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What qualifies as a FIRST APPEARANCE?
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17 posts in this topic

Ok. This is getting out of hand. I've noticed a lot "first appearances" as being ads, solicitations, posters, non-comic or anything not related to the actual character being in a COMIC STORY!

Can we settle this once and for all.

What is the definition of a FIRST APPEARANCE?

Is it as simple as when the character literally appears IN STORY for the first time?

Or is it something else?

 

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one of the most inconsistent and debated topics on the boards.  If you dig around, you'll find all manner of discussion of the topic.

It will not be settled to anyone's satisfaction here or anywhere else.  But essentially, the market decides, however imperfect, inconsistent, or wrong they might be.

Do your own research and collect what you want and like for your personal preferences.  If you're hoping to invest or flip, just go with the market and do your best to buy low/sell high on the 1st app, 1st cameo app, 1st app in continuity, 1st cover app, 1st app in advertisement, 1st app in preview comic, all of it.

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Comic books are a storytelling medium. Since the beginning of organized fandom, essentially in the '60-'65 period, it has been held that the first appearance of any character is in a storytelling context. There have been virtually no exceptions to this (More Fun #51 is a fairly famous one, and even it has caveats) until the last five or so years.

"Ads", "previews", and the like are not "first appearances." The first clue is in the name: "ads"..."previews"...etc.

Those who try to push these things as "first appearances" do it almost always because they have a financial motive.

Edited by RockMyAmadeus
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What about something like Marvel Team Up 1 where Spiderman saves an anonymous black woman.  A couple of years later, after the actual intro of Misty Knight, they make mention, in the story that the anonymous woman from issue #3 was indeed Misty Knight

Edited by csaag
typo
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10 hours ago, csaag said:

What about something like Marvel Team Up 1 where Spiderman saves an anonymous black woman.  A couple of years later, after the actual intro of Misty Knight, they make mention, in the story that the anonymous woman from issue #3 was indeed Misty Knight

While a character doesn't need to be named in their first appearance, time and creator continuity are large factors in how believable the connection is in a case like that. Especially when it's a nondescript, anonymous person in the original book.

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10 hours ago, revat said:

the market decides

The market decides only values, which are not determined solely by one factor. The market also usually values significant appearances over appearances in a single panel on the last page, but, again, other factors have influence.

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21 hours ago, csaag said:

What about something like Marvel Team Up 1 where Spiderman saves an anonymous black woman.  A couple of years later, after the actual intro of Misty Knight, they make mention, in the story that the anonymous woman from issue #3 was indeed Misty Knight

Valid point however I would argue that at the time MTU #1 was written/drawn, Misty Knight was not conceived. If she was then you might have a point.

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I am trying to collect first appearances of characters. This is my passion. However, one of the most annoying thing is to get waht is supposed to be a "first appearance" and then find out it is not. An example is HUNTRESS. Some people say its DC Superstars #17 (which is a good case since it does feature her on the cover) but then others say it is ALL STAR COMICS #69 (where is has an "introducing" tag line).

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7 hours ago, APDallas said:

I am trying to collect first appearances of characters. This is my passion. However, one of the most annoying thing is to get waht is supposed to be a "first appearance" and then find out it is not. An example is HUNTRESS. Some people say its DC Superstars #17 (which is a good case since it does feature her on the cover) but then others say it is ALL STAR COMICS #69 (where is has an "introducing" tag line).

Well, that one specifically is a very special (maybe even unique) situation, with two different books released at the same time both containing appearances by the same new character.

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Here's another aspect. How important is a COVER appearance in relation to ACTUAL 1st appearance. It seems, for the most part, values can vary widely.

I like to collect first appearance covers even though, in a lot of cases, that is not their actual 1st appearance.

For instance:
FANTASTIC FOUR #49- 1st Galactus and Silver Surfer on cover

AMAZING SPIDERMAN #51-1st Kingpin on cover

INCREDIBLE HULK 181-1st Wolverine on cover

AVENGERS #48-1st Black Knight on cover

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On 9/6/2019 at 2:03 PM, RockMyAmadeus said:

Comic books are a storytelling medium. Since the beginning of organized fandom, essentially in the '60-'65 period, it has been held that the first appearance of any character is in a storytelling context. There have been virtually no exceptions to this (More Fun #51 is a fairly famous one, and even it has caveats) until the last five or so years.

"Ads", "previews", and the like are not "first appearances." The first clue is in the name: "ads"..."previews"...etc.

Those who try to push these things as "first appearances" do it almost always because they have a financial motive.

This

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For me, a full 1st appearance is threefold

  1. The character is shown in full
  2. The character is named
  3. The character is part of the storyline (e.g. the Hulk 180 vs 181 debate)

If all three are not met, then it falls to a cameo. 

Edited by oldmilwaukee6er
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On 1/19/2020 at 9:09 PM, aardvark88 said:

First app. She-Hulk from Marvel Tales?

1. Character is shown in full.

2. Character is named.

3. Origin is explained.

4. Printed in an appropriate Marvel, DC or independent press comic rather than in Diamond Previews, Wizard mag, Malibu Sun, etc.:

2UH45Q5.jpg

 

Still just an ad.

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