CGC and eBay Partner on Expert Review Service 3 3

[ADAMANTIUM]

1 hour ago, newshane said:

Will CGC refund the money for evaluating the scan? 

 

Yes  either wholly or partially

edit: well if it is indeterminable or "inconclusive" info they will...

Edited July 12, 2019 by ADAMANTIUM

[N e r V]

Wow. I completely understand when something is done that actually might impact posters here like the changing of a case which causes rings or might damage a book.

I completely understand if a service comes up that you don’t care to use be it using a Uber or having your groceries delivered to you or paying for some advice on ANYTHING be it Comics or whatever before buying.

What I don’t get is the outrage of it. Man up and buy a car instead of wasting money on Uber? Quit being lazy and pick up your own groceries because you're embarrassing the grocery industry by having to pay for delivery? Don’t ever pay anyone for advice on anything otherwise you’re too dumb and should know everything already? While we’re at it quit going out to eat ever or buy coffee or whatever because it’s cheaper to actually cook and make your own coffee and you should be smart enough to do that too...ugh!

Its a niche service CGC is trying for those interested. The dollar amount is small for what it is. If it’s a bad business idea it will fail. If you don’t like it, DON’T USE IT!

But if it doesn’t fail you should have some respect for anyone who may use it and find it useful. Some of the posts here seem intended to shame not only CGC for trying a new service (everything you do in business is a money grab) but at posters because you’d be an insufficiently_thoughtful_person unlike the poster for ever needing or wanting to try it.

I’ve been collecting since I was 10 and still highly appreciate a lot of the advice I’ve been given here and ain’t to proud to acknowledge wanting help at times with second opinions. If one of those posters asked me for a 5 or 10 spot sometime it’d be theirs because information and opinions can have value in purchases...

If you want to be outraged trying tuning in to the news sometime. Plenty of things to cause outrage can be found there...

LIVE AND LET LIVE...

 

[porcupine48]

4 minutes ago, N e r V said:

Wow. I completely understand when something is done that actually might impact posters here like the changing of a case which causes rings or might damage a book.

I completely understand if a service comes up that you don’t care to use be it using a Uber or having your groceries delivered to you or paying for some advice on ANYTHING be it Comics or whatever before buying.

What I don’t get is the outrage of it. Man up and buy a car instead of wasting money on Uber? Quit being lazy and pick up your own groceries because you're embarrassing the grocery industry by having to pay for delivery? Don’t ever pay anyone for advice on anything otherwise you’re too dumb and should know everything already? While we’re at it quit going out to eat ever or buy coffee or whatever because it’s cheaper to actually cook and make your own coffee and you should be smart enough to do that too...ugh!

Its a niche service CGC is trying for those interested. The dollar amount is small for what it is. If it’s a bad business idea it will fail. If you don’t like it, DON’T USE IT!

But if it doesn’t fail you should have some respect for anyone who may use it and find it useful. Some of the posts here seem intended to shame not only CGC for trying a new service (everything you do in business is a money grab) but at posters because you’d be an insufficiently_thoughtful_person unlike the poster for ever needing or wanting to try it.

I’ve been collecting since I was 10 and still highly appreciate a lot of the advice I’ve been given here and ain’t to proud to acknowledge wanting help at times with second opinions. If one of those posters asked me for a 5 or 10 spot sometime it’d be theirs because information and opinions can have value in purchases...

If you want to be outraged trying tuning in to the news sometime. Plenty of things to cause outrage can be found there...

LIVE AND LET LIVE...

 

The news makes me yell at the tv like my grandparents  

Great post.

 

[newshane]

1 hour ago, ADAMANTIUM said:

Yes  either wholly or partially

edit: well if it is indeterminable or "inconclusive" info they will...

My main gripe is that it is ALWAYS indeterminable, therefore worthless. 

It may be designed to guard against predatory practices on eBay, but I think it's fairly predatory on an intrinsic level. 

[newshane]

10 minutes ago, N e r V said:

Wow. I completely understand when something is done that actually might impact posters here like the changing of a case which causes rings or might damage a book.

I completely understand if a service comes up that you don’t care to use be it using a Uber or having your groceries delivered to you or paying for some advice on ANYTHING be it Comics or whatever before buying.

What I don’t get is the outrage of it. Man up and buy a car instead of wasting money on Uber? Quit being lazy and pick up your own groceries because you're embarrassing the grocery industry by having to pay for delivery? Don’t ever pay anyone for advice on anything otherwise you’re too dumb and should know everything already? While we’re at it quit going out to eat ever or buy coffee or whatever because it’s cheaper to actually cook and make your own coffee and you should be smart enough to do that too...ugh!

Its a niche service CGC is trying for those interested. The dollar amount is small for what it is. If it’s a bad business idea it will fail. If you don’t like it, DON’T USE IT!

But if it doesn’t fail you should have some respect for anyone who may use it and find it useful. Some of the posts here seem intended to shame not only CGC for trying a new service (everything you do in business is a money grab) but at posters because you’d be an insufficiently_thoughtful_person unlike the poster for ever needing or wanting to try it.

I’ve been collecting since I was 10 and still highly appreciate a lot of the advice I’ve been given here and ain’t to proud to acknowledge wanting help at times with second opinions. If one of those posters asked me for a 5 or 10 spot sometime it’d be theirs because information and opinions can have value in purchases...

If you want to be outraged trying tuning in to the news sometime. Plenty of things to cause outrage can be found there...

LIVE AND LET LIVE...

 

I'm not outraged.

Bemused is the appropriate adjective. 

My argument is that the information derived from having anyone analyze a scan isn't helpful enough to justify the service. You are paying for speculation based on an incomplete (around 7% of the book at best) analysis in absentia, with ranges as wide as the Pacific Ocean. 

 

[newshane]

...and yes, it is a cash grab. But I am not against a good ole' fashioned cash grab as long as I get something useful out of it. 

Like the new Black Label Pedigrees. Cash grab. They know that people like me will send in for reholder, and they are correct. I will. But at least I feel like I"m getting something cool and tangible from it. 

If the CGC can look at a scan and tell me if the book will fall somewhere within the 8.0 to 10.0 range (I still can't get over that) then that is WORTHLESS information. It's no great salve to my anxiety as a buyer, and no great assistance to my reputation as a seller. 

 

 

[newshane]

4 hours ago, Pontoon said:

There’s countless people buying comics who don’t know how to grade. Look at all the new guys who turn up here asking for opinions on severely overgraded books they’ve purchased or are looking at on ebay. 
 

Let's suppose that those folks are determined to buy nothing but NM books. Imagine their disappointment when the book comes back VF after having been graded. To top it off, they paid an extra 5 or 10 bucks for the speculative service, which didn't provide them with the information required to meet their goals. 

Edited July 12, 2019 by newshane

[N e r V]

14 minutes ago, newshane said:

I'm not outraged.

Bemused is the appropriate adjective. 

My argument is that the information derived from having anyone analyze a scan isn't helpful enough to justify the service. You are paying for speculation based on an incomplete (around 7% of the book at best) analysis in absentia, with ranges as wide as the Pacific Ocean. 

 

Posters here post eBay listings or ask others about them all the time if they just aren’t sure about something in the scan or listing. That’s the second opinion aspect where maybe they confirm something or not that you’re not sure about.

Resto, missing pages ,etc. should be part of any listing and no one can tell about those  things but it’s it’s not as advertised you have a case for returning.

The difference (I see) in this service is when I have a poster look at a scan they are basing it’s rough grade on their standards, not CGC’s. Now I have an actual grader looking at a scan and basing the rough grade on CGC standards and yes a grader probably is a better spotter on any resto. work that could be possibly detected from only a scan vs your average collector. 

Again though, probably not a service for everyone. We will see if there’s a market out there...

Edited July 12, 2019 by N e r V

[newshane]

3 minutes ago, N e r V said:

Posters here post eBay listings or ask others about them all the time if they just aren’t sure about something in the scan or listing. That’s the second opinion aspect where maybe they confirm something or not that you’re not sure about.

 

But it's free here (for now), as near worthless information should be!  Plus, since it's free, there is no expectation for the evaluations to be accurate. If I pay someone for their opinion and it's off more than two points (!) then I'd be mighty disappointed. 

3 minutes ago, N e r V said:

Now I have an actual grader looking at a scan...

The CGC is the best team out there IMHO, but there are big-time dealers and old-school folk and maniacs in the forums whom I trust just as much. 

[N e r V]

11 minutes ago, newshane said:

Let's suppose that those folks are determined to buy nothing but NM books. Imagine their disappointment when the book comes back VF after having been graded. To top it off, they paid an extra 5 or 10 bucks for the speculative service, which didn't provide them with the information required to meet their goals. 

I think on “cheaper” books it’s not worth it. On GA, SA and BA of value it’s probably going to be more useful and worth the 5 or 10 bucks.

I keep forgetting here that there’s a large number of modern comics collectors here too. I wouldn’t use it on a 50 or 100 variant cover from the last decade because their supposed value is key to the number on the grade which usually needs to be pretty high.

With GA books I’ve seen people here guess 6.0’s as VF’s and 4.0’s as Fines, etc.

So getting closer to the ballpark might be more helpful.

Edited July 12, 2019 by N e r V

[N e r V]

3 minutes ago, newshane said:

But it's free here (for now), as near worthless information should be!  Plus, since it's free, there is no expectation for the evaluations to be accurate. If I pay someone for their opinion and it's off more than two points (!) then I'd be mighty disappointed. 

The CGC is the best team out there IMHO, but there are big-time dealers and old-school folk and maniacs in the forums whom I trust just as much. 

True, but trying calling or texting Bedrock or Ricksneatstuff 20 times a day to check out some scans daily...

[newshane]

3 minutes ago, N e r V said:

True, but trying calling or texting Bedrock or Ricksneatstuff 20 times a day to check out some scans daily...

Rick would hook me up, but I've only had to ask his opinion once.  

[N e r V]

2 minutes ago, newshane said:

Rick would hook me up, but I've only had to ask his opinion once.  

The first ones free. After that it’s $20.00 or you have to buy one of his signs...

Nothings free anymore....

[Topnotchman]

I can see how this service wouldn’t be for everyone.  To me it’s a brilliant marketing move to connect with newer collectors who may not of sent a book to CGC directly. It gives the potential bidder a target grade zone, which has value to that collector.  They offer a coupon type value if that collector sends that specific book to CCG for an actual certified grade.  CGC wins as the customer has now connected by creating an account if it’s there first submission.  If they do not send the book in, CGC has revenue of $5.00 or $10.00.  With CGC that is a good profit for time as it may be 5-10 seconds to give a bucket grade with a scan.  Referencing as that is all the longer it takes myself.   If their is a down fall it may put a damper on some of the rampant eBay over graders.  

 

[Krismusic]

1 hour ago, newshane said:

Let's suppose that those folks are determined to buy nothing but NM books. Imagine their disappointment when the book comes back VF after having been graded. To top it off, they paid an extra 5 or 10 bucks for the speculative service, which didn't provide them with the information required to meet their goals. 

that 5 or 10 can go to the cost of grading though if you use the certificate so its not totally lost money.

[newshane]

1 minute ago, Krishosein said:

that 5 or 10 can go to the cost of grading though if you use the certificate so its not totally lost money.

Gotcha. Well, that relieves the sting a little bit. 

[Krismusic]

54 minutes ago, N e r V said:

I think on “cheaper” books it’s not worth it. On GA, SA and BA of value it’s probably going to be more useful and worth the 5 or 10 bucks.

I keep forgetting here that there’s a large number of modern comics collectors here too. I wouldn’t use it on a 50 or 100 variant cover from the last decade because their supposed value is key to the number on the grade which usually needs to be pretty high.

With GA books I’ve seen people here guess 6.0’s as VF’s and 4.0’s as Fines, etc.

So getting closer to the ballpark might be more helpful.

I agree with this point I think its more useful for SA and GA like I said previously 

[The Lions Den]

In defense of the graders here, I see them consistently grade books in the proper range by using only scans (this evidence is supported by the results of the books after they were graded by CGC). Not only that, they can spot restoration as well. If they used the proposed ranges of this new service, I'm confident they'd consistently be in the right range. In fact, I may start using those standards myself when evaluating books in the "Spare A Grade" forum. It would certainly make life easier...

[N e r V]

1 hour ago, The Lions Den said:

In defense of the graders here, I see them consistently grade books in the proper range by using only scans (this evidence is supported by the results of the books after they were graded by CGC). Not only that, they can spot restoration as well. If they used the proposed ranges of this new service, I'm confident they'd consistently be in the right range. In fact, I may start using those standards myself when evaluating books in the "Spare A Grade" forum. It would certainly make life easier...

Straight from the lions mouth...

 

 

 

[Dark Knight]

Havent read through everything, but I really dont like this idea of grading a book based on scans/pictures. Sure it will give a base grade based on how the book looks in the pictures, but anyone can simply learn how to grade better, gotta start somewhere right? There are thousands of graded examples of professionally graded CGC  books to choose from with the respective number grades and use those as a rule of thumb to grade. 

With scans/pictures, they can enhance the appearance of the images and even hide any important defects associated with the book. Not to mention other things unseen (missing pages, stains in the interior, rusty staple migration, etc.