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How does restoration affect value?
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13 posts in this topic

I'm watching an ebay auction that says the book has been restored (color touch on the cover and slight glue on the spine).  I know this lowers the value of the book, but what percentage do you estimate the value would depreciate from a similarly graded non restored book?  I'm trying to figure out how much would be too much to spend on it (I'm not planning on selling it but if I ever do need to I don't want to lose money in the deal).  Thank you so much for your time and knowledge,  you guys are the best :)

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Thanks for the response, that makes sense :). Have any of you used CGC to remove a restoration (color touch and glue)?  Does it work well?  I may try to win it and have CGC see what they can do with it. 

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Check eBay Sold Auctions for what that book has sold for in similar grade both raw and CGC graded so you know what an unrestored copy sells for.

If you are looking for a copy to fill a hole in your collection and you have no issue with the restoration and can get the book for less money...

Back about 15 years ago I purchased a TTA #35 that has a piece on the front cover replaced and it does not bother me, I have the book for my collection, the story is the same and I never plan on selling.

 

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It just depends on the book.  I saw a nice FF1 that had some several instances of amateur restoration and it still went for a lot. I think it's  combo of book demand and overall presentation on the resto.  It literally is in the eye of the beholder and there aren't really any GPA comps you can apply since there seem to be an almost infinite number of combs for restoration and grades. 

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For awhile, restored books were selling at ridiculous discounts. Even now ,some do. A beautiful Spider-Man just sold for about 15% of what its unregistered cousin did.

I've gotten okay money on some FFs in the 20s, but also have a nice purple FF 25 sitting on MCS right now at a price I thought would be a hot item.

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On 7/17/2019 at 7:05 AM, BrooksR said:

The item I was looking at ended up selling for a lot more than I anticipated. (shrug)

What was the item and did it sell for a huge discount to condition guide or was it a highly desirable HTF book that was still able to fetch a premium or possibly even a multiple to condition guide?  hm

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Late reply, but I spend a fair time looking at these so I will give you my thoughts. Somewhere on the net is a scale of discount you should apply to Restored books. Basically it goes from around 90% for a NM down to much lower discounts as you go down the list. The theory behind this is that you need a lot of R to get a book back to a NM but again it oversimplifies. Their is a huge difference between the classic conservation R from 50 years ago with "small colour touch small glue on spine", to a more modern, "pieces added, spine reinforced, staples cleaned, cover cleaned and re glossed". Both books are purple but one book in twenty years will have changed while the other will be pretty well as is when bought.

The next point is R is quite common on 50s books. Look at SC 4.  from the CGC census 138R out of a pop of 483, or 138/483 which is 28.50% !!

Now lets look at some others.

 

1959 SC 22# 161/1031 = 15.6%

FF 1# Nov 1961 + 592/2290 = 25.85%

AF 15# 1962  856/3208 = 26.68%

ASM 1#  1963 807/3825 = 21.09

FF 12# 116/1327    = 8.7%

FF 48#    375/5597  = 6.7%

I was actually quite surprised by how many FF 1, AF 15, and ASM 1, were R. My guess is that this was early dealer attempts to up their books. You can see though that once you step away from Mega keys R is quite a small %. Even with a good discount I would suggest just move onto a blue label.

You can see that R is more common on mega key books. The buyer then has the choice of a Purple label with small colour touch but a decent looking book, rather than something that looks beat to death and barely cling to life for the same price.

I am not an expert on Golden age but I am guessing some of the minor R on 1950s Silver may pass inspection on Golden age (would love someone with experience to chime in)

 

I bought a SC 4 5.0 with small ct and glue on sp, for less than a 3.0 at the time. It was for my collection something I wanted for many years and I wanted something nice to look at, but not something that depreciates, (as in reglossing pieces filled / added and pressed to death)

The other observation is that the discount on books under 5.0 is much less on Marvel mega keys than most DC.

 

and I will get out of here before we get onto trimming ..

 

 

 

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On 8/14/2019 at 6:57 PM, Terry E. Gibbs said:

Late reply, but I spend a fair time looking at these so I will give you my thoughts. Somewhere on the net is a scale of discount you should apply to Restored books. Basically it goes from around 90% for a NM down to much lower discounts as you go down the list. The theory behind this is that you need a lot of R to get a book back to a NM but again it oversimplifies. Their is a huge difference between the classic conservation R from 50 years ago with "small colour touch small glue on spine", to a more modern, "pieces added, spine reinforced, staples cleaned, cover cleaned and re glossed". Both books are purple but one book in twenty years will have changed while the other will be pretty well as is when bought.

The next point is R is quite common on 50s books. Look at SC 4.  from the CGC census 138R out of a pop of 483, or 138/483 which is 28.50% !!

Now lets look at some others.

 

1959 SC 22# 161/1031 = 15.6%

FF 1# Nov 1961 + 592/2290 = 25.85%

AF 15# 1962  856/3208 = 26.68%

ASM 1#  1963 807/3825 = 21.09

FF 12# 116/1327    = 8.7%

FF 48#    375/5597  = 6.7%

I was actually quite surprised by how many FF 1, AF 15, and ASM 1, were R. My guess is that this was early dealer attempts to up their books. You can see though that once you step away from Mega keys R is quite a small %. Even with a good discount I would suggest just move onto a blue label.

You can see that R is more common on mega key books. The buyer then has the choice of a Purple label with small colour touch but a decent looking book, rather than something that looks beat to death and barely cling to life for the same price.

I am not an expert on Golden age but I am guessing some of the minor R on 1950s Silver may pass inspection on Golden age (would love someone with experience to chime in)

 

I bought a SC 4 5.0 with small ct and glue on sp, for less than a 3.0 at the time. It was for my collection something I wanted for many years and I wanted something nice to look at, but not something that depreciates, (as in reglossing pieces filled / added and pressed to death)

The other observation is that the discount on books under 5.0 is much less on Marvel mega keys than most DC.

 

and I will get out of here before we get onto trimming ..

 

 

 

Thanks for your great analysis Terry.  This is a topic of great interest to me as I think I'm going to have to start considering going after heavily restored books if I even want to be able to afford a mega key.  I've only bought a few golden age books with minor color touch or glue in the past.  Nothing with major pieces added ect..., so I really don't know much about this.  I was recently looking at this auction for Adventure #247:  https://www.ebay.com/itm/Adventure-Comics-247-Reader-039-s-Copy-KEY-ISSUE-1st-App-Legion-of-Super-Heroes-GD-/223638900909?nma=true&si=6YMOchfCxNPmEZf9O%2Fi7%2BKbv40A%3D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

As you can see, the book had it's logo torn off, along with a big tear on the back cover by the spine.  I had considered bidding on it and then sending it to a restorer but from the preliminary research I did, it seemed that the boost in restored grade would not be worth what it costs to restore it.  The $300.00 it ended up selling for seems like a good value price as a 2.0 is about $900.00 in the guide, and I see that a coverless copy went for around $400.00 on Heritage in the past.  In the end, I decided not to bid as I'd rather add a more beat up, but complete copy, rather than buy this copy. 

Any thoughts on buying keys with their logo's torn off and then getting them restored?  Is it worth it to attempt something like that?  I think the caveat seems to be that it is worth it only if the book would grade around 8.0 in all other aspects before adding the large pieces necessary to restore the logo.

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1 hour ago, Samoyed Sabaka said:

 

Any thoughts on buying keys with their logo's torn off and then getting them restored?  Is it worth it to attempt something like that?  I think the caveat seems to be that it is worth it only if the book would grade around 8.0 in all other aspects before adding the large pieces necessary to restore the logo.

My preference is to buy a very nice coverless, and then use a reproduction cover. You have the story the art, it fills a gap in the collection it will hold value if the PQ is okay and in my mind it looks better. When shops in the 60s returned books for credit one system was to tear off the top piece and another was the whole cover. So these books may be .05, or .03 but they can be solid and not beat to death. Just my preference. I have a key with the front cover torn off and only maybe 10c of cover left. I have joked I could send it to a restorer and then have a 9.6-9.4 CGC purple label noted as "large piece added to cover".

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On 8/14/2019 at 8:57 PM, Terry E. Gibbs said:

Late reply, but I spend a fair time looking at these so I will give you my thoughts. Somewhere on the net is a scale of discount you should apply to Restored books. Basically it goes from around 90% for a NM down to much lower discounts as you go down the list. The theory behind this is that you need a lot of R to get a book back to a NM but again it oversimplifies. Their is a huge difference between the classic conservation R from 50 years ago with "small colour touch small glue on spine", to a more modern, "pieces added, spine reinforced, staples cleaned, cover cleaned and re glossed". Both books are purple but one book in twenty years will have changed while the other will be pretty well as is when bought.

The next point is R is quite common on 50s books. Look at SC 4.  from the CGC census 138R out of a pop of 483, or 138/483 which is 28.50% !!

Now lets look at some others.

 

1959 SC 22# 161/1031 = 15.6%

FF 1# Nov 1961 + 592/2290 = 25.85%

AF 15# 1962  856/3208 = 26.68%

ASM 1#  1963 807/3825 = 21.09

FF 12# 116/1327    = 8.7%

FF 48#    375/5597  = 6.7%

I was actually quite surprised by how many FF 1, AF 15, and ASM 1, were R. My guess is that this was early dealer attempts to up their books. You can see though that once you step away from Mega keys R is quite a small %. Even with a good discount I would suggest just move onto a blue label.

You can see that R is more common on mega key books. The buyer then has the choice of a Purple label with small colour touch but a decent looking book, rather than something that looks beat to death and barely cling to life for the same price.

I am not an expert on Golden age but I am guessing some of the minor R on 1950s Silver may pass inspection on Golden age (would love someone with experience to chime in)

 

I bought a SC 4 5.0 with small ct and glue on sp, for less than a 3.0 at the time. It was for my collection something I wanted for many years and I wanted something nice to look at, but not something that depreciates, (as in reglossing pieces filled / added and pressed to death)

The other observation is that the discount on books under 5.0 is much less on Marvel mega keys than most DC.

 

and I will get out of here before we get onto trimming ..

 

 

 

Too late :)   Trimming is NOT restoration. Voldy understands this.  

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