Paypal dispute, any boardie advice would be appreciated. 1 1

[zeezee]

I received a dispute from paypal today from a buyer on ebay that bought a cgc graded book from me back on June 13th. This was what he wrote:

Date reported

November 17, 2019

Buyer notes

After receiving this comic I have determined this is not a 9.8 grade comic. This was misrepresented. I will need to return this for a full refund. Thank you.

This is the book he won on ebay auction: 

Edited November 18, 2019 by zeezee

[zeezee]

I will call paypal tomorrow, anyone dealt with a return 5 months later? Is this buyer trying to pull a scam or is it buyers remorse? please chime in with any experiences or advice, thanks.

[csaag]

Do you have a picture from him on what he received?  Maybe it got damaged in shipping?  

[theCapraAegagrus]

It took them 5 months to disagree with CGC's opinion on the comic's condition?

I would fight this tooth-and-nail.

[bababooey]

Maybe the latest way to do movie speculation is to buy a book and retain ownership through the peak months, weeks, days...brag and show it off to your face and insta-friends...and then return it by abusing paypal's windows.  

Edited November 18, 2019 by bababooey

[Donald Jack]

When I used to work credit card disputes, one of the key factors in "misrepresentation" was the description specific to the item.  For example, you order a blue couch and receive a red couch...this would fall under the category as "Not as described".  Unless the merchant stated "Couch color can be different then originally advertised based on stock" or something like that, and you agree to it, it's pretty cut and dry what "not as described" means.  Also, this dispute works best when the merchant has been refusing to work with the customer...our first stop was always the merchant and most of the time they were unaware of the situation as the customer went straight to the dispute.  if they refuse to work with the customer, we had dispute/chargeback rights and could intervene.

Just looking the information you provided, if you advertised and presented images of a CGC Graded [specific comic book title] at 9.8, and that is what was delivered to the customer, there are no real chargeback/dispute rights as you delivered a CGC graded [specific comic book title] 9.8, regardless of the opinion of anyone else looking at the book in the holder (just because YOU don't think it's a 9.8, doesn't mean CGC has to grade along those lines).  In that respect, there MAY be no dispute/chargeback rights for your customer. 

If the customer is claiming the comic book was damaged in the case during shipment, it now becomes "damaged or defective merchandise" and I don't think that can be "successfully" disputed 60 days after the transaction (although PayPal does have this 180 days thing going on.  Doesn't mean the dispute will be successful).

Of course after having written all that, those are the rules for VISA and MasterCard...PayPal may have other considerations, however, the credit side of the transaction is still subject to Federal Regulation Z, which allows the customer to dispute.  I'd like to say that PayPal would do the correct level of investigation and make the right call (I'd like to say that).  If it was insured for damage, I think the basic coverage is only good if your file a claim within 60 days (for USPS and UPS).

My recommendation would be, when asked by PayPal, provide very brief points that describe the situation, if you provided insurance on the package, and the filling time for the insurance claim.  Too much over detail will cause a lot of skipping over the words and may hurt your case (the PayPal folks who work these cases probably need to complete X number of cases per hour and reading a lot of information hurts the "completion rate").  I'm not sure if they will ask for pictures (we didn't do pictures where I worked as they weren't admissible to VISA or MasterCard during arbitration, at the time), but if they do, just send the ones that support the case.

I've read that some people have been swapping out comic books from the CGC cases fraudulently.  I'm not sure if PayPal would cover that type of issue should they find in favor of your customer and then you receive something you did not originally send.  Best of luck on this and I do hope they find in your favor!

DJ

[zeezee]

3 hours ago, csaag said:

Do you have a picture from him on what he received?  Maybe it got damaged in shipping?  

He never stated that the book is damaged. He just disagrees with CGC on the grade of 9.8

[zeezee]

1 hour ago, bababooey said:

Maybe the latest way to do movie speculation is to buy a book and retain ownership through the peak months, weeks, days...brag and show it off to your face and insta-friends...and then return it by abusing paypal's windows.  

I think he has seen the value of the book drop 50% via GPA  and doesn't want to take the loss.

[jbpez]

This exact thing happened to me a few months back. The only difference was he reported it the day the book was received.  The buyer received the CGC graded 9.8 book and said "he felt like it didn't quite look like a 9.8"! no joke! I fought with him back and forth and eventually said let's leave it up to Paypal. 24 hours later, Paypal ruled in his favor. Sadly, sellers have very little chance or any type of recourse with eBay or Paypal from my experiences. Just my 2 cents. Good luck! 

[mattn792]

Can you still access your original listing?  Print it to pdf if so.  

This buyer is a total , hopefully this works out in your favor.  

[Callaway29]

And now you don’t get refunded the PayPal fees either, right?

[Red_Hood]

30 minutes ago, zeezee said:

I think he has seen the value of the book drop 50% via GPA  and doesn't want to take the loss.

This is exactly the issue at hand.  Too many insufficiently_thoughtful_persons are buying overpriced, over-hyped junk books and some are starting to try to use this angle as a way out.

Fight it ... he'll lose.

[miraclemet]

32 minutes ago, zeezee said:

He never stated that the book is damaged. He just disagrees with CGC on the grade of 9.8

You sold a CGC 9.8 book. It's a CGC 9.8 book. 

if he doesnt think its a CGC 9.8 book why does it say CGC 9.8 on it? 

You didnt say it was a NM/M book, you said it was a CGC 9.8 which means CGC graded it 9.8, which it is... 

 

 

[zeezee]

I sent him a message through ebay asking what is the problem with the book and why five months after you received it, no response so far. The ironic aside to this is, he also is currently selling CGC graded books on ebay.

[Krismusic]

35 minutes ago, zeezee said:

I sent him a message through ebay asking what is the problem with the book and why five months after you received it, no response so far. The ironic aside to this is, he also is currently selling CGC graded books on ebay.

this sounds fishy you might want to out his ebay user id: I would fight this 5 months to start a return.. and say its not a 9.8 CGC that's BS. 

I would fight it on principal. Call eBay.. 

[jbpez]

My buyer was from Los Angles/Sherman oaks area of CA. maybe it is the same guy? 

[joeypost]

If the book does find its way back in your hands...I am interested in purchasing it.

[slym2none]

1 hour ago, zeezee said:

I think he has seen the value of the book drop 50% via GPA  and doesn't want to take the loss.

Isn't there some sort of legal precedent that shows this is wrong?



-slym

[Catwomancomics]

@zeezee

What’s his feebay id ?

I would like to block him.

Edited November 18, 2019 by Catwomancomics

[zeezee]

The moment we click on agree when we sign up for PayPal or ebay, we are at their mercy. The only way these companies change their policies is when there is public outcry led by politicians or if there is a competitor that offers a better deal to the customer/ consumer. For example for the past 10 years grubhub has been gouging the food industry between 20-30% on their delivery sales. But to due recent competition from uber eats and other companies, along with scrutiny from politicians for unsavory practices they have cut their commissions in half.

That is what's needed here as well, a strong competitor to PayPal.