Marvel #1 5 5

[rob_react]

7 hours ago, tth2 said:

To be fair, quite a number of those sales took place in a period when relatively high grade copies of MC 1 seemed to be popping up every auction, and often it was the same copies.  This really tainted everyone's perception of the book at the time.  The feeling was that MC 1s were like buses--if you didn't get an MC 1 at this auction, just wait because another one would be coming along.

During that same period, very few Action 1s and Detective 27s or higher grade Bat 1s and Cap 1s were coming to market, which further enhanced the perception that MC 1 was common as dirt.

Now, it's been a while since a higher grade MC 1 has come up for auction.  So it will be fascinating to see what it goes for in today's supercharged market, particularly because of the unprecedented grade, which is tempered by the knowledge among those who will have done their due diligence that it's just one of those copies that was being constantly recycled back in the 'naughts. 

Great points. I remember that period well. The phenomenon was visible in real time. We discussed it here every couple of months it seemed when another hot potato would surface. 

Will a nearly decade long gap help this book recover some shine? It's going to be interesting to watch, that's for sure.

[AJD]

5 hours ago, MasterChief said:

I'm somewhat perplexed as to why the pedigree designation is not assigned to this book. 

 

I might be off base here, but if the pedigree designation was attached to the book when it was graded lower, that would make it easier to identify that it has been monkeyed with. So there's a $ incentive not to include it.

[rob_react]

38 minutes ago, AJD said:

I might be off base here, but if the pedigree designation was attached to the book when it was graded lower, that would make it easier to identify that it has been monkeyed with. So there's a $ incentive not to include it.

 It didn't have the pedigree designation when it was originally graded. There was no incentive at that point to hide anything about the book. 

[zen514]

1 hour ago, rob_react said:

Million dollar books featuring characters the general public cares about. I'm hoping to be surprised and get another 7 figure book (and to finally add a new title to that list- returning MC#1 at least temporarily, to top 3 GA status), but for the last 20 years I've only ever been surprised on the downside by MC #1. Fingers crossed and popcorn out though. I wanted the Cap to hit 7 figures, I'll be just as excited if this one does it.

 

Well... Captain america and Iron man( Silver age were no heavy hitters. More Fun 73 exploded since Aquaman.

Marvel Comics has been a top book and its due for its time to shine again. Especially being the book that started it all. Also Sub-Mariner Namor MCU entrance.

 

Its scarcity is huge also. 28 unrestored copies.

 

Last 6.0 was 215k was 2017 compared to the 9.0 pay copy 227k in 2010... Richard had to sell his book to to the natural disaster Texas(Bedrock)

 

Even a 1.0 sold at auction for 52k last year.

 

Great work on that list Rob.

 

Im just a bystander and will be watching with popcorn also. Would be great to see this book hit 1 million.

Imperius Rex!

[woowoo]

I love Marvel 1 but as us old timers leave the comic world I think it will lose more interest with the new Gen ? Imo with No Bat/Cap/Superman there is not much there to keep the book alive in the years to come  When was the last time anyone talked  abought Ka-zar  on the boards ? The Human Torch is not the Torch we all talk abought now days. Don't get me wrong Marvel 1 is a great book to most of us but we are small on these boards. I also think most of us care more for the value not for the book. I myself would love to have a Oct copy over Nov copy why would that be  

[Mmehdy]

32 minutes ago, woowoo said:

I love Marvel 1 but as us old timers leave the comic world I think it will lose more interest with the new Gen ? Imo with No Bat/Cap/Superman there is not much there to keep the book alive in the years to come  When was the last time anyone talked  abought Ka-zar  on the boards ? The Human Torch is not the Torch we all talk abought now days. Don't get me wrong Marvel 1 is a great book to most of us but we are small on these boards. I also think most of us care more for the value not for the book. I myself would love to have a Oct copy over Nov copy why would that be  

In the early 70's Action 1 and Whiz 2 were about even...at least at early comic book convention sales. Some of the top books were the Flash Gordon FC#10 etc...Red Raven #1 was a hot book also. Over time this has changed. Cap #1 will be the #3 book maybe in the next ten years. Sup1 and Bat 1will be on its heels after falling to it. Where does that leave Marvel 1...I think in a unique position. The cover of this book is flat out amazing with the Paul painting...I would think a  #6 for a long period. While I LOVE the Whiz#2 cover and story...one of the best first stories ever....it could fall by the wayside like Whiz #2...if Cap #1 was not such a great cover and book...then 1939 should beat out 1941....but as time and collector march on...there is little difference to the 2 year gap. In the early days..the older the GA book was...the more valuable it was supposed to be in the future....but in 1970....the difference between 1939 and 1941...seemed much greater..any book under 1940. Trends change over time, but this book should break 1 mil...possibly to some "investor" type who does not even know the Oct vs Nov date.

[batman_fan]

I think this copy will do really great.  Mr B's copy that auctioned a little while back did very well ($215K at 6.0).  This is the first uber high grade copy to be in an auction recently.

[rob_react]

19 minutes ago, batman_fan said:

I think this copy will do really great.  Mr B's copy that auctioned a little while back did very well ($215K at 6.0).  This is the first uber high grade copy to be in an auction recently.

We know one thing for sure, this one won't lose money

[Chicago Boy]

 Even if I had the highest graded November copy  it would eat at me that I didn’t have an October copy    Just sayin.  Multiple printing books just freak me out anyway    

[batman_fan]

14 minutes ago, Chicago Boy said:

 Even if I had the highest graded November copy  it would eat at me that I didn’t have an October copy    Just sayin.  Multiple printing books just freak me out anyway    

There is a twelve step program for that 

[pemart1966]

42 minutes ago, Chicago Boy said:

 Even if I had the highest graded November copy  it would eat at me that I didn’t have an October copy    Just sayin.  Multiple printing books just freak me out anyway    

Yup - you got one you gotta have the other...

[Knightsofold]

7 hours ago, rob_react said:

Great points. I remember that period well. The phenomenon was visible in real time. We discussed it here every couple of months it seemed when another hot potato would surface. 

Will a nearly decade long gap help this book recover some shine? It's going to be interesting to watch, that's for sure.

Why were they selling the same book so much?  Didn’t like it, or flipping?

[MasterChief]

7 hours ago, rob_react said:

13 hours ago, MasterChief said:

I'm somewhat perplexed as to why the pedigree designation is not assigned to this book. 

Being a student of hobby history and fascinated by the story of a collections' origin, I'm particularly sensitive to maintaining a cohesive link to the nostalgic past through proper identification and labeling of pedigree copies thereby cementing comic book provenance.  

This book is the Windy City copy. It was identified as such by the founder of the collection, Gary Colabuono, in this particular thread. Additionally, the book is identified as being the Windy City copy on the Comic Book Pedigree website. (Link below)

Windy City

"Of the four pedigrees containing all #1 issues, this collection is by far the largest, numbering over 2,000 comics. It also covers one of the largest spans of time, running from the '30s through the '60s. Many of the most valuable key issues were present, including Marvel Comics #1, Captain America #1, Batman #1, Flash #1, Captain Marvel #1, All-Winners #1, Daring Mystery #1 and Whiz #1. The original owner Andy Wallace, an introverted postal worker who lived with his sister, wrote his name on nearly 1/4 of the comics. Gary Colabuono purchased the collection piecemeal over eight years, but initially sold them without a pedigree status, although he did make a detailed original list."

Marvel Comics #1 Windy City

I wonder if it's been asked for and denied or just was never asked for. I've heard that some Church copies have been designated as pedigree books without it being noted on the submission, but it would be tougher with something else. 

Even with something like this- you'd have to stumble on the knowledge. I never knew this book, which I've been following for 15 years, was the Windy City copy. I would contact Heritage (and I will if no one else wants to)

If I remember correctly, there have been many occasions over the years where CGC recognized a pedigree copy upon examination and grading then consequently assigned the appropriate designation absent the submitter's request. I would like to think that this book, given its physical characteristics and the overall limited supply of high-grade copies, would have triggered visual recognition and identification during grading.

If you have the time, please contact Heritage and let them know of the findings. I'm sure they would be delighted to have CGC assign the pedigree designation to the label. If there is doubt, they could contact Gary to confirm provenance. 

By the way, I just came across the website below, which is pretty cool. It is the sister site of the Comic Book Pedigree website. It also designates the subject book as the Windy City copy. According to the "About Us" page, Matt Nelson and Stephen Ritter, operate these websites. Some nice work on their part. Another great resource for consulting comparative images.  

Golden Age Top 4
http://www.top4comics.com/index.php

Marvel Comics #1
http://www.top4comics.com/showcase.php?issue=marvel

 

[Chicago Boy]

5 minutes ago, MasterChief said:

If I remember correctly, there have been many occasions over the years where CGC recognized a pedigree copy upon examination and grading then consequently assigned the appropriate designation absent the submitter's request. I would like to think that this book, given its physical characteristics and the overall limited supply of high-grade copies, would have triggered visual recognition and identification during grading.

If you have the time, please contact Heritage and let them know of the findings. I'm sure they would be delighted to have CGC assign the pedigree designation to the label. If there is doubt, they could contact Gary to confirm provenance. 

By the way, I just came across the website below, which is pretty cool. It is the sister site of the Comic Book Pedigree website. It also designates the subject book as the Windy City copy. According to the "About Us" page, Matt Nelson and Stephen Ritter, operate these websites. Some nice work on their part. Another great resource for consulting comparative images.  

Golden Age Top 4
http://www.top4comics.com/index.php

Marvel Comics #1
http://www.top4comics.com/showcase.php?issue=marvel

 

Love this new site !  Paging Wayne - Tec.   Thank u for this 

[MasterChief]

12 hours ago, G.A.tor said:

It first came to market as from the white rose collection. Anyone connect it as Windy City copy then?

Here's more evidence that the book is in fact the Windy City copy.

Gary states in the below thread that he sold the book to the brothers who amassed the White Rose Collection, which Heritage liquidated in March of 2003 (Auction 806).

 

 

[MasterChief]

Here's the Heritage press release announcing the White Rose Collection...

************* 

Press Release - December 30, 2002
Heritage to Auction the White Rose Collection in NYC
Sensational Timely Collection, other Selected Rarities, will be Offered in Separate Catalog

The buzz is true! In March of 2003, Heritage Comic Auctions will offer one of the nicest collections of Timely comic books ever to come to market. Special enough to merit a separate catalog, the White Rose Collection is replete with near-complete runs of the major Timely titles highlighted with some absolutely stunning individual high grade and pedigree copies. According to Heritage Comics Director of Auctions, John Petty, "This fabulous collection was accumulated by two extremely knowledgeable collectors during the 1980s, and none of these books have been offered for sale publicly or privately since that decade. Every one of them has been off the market for at least 14 years! Talk about a fresh collection - we've been besieged with requests regarding information on these books. The most dedicated Golden Age collectors know that this collection holds many of the prime pieces from the Timely mosaic."

Most major key issues are represented, and many are the highest graded copies certified by the third-party grading service Comics Guaranty Corporation.

(link to full press release)
 

[sagii]

@MasterChief The Comic Book Etouffee was devine: lightly tossed with tidbits of possible lineage,  braised on both sides of the slab and served under a glazed topping of spot on detective technique! ! Chef Ramsey would be proud!

I'm stuffed! What's for dessert buddy 

[tth2]

21 hours ago, MasterChief said:

I'm somewhat perplexed as to why the pedigree designation is not assigned to this book. 

Gee, I can't imagine why. 

[tth2]

16 hours ago, rob_react said:

I wonder if it's been asked for and denied or just was never asked for. I've heard that some Church copies have been designated as pedigree books without it being noted on the submission, but it would be tougher with something else. 

Even with something like this- you'd have to stumble on the knowledge. I never knew this book, which I've been following for 15 years, was the Windy City copy. I would contact Heritage (and I will if no one else wants to)

What if the consignor (assuming the consignor was the person who resubbed the book) doesn't want the Windy City affiliation to be disclosed?  

I'm sure if he tells Heritage that he does not want Heritage's write-up to mention that it's the Windy City copy, then Heritage won't mention it.

If someone tells CGC that they don't want a book to be identified as a pedigree, will CGC do as requested?

[tth2]

16 hours ago, AJD said:

22 hours ago, MasterChief said:

I'm somewhat perplexed as to why the pedigree designation is not assigned to this book. 

 

I might be off base here, but if the pedigree designation was attached to the book when it was graded lower, that would make it easier to identify that it has been monkeyed with. So there's a $ incentive not to include it.

Ding ding ding!