ADAMANTIUM Posted February 22, 2020 Share Posted February 22, 2020 (edited) I mean if you think reading the same comic for 80 years is mind numbing Imagine watching the same cartoon for 80 years, doesn't feel the same imo Edit- anyway, it just hit my passionate button, I'll take a breather Edited February 22, 2020 by ADAMANTIUM RANDOM ACTS 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comics4All Posted February 22, 2020 Share Posted February 22, 2020 2 hours ago, ADAMANTIUM said: I mean if you think reading the same comic for 80 years is mind numbing Imagine watching the same cartoon for 80 years, doesn't feel the same imo Edit- anyway, it just hit my passionate button, I'll take a breather You should be passionate about it, I think all of us here would be! However, if you ask the random man on the street about comics, he will say "They still make those?" If you ask the same man about Batman or the Avengers. He will know instantly who they are. because of the movies For a long time now, Comics weren't needed to sell Batman cartoons, toys, bedsheets, coffee mugs etc. That's what the DC executive is going to say! ADAMANTIUM and Buzzetta 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADAMANTIUM Posted February 22, 2020 Share Posted February 22, 2020 3 minutes ago, comics4all said: You should be passionate about it, I think all of us here would be! However, if you ask the random man on the street about comics, he will say "They still make those?" If you ask the same man about Batman or the Avengers. He will know instantly who they are. because of the movies For a long time now, Comics weren't needed to sell Batman cartoons, toys, bedsheets, coffee mugs etc. That's what the DC executive is going to say! Sad But True! Comics4All 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick2you2 Posted February 22, 2020 Share Posted February 22, 2020 Getting back to the topic, what about Didio? Was he good, or good riddance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastballspecial Posted February 22, 2020 Share Posted February 22, 2020 5 hours ago, comics4all said: 6 hours ago, Mercury Man said: I think comic books publishers, continue to put themselves in these corners, by publishing too many titles, and not giving us enough quality. It's always quantity vs. quality with them. I would rather see 3-5 weekly books each put out by Marvel and DC, with great writers and top artists, rather than 8-12 titles put out each week with sub par writers, and awful artists. No need for multiple X-books, too many Batman family spin offs, stop the reboots, and please stop putting out titles of lower tier characters who nobody really cares about. This. Most of the new books out right now are Drek. They should trim the lines down , get the best talent & characters, put out quality books! Problem is all the talent is going to Hollywood where the money is. RANDOM ACTS 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastballspecial Posted February 22, 2020 Share Posted February 22, 2020 49 minutes ago, Rick2you2 said: Getting back to the topic, what about Didio? Was he good, or good riddance? Fantastic start just couldn't keep momentum. Convergence and Rebirth were terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagnusX Posted February 22, 2020 Share Posted February 22, 2020 52 minutes ago, Rick2you2 said: Getting back to the topic, what about Didio? Was he good, or good riddance? I am not a fan of Didio, and really I want him out Years ago. Still, the man deserve respect for all his hard work and dedication to the company. Shame on DC for let him go this way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VintageComics Posted February 22, 2020 Share Posted February 22, 2020 (edited) 8 hours ago, Mercury Man said: It's always quantity vs. quality with them. We live in a society where the general public does NOT want to pay for quality. We constantly choose quantity in one way or another by always looking for the lowest price. I've said this for years on here. And so capitalism is in a constant struggle between cutting costs to what people are willing to pay for and putting out just enough of a product that people are willing to pay for it, with both sides pulling in opposite directions...one side trying to save money, the other trying to make money. If the general public were able to live in their means and willing to pay for quality, we'd get more quality. It's really that simple. Corporate greed is also responsible in the opposite direction. Companies could make a little less money and put out a better product but no company is willing to do that. That's what I believe. Edited February 22, 2020 by VintageComics Larryw7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VintageComics Posted February 22, 2020 Share Posted February 22, 2020 1 hour ago, fastballspecial said: Problem is all the talent is going to Hollywood where the money is. DC's move to the West Coast was a major shift that forbode this possible closure. That was a drastic change that may have been a last ditch effort to keep the company afloat. The fact that they are putting out movies inferior to Marvel just sped up the decline. They tried to play 'catch up' to Marvel by creating shortcuts once they realized Marvel had a winning formula but it might be too little, too late now (the movie machine moves very slowly, relatively speaking) The problem with readership is rooted in society changing as a whole. We are less patient, want quicker gratification and more pressured with each passing decade, all changed brought on my digital media. It takes patience to read something but most people have a hard time reading a page or watching a movie for a half hour without checking devices. My young daughter was a voracious reader until her early teens when she got a phone, then the reading stopped. What will change the course of society again is if society manages to reel in control of the digital world, rather than it controlling us. Larryw7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastballspecial Posted February 22, 2020 Share Posted February 22, 2020 11 minutes ago, VintageComics said: DC's move to the West Coast was a major shift that forbode this possible closure. That was a drastic change that may have been a last ditch effort to keep the company afloat. The fact that they are putting out movies inferior to Marvel just sped up the decline. They tried to play 'catch up' to Marvel by creating shortcuts once they realized Marvel had a winning formula but it might be too little, too late now (the movie machine moves very slowly, relatively speaking) The problem with readership is rooted in society changing as a whole. We are less patient, want quicker gratification and more pressured with each passing decade, all changed brought on my digital media. It takes patience to read something but most people have a hard time reading a page or watching a movie for a half hour without checking devices. My young daughter was a voracious reader until her early teens when she got a phone, then the reading stopped. What will change the course of society again is if society manages to reel in control of the digital world, rather than it controlling us. Not disagreeing with much here. But what I meant was talent that DC or Marvel used to hire isn't there anymore. Any comic book movie has all the writers I used to read in the 90s and 2000s because they make better money. Any artist worth their talent now does covers because that's where the money is at and its much quicker. VintageComics 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JollyComics Posted February 22, 2020 Share Posted February 22, 2020 26 minutes ago, VintageComics said: We live in a society where the general public does NOT want to pay for quality. We constantly choose quantity in one way or another by always looking for the lowest price. I've said this for years on here. And so capitalism is in a constant struggle between cutting costs to what people are willing to pay for and putting out just enough of a product that people are willing to pay for it, with both sides pulling in opposite directions...one side trying to save money, the other trying to make money. If the general public were able to live in their means and willing to pay for quality, we'd get more quality. It's really that simple. That's what I believe. Income inequality is the answer. Prices on everything are rising every year. The income can't catch up with inflation every year. This generation Z may not afford anything beyond 2025. Too many retail stores are closing due to expensive rentals. The company I used to work moved out of 41.760 square feet in 2007. They had to pay $110,000 a month! More jobs are outsourced. How can we reserve this? Of course the Internet has changed everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dupont2005 Posted February 22, 2020 Share Posted February 22, 2020 1 hour ago, VintageComics said: We live in a society where the general public does NOT want to pay for quality. We constantly choose quantity in one way or another by always looking for the lowest price. I've said this for years on here. And so capitalism is in a constant struggle between cutting costs to what people are willing to pay for and putting out just enough of a product that people are willing to pay for it, with both sides pulling in opposite directions...one side trying to save money, the other trying to make money. If the general public were able to live in their means and willing to pay for quality, we'd get more quality. It's really that simple. Corporate greed is also responsible in the opposite direction. Companies could make a little less money and put out a better product but no company is willing to do that. That's what I believe. They’re not offering us a competitive price though. These days an ad-riddled 22 page Big Two comic costs 33% more than an in-house ad at the back only Indy comic with better production values. The quantity they offer is a bloated catalog in an attempt to squeeze shelf space at the LCS. It’s worked great until the LCS stopped being the place everyone goes for comics. Back in the day the shop would carry 50 Marvel titles, 50 DC titles, and 15-20 indies. If Marvel or DC cancelled a title without replacing it that would be another slot for a competitors comic that a kid with a $10 allowance might buy instead of Avengers West Coast or Vision & The Scarlet Witch or whatever, so they had to keep a huge catalog to keep dominating the shelves Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan. Posted February 23, 2020 Share Posted February 23, 2020 4 hours ago, VintageComics said: Corporate greed is also responsible in the opposite direction. Companies could make a little less money and put out a better product but no company is willing to do that. That's what I believe. I know this is a popular talking point but, as someone who has spent a long time working in the corporate world, I believe you are completely wrong. Most companies actually sink an absurd amount of money into talent, product and development to be the best in its field. Not all companies, of course, but most want to be market leaders. Rick2you2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not A Clone Posted February 23, 2020 Share Posted February 23, 2020 13 hours ago, ADAMANTIUM said: Streaming only has no collecability imo The only reason I came back after turning 18 is comics. Yes, cartoons and streaming won't suffer too much, but when their old enough, they've lost all interest until they have kids...... ^ This. I can't collect digital. I think a larger portion of current buyers will just quit buying altogether if it goes digital only. The rest will just go to a pirate site and steal it. I'm betting that if they did completely shut down publishing that the comic rights would be sold off completely or leased out to Disney or IDW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick2you2 Posted February 23, 2020 Share Posted February 23, 2020 DiDio was an enthusiastic supporter of comics, but that doesn’t mean he had the right “Big Idea”. For example, I like he brought back the Phantom Stranger in the New 52, But I do not like what he did to the character. I suspect he knew his time would end when his status was essentially reduced to a co-publisher instead of a publisher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick2you2 Posted February 23, 2020 Share Posted February 23, 2020 AT&T would be crazy to kill DC print comics. They are literally sample story boards for new movie ideas, providing a test of what might work, or not, on TV and in film. Despite some misses, that is where the big money is, plus merchandising. The print comics are the core of that fan base, so even losing a little money on print, which is a drop in the bucket to AT&T, they provide plenty of return. RANDOM ACTS, Larryw7 and Mercury Man 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercury Man Posted February 23, 2020 Share Posted February 23, 2020 16 hours ago, JollyComics said: Too many retail stores are closing due to expensive rentals. Not new news, but Amazon has been a game changer. My wife went out the other day to look for some type of picture hangers. The specific type she wanted was out of stock at the big box store, and likewise at the big craft store. She got home, jumped online, and ordered them on Amazon, were delivered the next day, with free shipping. She said- I want to support the local stores, but I spent 30 minutes and gas, only to find what I needed was out of stock, and Amazon got them to me next day, with free shipping. RANDOM ACTS and JJ-4 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzzetta Posted February 23, 2020 Share Posted February 23, 2020 On 2/22/2020 at 12:11 PM, ADAMANTIUM said: Yes ending comic distribution may not be that big a deal, as what I'm saying, but it couldn't help. I've never seen Batman begins or any heath ledger joker movie. I dislike the way the new turtles look (haven't seen a tmnt movie since the on after secret of the ooze) But I'm also 38 and may not be their target audience anymore It actually MIGHT help though. Any IP lawyers out there are going to be woozy with what I am about to say. I am in the middle of separating something and scanning it so that it can be distributed digitally. While it is time consuming to scan all of this, it is far more cost effective as this is a one and done type of deal. If I had to fulfil requests for the original documents in paper format that would be cost prohibitive to have them on hand and to stock and deliver. Once it is scanned, the file can be distributed by a click of a button with no additional costs. If I did not have the ability to do this I can promise you, it would not be worth the trouble. So look at it this way: If comics continue to stay in a paper format they will eventually fade away that the companies decide to shut down publishing all together. As each price increase occurs more people are going to wake up and realize that even the current $4-$5 for a 22 page book you can read in around 7-8 minutes is not the best way to spend money. Why are fees so much? Aside from the payment to the creative team, production and distribution are major costs. If you cut them out and go completely digital you can stave off further price increases. All of a sudden comics are profitable again. The trade off is that there will obviously be people that will not embrace a digital format and walk away. Okay... but how much money are you saving compared to how much business turns away? ADAMANTIUM 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JollyComics Posted February 23, 2020 Share Posted February 23, 2020 1 hour ago, Mercury Man said: Not new news, but Amazon has been a game changer. My wife went out the other day to look for some type of picture hangers. The specific type she wanted was out of stock at the big box store, and likewise at the big craft store. She got home, jumped online, and ordered them on Amazon, were delivered the next day, with free shipping. She said- I want to support the local stores, but I spent 30 minutes and gas, only to find what I needed was out of stock, and Amazon got them to me next day, with free shipping. Yes but sadly Amazon has taken many peoples' jobs and local store owners - I have seen the local businesses are disappeared in last 20 years and more stores are still vacant. The banks are desperate to make money so they have to increase the rental prices or will force to sell their properties. More people preferred to sell their products online over the brick and mortar. I am sure more deers will roam all over the vacant places in my suburb area. I canceled Amazon Prime that had to do with the shipping but many movie rental are associated with Amazon Prime that ran up my credit cards at about $60 a month. I was tired of seeing my money always went to Amazon so I have to control my money. Also, I used to buy MANY MANY nice comic books from Amazon in early 2000 but I don't see them very much anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dupont2005 Posted February 23, 2020 Share Posted February 23, 2020 18 minutes ago, Buzzetta said: It actually MIGHT help though. Any IP lawyers out there are going to be woozy with what I am about to say. I am in the middle of separating something and scanning it so that it can be distributed digitally. While it is time consuming to scan all of this, it is far more cost effective as this is a one and done type of deal. If I had to fulfil requests for the original documents in paper format that would be cost prohibitive to have them on hand and to stock and deliver. Once it is scanned, the file can be distributed by a click of a button with no additional costs. If I did not have the ability to do this I can promise you, it would not be worth the trouble. So look at it this way: If comics continue to stay in a paper format they will eventually fade away that the companies decide to shut down publishing all together. As each price increase occurs more people are going to wake up and realize that even the current $4-$5 for a 22 page book you can read in around 7-8 minutes is not the best way to spend money. Why are fees so much? Aside from the payment to the creative team, production and distribution are major costs. If you cut them out and go completely digital you can stave off further price increases. All of a sudden comics are profitable again. The trade off is that there will obviously be people that will not embrace a digital format and walk away. Okay... but how much money are you saving compared to how much business turns away? Print can stay, but what we don’t need is $4-$5 weekly installments to our stories purchased from specialty shops. What needs to change is the comic format. Get rid of the continuity porn. Get rid of the crossovers. Get rid of the floppies. Instead release a square bound anthology book like Heavy Metal or a manga book, but with the DC properties. Top talent, loose deadlines, with a new focus on quality over flooding the shelves. Distribute directly to the consumer through an online marketplace. That in addition to digital, and the eventual premium collections for the more popular series, should have just about everyone catered to except people who buy these things strictly to put in a plastic sleeve without ever looking in them or reading them, and that is just simply not a demographic they can cater to at the expense of people who might consume the product as intended for much longer. The biggest sign we are in the final stages of print comics is people paying extra for a blank cover without any regard for the contents inside RANDOM ACTS 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
