minutes ago, TwoPiece said:

While it was bright in color - the tone of the movie was very on-par with Snyder's stuff. It's why critics still didn't like it.

? Critics liked it just fine.

65% positive on RT (which means it's also "certified fresh.")

It outscored Man of Steel and well, every DCEU movie but Wonder Woman & Shazam.

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3 hours ago, Broke as a Joke said:

Aquaman was DC's biggest hit yet, and that fell in the "light-hearted" category so I can see how they would be looking to get away from the Snyder strategy going forward.

Can't beat em', join em'.

That's really a limited view on things to fit a narrative.

The MCU did not start with billion dollar films. Nor a steady track record. It took many films and Joss Whedon bringing a standardized character approach to start that train moving forward. Post-Avengers (2012) is when the solid financial magic kept happening.

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But we can always pretend and ignore the data, right?

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Sometimes the stars embrace their roles too much. Leading to ugly exchanges with interviewers.

A journalist just had a nightmare interview with a Hollywood star and we can't stop guessing who.

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"The actor in question saw me and started going off on me for 4 min even when I tried to get it back on track," he claimed.

 

Quickly, Weintraub's followers (whom I love unreservedly) deduced that he must be referring to one of the stars of The Avengers, given that these were the interviews he had scheduled on Saturday.

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Any press is good press. :facepalm:

Edited by Bosco685
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1 minute ago, theCapraAegagrus said:

Probably Brie Larson...

:insane:

Steve Weintraub comes across such a low-intensity interviewer and always professional, I'm not sure who it was. But many point to Anthony Mackie because of their previous engagement where he said Weintraub's appreciation of Man of Steel made him a poor film reviewer.

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13 minutes ago, Bosco685 said:

:insane:

Steve Weintraub comes across such a low-intensity interviewer and always professional, I'm not sure who it was. But many point to Anthony Mackie because of their previous engagement where he said Weintraub's appreciation of Man of Steel made him a poor film reviewer.

That wouldn't surprise me. No way it could be one of the Original 6 (which is who I think of when saying "The Avengers").

Mackie does seem like a guy with an attitude in some interviews.

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On 10/16/2019 at 7:58 AM, theCapraAegagrus said:

Mackie does seem like a guy with an attitude in some interviews.

Nah...Mackie's just sore from that time B-Rabbit publically humiliated him back at the shelter. Old wounds heal slowly, man...

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@Bosco685

I agree with your comments and points being made in this topic, however, when you compare MCU vs. DCEU (nerd fight) to things like Left vs. Right in gov't, it seems like you may be unsuccessful in establishing the size of the problem (very small, relative to politics) or the need to agree to disagree (hasn't worked in anything else).  Still, there is something noble in Sisyphean efforts which have the right spirit. :foryou:

Edited by valiantman
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34 minutes ago, valiantman said:

@Bosco685

I agree with your comments and points being made in this topic, however, when you compare MCU vs. DCEU (nerd fight) to things like Left vs. Right in gov't, it seems like you may be unsuccessful in establishing the size of the problem (very small, relative to politics) or the need to agree to disagree (hasn't worked in anything else).  Still, there is something noble in Sisyphean efforts which have the right spirit. :foryou:

:foryou:

All part of the fun. At least we have moved on from the days where if someone differed with the majority here, the louder few would drive that person from the forum to cleanse the environment of 'the other'.

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