Tear near staple 0

[Ducktape]

Hi everyone. 

Im thinking about buying a slabbed book and possibly pressing it.

I have one concern though. There seems to be a tear near the top staple of this book. Im not sure if pressing would be ideal if this is a tear. Any opinions would be greatly appreciated. 

Thanks in advance! 

UPDATE! I think pressing it would be a bad idea. The tear will most likely get worse. 

Edited October 14, 2019 by Ducktape

[joeypost]

If pressed correctly, the tear should not be affected. 

[theCapraAegagrus]

The expert has spoken.

[Ducktape]

Wow thanks for the help! I'm humbled by the help! 

[James J Johnson]

1 hour ago, Ducktape said:

Wow thanks for the help! I'm humbled by the help! 

Keep in mind that though the tear will not be made worse by a press, chances dictate that the press will not mollify the tear. The grade detraction for that tear will probably not be affected, although the tear will not be exacerbated to further depreciate the grade finding.

Paging JoeyPost

And now a question for #1 when it comes to this. Are there instances when a tear, possibly with a flap of paper, all the fibers still present, like an open door, can be sealed shut by heat and pressure as to almost invisibly seal it shut to lessen the degree of the defect on the overall grade?

Just like there are books with the right kind of creases and bends that press out better than others, are there tears with similar revision potential, that can be improved just with heat and pressure (to garner a blue label)?

[James J Johnson]

11 hours ago, joeypost said:

If pressed correctly, the tear should not be affected. 

 

[Krismusic]

On 10/14/2019 at 9:45 PM, James J Johnson said:

Keep in mind that though the tear will not be made worse by a press, chances dictate that the press will not mollify the tear. The grade detraction for that tear will probably not be affected, although the tear will not be exacerbated to further depreciate the grade finding.

Paging JoeyPost

And now a question for #1 when it comes to this. Are there instances when a tear, possibly with a flap of paper, all the fibers still present, like an open door, can be sealed shut by heat and pressure as to almost invisibly seal it shut to lessen the degree of the defect on the overall grade?

Just like there are books with the right kind of creases and bends that press out better than others, are there tears with similar revision potential, that can be improved just with heat and pressure (to garner a blue label)?

wouldn't it be a blue label just a deduction in grade for the tear. It would be the purple label if that tear was sealed with glue or rice paper etc won't it?.. but I dont think pressing the tear even if it kind of seals itself back would get a purple label? wouldn't it then look like a crease and be deducted. 

All guess and hypotheticals. 

[James J Johnson]

3 hours ago, Krismusic said:

wouldn't it be a blue label just a deduction in grade for the tear. It would be the purple label if that tear was sealed with glue or rice paper etc won't it?.. but I dont think pressing the tear even if it kind of seals itself back would get a purple label? wouldn't it then look like a crease and be deducted. 

All guess and hypotheticals. 

There are tears that almost all but disappear from view. You can miss them at first until the position of the book flexes. Then there are tears that have very damaged paper in the rift between the tear and sometimes the inclusion of dirt and/or debris that make them far more obvious. It's the first type I mention that I was wondering if could be skillfully pressed with the proper technique; the right pressure, heat, moisture, and the correct application to further lend to the invisibility of that tear. No added material, the pseudo-fix made possible by heat and moisture alone. I think what I'm talking about is a type of fusion of the paper fibers to each other from the opposite ends of that tear via moisture and heat alone.

Anyway, Joey was mute on the subject. It's just an idea, and I have no idea if it's viable, or a good basis for experimentation, or if has been done, the moisture taking the place of the glue and sealing the tear because there's already a perfect technique for doing so. Just an idea.

Maybe if somebody other than me asks JoeyP, he'll respond? He doesn't seem to respond if I ask   . Which is fine.

Edited October 17, 2019 by James J Johnson

[Krismusic]

Just now, James J Johnson said:

There are tears that almost all but disappear from view. You can miss them at first until the position of the book flexes. Then there are tears that have very damaged paper in the rift between the tear and sometimes the inclusion of dirt and/or debris that make them far more obvious. It's the first type I mention that I was wondering if could be skillfully pressed with the proper technique; the right pressure, heat, moisture, and the correct application to further lend to the invisibility of that tear. No added material, the fix made possible by heat and moisture alone. I think what I'm talking about is a type of fusion of the paper fibers to each other from the opposite ends of that tear.

oh I know what your getting at but I am guessing a small or "right"/ light tear like that might still be seen under a scope. 

But I see your question as maybe a valid one since paper from pulp is created by pressing on rollers with heat and moisture its kind of like trying to make the paper whole again or like re making it but unless your pressing the inside I think there will always be a problem to show the tear as that the ink might bleed slightly into the tear or the gloss on the cover etc.. I am sure to the naked eye might be pass able but maybe under a scope it would show. 

[James J Johnson]

1 minute ago, Krismusic said:

oh I know what your getting at but I am guessing a small or "right"/ light tear like that might still be seen under a scope. 

But I see your question as maybe a valid one since paper from pulp is created by pressing on rollers with heat and moisture its kind of like trying to make the paper whole again or like re making it but unless your pressing the inside I think there will always be a problem to show the tear as that the ink might bleed slightly into the tear or the gloss on the cover etc.. I am sure to the naked eye might be pass able but maybe under a scope it would show. 

Under a scope, yes. But at the normal focal range 1:1 or 3:1 examination most people grade comics with, a tear may be able to be treated so it has very little defect effect on the overall grade!

Say you have a book that is otherwise 9.6 but gets hammered with an 8.5 because there's a tear on the front or back cover. That tear might have the potential to be mitigated to the point that it becomes a .2 defect deduction rather than putting the book into a much lesser grading category altogether!

[Krismusic]

9 minutes ago, James J Johnson said:

Under a scope, yes. But at the normal focal range 1:1 or 3:1 examination most people grade comics with, a tear may be able to be treated so it has very little defect effect on the overall grade!

Say you have a book that is otherwise 9.6 but gets hammered with an 8.5 because there's a tear on the front or back cover. That tear might have the potential to be mitigated to the point that it becomes a .2 defect deduction rather than putting the book into a much lesser grading category altogether!

interesting... maybe it could happen.. maybe someone on the boards can try to test this out. 

[James J Johnson]

2 hours ago, Krismusic said:

interesting... maybe it could happen.. maybe someone on the boards can try to test this out. 

I have to get a heat press. They're all over ebay, brand new, for $200 to $250. I'm real good with wood, ceramics, and metal. I might be good with paper and don't even know it! 

Edited October 17, 2019 by James J Johnson

[Krismusic]

13 hours ago, James J Johnson said:

I have to get a heat press. They're all over ebay, brand new, for $200 to $250. I'm real good with wood, ceramics, and metal. I might be good with paper and don't even know it! 

[joeypost]

On 10/17/2019 at 4:27 PM, James J Johnson said:

There are tears that almost all but disappear from view. You can miss them at first until the position of the book flexes. Then there are tears that have very damaged paper in the rift between the tear and sometimes the inclusion of dirt and/or debris that make them far more obvious. It's the first type I mention that I was wondering if could be skillfully pressed with the proper technique; the right pressure, heat, moisture, and the correct application to further lend to the invisibility of that tear. No added material, the pseudo-fix made possible by heat and moisture alone. I think what I'm talking about is a type of fusion of the paper fibers to each other from the opposite ends of that tear via moisture and heat alone.

Anyway, Joey was mute on the subject. It's just an idea, and I have no idea if it's viable, or a good basis for experimentation, or if has been done, the moisture taking the place of the glue and sealing the tear because there's already a perfect technique for doing so. Just an idea.

Maybe if somebody other than me asks JoeyP, he'll respond? He doesn't seem to respond if I ask   . Which is fine.

All tears are not created equal, but CGG can detect them all. With that said, you can make the tear more visibly appealing, which could result in a better grade due to the increased eye appeal. 

[James J Johnson]

1 hour ago, joeypost said:

you can make the tear more visibly appealing, which could result in a better grade due to the increased eye appeal. 

That was the gist of my idea. That when it comes to tears, like bends and impressions, there are those that better lend themselves to revision enough to minimize the defect, thus improve the grade, and there are those that don't.