POLL - Should GEEzusWalks be removed from the Probation List over the objection of the nominator, Columbia Comics? 4 4

[MustEatBrains]

Nothing that has transpired up to this point has changed my mind.  I continue to support his inclusion on the list.  The body of evidence is too great to support what the seller claims IMO.  If I was in his shoes and cared about my rep here I’d go running to buy an ASM 5.0 and sell to the buyer at the original price while apologizing profusely. What’s he gonna be out 200-300 bucks maybe? 

[1Cool]

4 minutes ago, MustEatBrains said:

Nothing that has transpired up to this point has changed my mind.  I continue to support his inclusion on the list.  The body of evidence is too great to support what the seller claims IMO.  If I was in his shoes and cared about my rep here I’d go running to buy an ASM 5.0 and sell to the buyer at the original price while apologizing profusely. What’s he gonna be out 200-300 bucks maybe? 

Probably closer to $400 at this point based on what I see up for sale on E-Bay.  But if he really did lose the book then I'm sure he feels like it's unreasonable to pony up the $400 for a mistake.  I do believe there is a language barrier going on with this seller so it may contribute to them not coming on and further defending themselves. 

I voted to allow the seller off the hook since their name has been dragged thru the mud and having them potentially forever on the PL list with the possibility it could just be a bad mistake which is overkill in my mind.  Mistakes happen for buyers - mistakes happen for sellers.  The end result of this is not keeping bad sellers away since they were getting scared away already - it can only scare good sellers away to other venues which can never be a good thing.

[crassus]

48 minutes ago, 1Cool said:

Probably closer to $400 at this point based on what I see up for sale on E-Bay.  But if he really did lose the book then I'm sure he feels like it's unreasonable to pony up the $400 for a mistake.  I do believe there is a language barrier going on with this seller so it may contribute to them not coming on and further defending themselves. 

I voted to allow the seller off the hook since their name has been dragged thru the mud and having them potentially forever on the PL list with the possibility it could just be a bad mistake which is overkill in my mind.  Mistakes happen for buyers - mistakes happen for sellers.  The end result of this is not keeping bad sellers away since they were getting scared away already - it can only scare good sellers away to other venues which can never be a good thing.

Do you have specific evidence that there is a language problem? 

[JollyComics]

I believe this is the only incident that GeeZ ever committed here. So this is a harsh punishment for the board member for one bad mistake?

Even it's his stupid, lame, unexcusable, furtive, unethical, "sweep it under the rug" and rectified but it might be too late for the seller.

It's kind of difficult to vote even the seller made a borderline mistake but it's not fixable if the seller is still unwilling to give the book to Brock that was what he paid at that bargain price but the seller gave him a full refund.

Yes, the seller blew him off.  It's unethical and unprofessional. No alternative offers from this seller.  However, I don't see it is a serious offensive.

[thehumantorch]

5 hours ago, newshane said:

At this point, 22 boardies think that it is acceptable for someone to back out of a deal by "losing" a book. 

Unbelievable. 

We're on our way to setting quite the precedent. 

Remember that the seller has already been given several, simple solutions in regards to removing himself from the PL. He's failed on every occasion. 

Praise GEEzus. 

I suspect most of the 22 thought it was possible the seller lost the book and they didn't feel the other issues were ironclad proof of deceit.  

[MustEatBrains]

2 minutes ago, thehumantorch said:

I suspect most of the 22 thought it was possible the seller lost the book and they didn't feel the other issues were ironclad proof of deceit.  

27 now.... I'm actually cool with a poll being taken however IMO the seller should have publicly made his case and requested one be started not another boardie.  I don't like the IDGAF mentality.

[Iceman399]

Sorry Mr. dealer I had the money but I lost it all after posting the  , so I can't pay you.  No I'm not sure how I lost it all or where it all went but I made sure to close my bank account, have them shred the documents and wipe their database.  Thanks for understanding that you won't ever be able to sell the book for as much as I agreed to pay you.

[thunsicker]

Ok I read a lot of that thread.  The idea in all that I liked best is Brock's idea of opening the Kudo's threads up to negative experiences.  Make them a true feedback system.  Then save PL for transactions that need monetary recompense and HoS for egregious issues or repeat offenders.

[newshane]

2 minutes ago, thunsicker said:

The idea in all that I liked best is Brock's idea of opening the Kudo's threads up to negative experiences.  Make them a true feedback system.  Then save PL for transactions that need monetary recompense and HoS for egregious issues or repeat offenders.

I like this idea. 

[JollyComics]

12 minutes ago, thunsicker said:

Ok I read a lot of that thread.  The idea in all that I liked best is Brock's idea of opening the Kudo's threads up to negative experiences.  Make them a true feedback system.  Then save PL for transactions that need monetary recompense and HoS for egregious issues or repeat offenders.

It will help to visualize who the seller is. eBay feedback has given me benefits to avoid anybody have problems.

[comicdonna]

This was discussed when the kudos forum started.  I don't think Arch is going to allow any negative feedback in that forum.  

[crassus]

14 minutes ago, thehumantorch said:

I suspect most of the 22 thought it was possible the seller lost the book and they didn't feel the other issues were ironclad proof of deceit.  

I have not voted yet, but I would think that some may be less concerned about proof of wrongdoing than the precedent of a seller being on the PL after issuing a prompt and full refund.

I am not sure yet if that is a sticking point for me but I can see that as a rational ground for removing him.

On the other hand, while it is conventional for the PL to find a refund sufficient remedy, the rules as written do not predefine or prelimit what makes a transaction "incomplete". The rules also allow for pursuit of grievance when a transaction cannot be completed. The PL rules, which I consider very well crafted, clearly allowed for mediation generally for transactions that could no longer be strictly performed.

There is no doubt that this is an arguable and difficult case, but it is not an abuse or misuse of the PL. 

[1Cool]

1 hour ago, crassus said:

Do you have specific evidence that there is a language problem? 

Fair question.  I looked back and found a message from a year ago where he bought a slab from me.  The message was concise but I guess I may have been reading into his responses a bit.  He kept signing him message via his family and for some reason I got the impression his message were so brief since there was a language issue.  I can’t find any specific message where he says English is his second language. 

[kav]

Ps saying "I deleted the pics to clear up space on my computer" is like saying "I removed a hair from my carpet to make more space in my living room".

[newshane]

43 minutes ago, kav said:

Ps saying "I deleted the pics to clear up space on my computer" is like saying "I removed a hair from my carpet to make more space in my living room".

The pictures could be recovered if he sought out some simple knowledge. 

Rarely is anything truly "deleted" from a hard drive. 

But, whatever. Let's just be done with it already. 

[comicdonna]

52 minutes ago, kav said:

Ps saying "I deleted the pics to clear up space on my computer" is like saying "I removed a hair from my carpet to make more space in my living room".

Keep in mind he later stated he deleted the pics for registry reasons.  

[Buzzetta]

7 hours ago, ChiSoxFan said:

(as I stated there as an example, a very well-regarded dealer, with a ridiculously good reputation in the hobby, once couldn't find a book I bought from them, and promptly refunded me. 

I too have had a similar situation a few times in buying signature series books.  It happened with a Joe Simon book as well as a Stan Lee book.  In both cases the sellers realized that they no longer had that book and then gave me a pick of anything else that they had at either a discounted rate.  I wound up getting a different Joe Simon book and a different Stan Lee book.   As a seller myself I mistakenly sold the same thing twice.  I immediately made good on it and the buyer was please with my effort.  I learned from my own experiences in this case as a disappointed buyer how to make it right as a seller. 

The thing is here that this guy doesn't care and with good reason.   He knows that at the end of the day, that unless he seriously did some harm, that people will still buy from him and people will still sell to him.   Why?  Cool Books.   And that is a shame.  There are a couple of people I will never deal with no matter what the deal is...  some people though like the drama. 

 

Edited July 17, 2019 by Buzzetta

[dupont2005]

6 hours ago, 1Cool said:

Probably closer to $400 at this point based on what I see up for sale on E-Bay.  But if he really did lose the book then I'm sure he feels like it's unreasonable to pony up the $400 for a mistake.  I do believe there is a language barrier going on with this seller so it may contribute to them not coming on and further defending themselves. 

I voted to allow the seller off the hook since their name has been dragged thru the mud and having them potentially forever on the PL list with the possibility it could just be a bad mistake which is overkill in my mind.  Mistakes happen for buyers - mistakes happen for sellers.  The end result of this is not keeping bad sellers away since they were getting scared away already - it can only scare good sellers away to other venues which can never be a good thing.

I think if he turns out to be a good member of the sales area for a year or more I’d think maybe it was a mistake, but I bet this mistake happens again

[thehumantorch]

2 hours ago, comicdonna said:

Keep in mind he later stated he deleted the pics for registry reasons.  

Doesn’t explain deleting pictures in a sales thread when they’re embedded there rather than your computer hard drive.  And it seems like the story changes a lot to suit his needs

[kav]

Look he deleted all pics of the book just in case it had been stolen so he would have no evidence to show the book was his and the thief wouldnt get traumatized!!!