Making Your Own Art Prints
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Wondering how you guys felt about making your own prints out of OA. Sometimes I see art (commissions mostly) and I’m in love but it’s either A. NFS or B. Out of my price range. 

Recently I saw a painting from an artist on CAF(not a big name) but it was unaffordable, but I still really wanted it. So I saved the image and used the site EZprints.com to create a 12x18 print. Came out pretty good. I wondered if this was kind of “cheap move” though. I dont think its so bad as long as I am not selling the print or anything like that. Cost less than $20 to have made. 

Anyone else ever do this? There’s a few more I’m thinking about doing. Am I being an A-hole? lol

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1 hour ago, punksdropdirtysrh said:

Wondering how you guys felt about making your own prints out of OA. Sometimes I see art (commissions mostly) and I’m in love but it’s either A. NFS or B. Out of my price range. 

Recently I saw a painting from an artist on CAF(not a big name) but it was unaffordable, but I still really wanted it. So I saved the image and used the site EZprints.com to create a 12x18 print. Came out pretty good. I wondered if this was kind of “cheap move” though. I dont think its so bad as long as I am not selling the print or anything like that. Cost less than $20 to have made. 

Anyone else ever do this? There’s a few more I’m thinking about doing. Am I being an A-hole? lol

I am surprised EZprints.com let you do that. Technically they are breaking the law printing it. They are making money off reproducing something they do not have copyright to. That said I think if you are doing it for yourself and not selling it you are fine. I would recommend getting and printer like Epson 7710 that can print 11x17 (and scan same size). This will keep you from having legal issues going thru companies like EZprints.com. 

 

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2 hours ago, punksdropdirtysrh said:

Wondering how you guys felt about making your own prints out of OA. Sometimes I see art (commissions mostly) and I’m in love but it’s either A. NFS or B. Out of my price range. 

Recently I saw a painting from an artist on CAF(not a big name) but it was unaffordable, but I still really wanted it. So I saved the image and used the site EZprints.com to create a 12x18 print. Came out pretty good. I wondered if this was kind of “cheap move” though. I dont think its so bad as long as I am not selling the print or anything like that. Cost less than $20 to have made. 

Anyone else ever do this? There’s a few more I’m thinking about doing. Am I being an A-hole? lol

Put yourself in the artist's shoes. How would you feel knowing someone made an unauthorized print of your hard work without any kind of payment?

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Alright guys, I’m an A-hole. :boo:

If a piece I love is unavailable to me I’ll just have to be satisfied with the image on the screen like the rest of you :D 

thanks for the input 

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10 hours ago, punksdropdirtysrh said:

Alright guys, I’m an A-hole. :boo:

If a piece I love is unavailable to me I’ll just have to be satisfied with the image on the screen like the rest of you :D 

thanks for the input 

You could always contact the artist, see if he or she sells prints of that image, if not see if they'd be ok with you making a single print for your personal use for a small fee. 

 

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I dunno, guys - is it really that big of a deal if someone makes a single print of something they like for their own personal use (for display in their own home)?  If someone takes the Heritage scan of the Hulk #180 end page and prints it out on his home computer (I know someone who did this), is there really any harm?  It's not like this person can afford the original, or that there are prints available for sale of the image, or that Herb is around anymore, or that Marvel is going to care about one photocopy that will never see the light of day outside of the guy's house.  

I remember the owner of the Hulk #180 page wearing a t-shirt he made with an image of the art screenprinted on it.  Is that OK or not OK?  Obviously it's not OK to make multiples for commercial sale, but, what about one for personal use? (shrug) Another one of my good friends in the hobby in the Chicago area (a friend of both me and Chris C.) told me that he has had a number of t-shirts made using images of various OA he owns.  I may have had one made recently myself, though, if any copyright lawyers ask, I might be joking and really bought the t-shirt at a market in Tijuana in July. :whistle: 

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Just now, delekkerste said:

I dunno, guys - is it really that big of a deal if someone makes a single print of something they like for their own personal use (for display in their own home)?  If someone takes the Heritage scan of the Hulk #180 end page and prints it out on his home computer (I know someone who did this), is there really any harm?  It's not like this person can afford the original, or that there are prints available for sale of the image, or that Herb is around anymore, or that Marvel is going to care about one photocopy that will never see the light of day outside of the guy's house.  

I remember the owner of the Hulk #180 page wearing a t-shirt he made with an image of the art screenprinted on it.  Is that OK or not OK?  Obviously it's not OK to make multiples for commercial sale, but, what about one for personal use? (shrug) Another one of my good friends in the hobby in the Chicago area (a friend of both me and Chris C.) told me that he has had a number of t-shirts made using images of various OA he owns.  I may have had one made recently myself, though, if any copyright lawyers ask, I might be joking and really bought the t-shirt at a market in Tijuana in July. :whistle: 

It's a bit of a slippery slope. One off shirts and prints don't harm anyone, unless of course the creator or rights holder is offering prints and shirts of their image and everyone is now just making their own for personal use. So it's not a problem until it's a problem. Then it's too late. 

At conventions I've had guys come up to the booth of the artist I am managing with homemade prints of covers, commissions, and prints the artist was selling his own versions of at the table... and seeking autographs on their bootlegs. 

That's their lifeblood, their work product, I think the least that one can do (in the situation of a print of something that's the artist's IP) is to offer some nominal amount in recognition that if the art is good enough to print out and hang it's probably good enough to give the create a little appreciation to. 

I mean if we appreciate the artist's work enough to hang it on our wall then it's not a stretch to show a little actual appreciation to the artist in some sincere yet nominal way if the situation allows for it. 

 

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1 minute ago, comix4fun said:

It's a bit of a slippery slope. One off shirts and prints don't harm anyone, unless of course the creator or rights holder is offering prints and shirts of their image and everyone is now just making their own for personal use. So it's not a problem until it's a problem. Then it's too late. 

At conventions I've had guys come up to the booth of the artist I am managing with homemade prints of covers, commissions, and prints the artist was selling his own versions of at the table... and seeking autographs on their bootlegs. 

That's their lifeblood, their work product, I think the least that one can do (in the situation of a print of something that's the artist's IP) is to offer some nominal amount in recognition that if the art is good enough to print out and hang it's probably good enough to give the create a little appreciation to. 

I mean if we appreciate the artist's work enough to hang it on our wall then it's not a stretch to show a little actual appreciation to the artist in some sincere yet nominal way if the situation allows for it. 

Well, obviously asking a creator to sign a bootleg when he or she is selling non-bootleg merch is a problem. 

But what do you in the case of something like the Hulk #180 page?  Is it Marvel and/or the Trimpe estate and/or Heritage who should get some compensation?  What's the value of their blessing to print out a single copy for personal use?    

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Just now, delekkerste said:

Well, obviously asking a creator to sign a bootleg when he or she is selling non-bootleg merch is a problem. 

But what do you in the case of something like the Hulk #180 page?  Is it Marvel and/or the Trimpe estate and/or Heritage who should get some compensation?  What's the value of their blessing to print out a single copy for personal use?    

I think you've hit upon the dividing line. If given a reasonable option to purchase a similar item from the IP holder or to compensate the creator one should take it. For a ubiquitous image with no other option,  creating a one-off for personal use is a far less objectionable action. 

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21 minutes ago, delekkerste said:

Well, obviously asking a creator to sign a bootleg when he or she is selling non-bootleg merch is a problem. 

But what do you in the case of something like the Hulk #180 page?  Is it Marvel and/or the Trimpe estate and/or Heritage who should get some compensation?  What's the value of their blessing to print out a single copy for personal use?    

Heritage might have an argument that their image scan of the art is their IP. If the owner of the page makes their own scan to use, I see no reason why they can’t use it. I mean, don’t auction houses and comic dealers put out ads or images on their web pages of them holding up specific big ticket items they sold, as promotional images of their services? Is that not allowed under copyright law? 

RE: The image scans. I have a routine of asking the art rep or artist to send me the image scan of the art I just purchased. If they send it, I regard that as a license to use that image for my own personal use. But, if I started selling t-shirts of the art made from that image at conventions, or something, I could see where the creator of the digital image might not approve. But I suspect nobody really thinks about who owns the copyright. 

Edited by PhilipB2k17

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1 minute ago, ESeffinga said:

 

No one's gonna complain that Gene has all the Boris work Heritage has ever auctioned off, running as a slideshow on a 72" LED next to his desk.
 

I think number of complaints would be proportional to the number of people subjected to who can see the slideshow.

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So it's not exactly the same thing - but its a similar enough topic that it's worth mentioning it here.  

This past san diego I met another collector who had his own personal artist edition printed. An 11x17 hardcover book featuring all his new art from the past year. It looked great and he mentioned he did this as a way to' take the art around' and share at a public space like the sdcc without any worry of loss. He doesn't sell these - but has given a couple copies away.  To me this seemed like a brilliant idea - and had thought to make one as a tradeable object with any other collector that made one of their collection (or part of). Not sure the thoughts on this - here on the boards.

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6 hours ago, delekkerste said:

Well, obviously asking a creator to sign a bootleg when he or she is selling non-bootleg merch is a problem. 

But what do you in the case of something like the Hulk #180 page?  Is it Marvel and/or the Trimpe estate and/or Heritage who should get some compensation?  What's the value of their blessing to print out a single copy for personal use?    

To answer your question: first, is the copyright registered or not? If registered, the owner gets statutory damages as well as actual damages as calculated under copyriht law. The penalties depend on variety of factors, including willfulness, and can range from $200 to $150,000 per violation.

 

Second, here is an example of how actual damages would be calculated, using a T-shirt as an example. This is from a Nolo website:

Federal law (17 U.S.C. § 504(b)) provides: "The copyright owner is entitled to recover the actual damages suffered ... as a result of the infringement, and any profits of the infringer that are attributable to the infringement and are not taken into account in computing the actual damages. In establishing the infringer’s profits, the copyright owner is required to present proof only of the infringer’s gross revenue, and the infringer is required to prove his or her deductible expenses and the elements of profit attributable to factors other than the copyrighted work."

In the example above, your actual damages would be your lost revenue as a result of the infringer taking your painting and reproducing it on T-shirts. These calculations are imperfect, of course; you could argue that your sales decreased by a certain percentage during the period that the infringer was selling the T-shirts, though such causation is not always clear.

Note that no one actually has to produce the T-shirt (or a poster). So, it would be the equivalent of the cost of a purchased poster.

Finally, the copyright holders get the right of recovery. Hulk #180 was published in 1974, so it is probably governed by the pre-1975 law. In that case, Marvel probably owns the copyright.

 

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1 hour ago, Panelfan1 said:

So it's not exactly the same thing - but its a similar enough topic that it's worth mentioning it here.  

This past san diego I met another collector who had his own personal artist edition printed. An 11x17 hardcover book featuring all his new art from the past year. It looked great and he mentioned he did this as a way to' take the art around' and share at a public space like the sdcc without any worry of loss. He doesn't sell these - but has given a couple copies away.  To me this seemed like a brilliant idea - and had thought to make one as a tradeable object with any other collector that made one of their collection (or part of). Not sure the thoughts on this - here on the boards.

Great way to invite a lawsuit, if someone wanted to do so. And they would likely win. This is strict liability stuff. Like statutory rape in criminal law. 

Edited by Rick2you2

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2 hours ago, Panelfan1 said:

So it's not exactly the same thing - but its a similar enough topic that it's worth mentioning it here.  

This past san diego I met another collector who had his own personal artist edition printed. An 11x17 hardcover book featuring all his new art from the past year. It looked great and he mentioned he did this as a way to' take the art around' and share at a public space like the sdcc without any worry of loss. He doesn't sell these - but has given a couple copies away.  To me this seemed like a brilliant idea - and had thought to make one as a tradeable object with any other collector that made one of their collection (or part of). Not sure the thoughts on this - here on the boards.

I've seen this Boardie's personal collection book before at a meet-up in NYC a while back.  I agree - great idea and it looks fantastic!  I don't know where the dividing line is between copyright infringement and fair use under the UCC, but, it seems to me like making a few picture albums for non-commercial use falls under the latter category. 2c 

Edited by delekkerste

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It's for personal use and you're not making money off it, and it's not widespread, why would they go after you?  Just stay under the radar.  If they find out you're making money off it, you'll get a cease and desist letter and they'll have you destroy anything you've already made and take the money you made.  Unless you are defiant and/or they want to make an example of someone, that should be the end of it. 

Pre-internet, other than a CBG ad, sending photo copies was the preferred non in-person way to share art .  A high resolution post to CAF has more potential to be taken and printed by someone else. 

They should go after these transparency sellers on eBay first.

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6 minutes ago, delekkerste said:

I've seen this Boardie's personal collection book before at a meet-up in NYC a while back.  I agree - great idea and it looks fantastic!  I don't know where the dividing line is between copyright infringement and fair use under the UCC, but, it seems to me like making a few picture albums for non-commercial use probably falls under the latter category. 2c 

And I would reckon that those for whom the copyright has been infringed upon would have to know that their art has been printed and bound in such a book, but how would they know if they have never seen what’s inside the book? If the book-maker is just showing it off among a tight group of collectors, the artist should never find out. 

Besides, if this was me, and I got “caught,” I would argue that a facet of this hobby is sharing, and it’s too big of a risk to carry around hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of art to a collectors’ gathering and that photocopies mitigates the risk of losing the art or having it stolen.  

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