GA COMIC BOOK Collecting in the Financial crisis of 2020 3 3

[ThothAmon]

On 4/5/2020 at 2:54 AM, szav said:

Allow any lawsuits for claims that you contracted coronavirus due to your job or workplace policies

Doubtful this could happen for the same reason employees aren’t allowed to sue for other injuries suffered at work. Workers Compensation. 

[tabcom]

13 hours ago, Cat-Man_America said:

The savvy collector has to take proper steps to prepare for bad weather while still keeping faith that some clouds do have silver ...or gold... linings.

I’ll leave the sky gazing to the Pollyannas. I prefer the stackable kind of silver or gold.

[Golden Memories]

 

 So I thought I would some information here

     It was previously Mentioned that 20% of covid patients develop heart issues

     I have seen the articles and none of them mention  chloroquine

    This supposed "wonder Drug"  has hideous  side effects , including 

    Liver damage, Brain Damage, Hallucinations, and others including inducing arrythmia 

https://www.newsweek.com/swedish-hospitals-chloroquine-covid-19-side-effects-1496368

   At my wifes hospital, anyone who takes this is REQUIRED to have a daily ekg , so the side effects are well known. 

   Also anyone who think a vaccine (still 2 years away) will close this out is mistaken for a number of reasons, first there at least

   9 known strains, second.  Also Scientists need to understand the pathogen (the same scientists who told us for months not to wear masks outside) in addition,  There have been numerous reports of persons supposedly cured becoming re-infected meaning

  this a very strong virus and vaccines will have minimal impact .

     What all this means is that we we will be dealing with this for a long time. 

  So how does this affect to comic market ?

       1) Some of my best customers were comic shop owners, buying for their customers , with shops closed all over the country and a recovery after the lockdown ends likely being slow, there goes a large portion of my market 

       2) Again as I sell golden age a large percentage of my customers are 50+ and many are unlikely  to feel safe enough to venture into a convention hall for quite some time , on other threads I see people saying they will avoid conventions , even some  insulting promoters for the ides of even having a show. 

      3) Large attendance conventions are unlikely for a while, my guess is August at best. 

      4) Even assuming the country opens on May 1, it will be slowly and in stages with a scared citizenry and thousands of small and medium businesses gone forever 

 

 I do not see "panic Selling"  unless this drags INTO 2021. But a downturn to some degree is inevitable 

Edited April 7, 2020 by Golden Memories

[tabcom]

2 hours ago, Cat-Man_America said:

1. Covid-19 will have long term physical consequences for some who recover from the pandemic.  

2. The scientific/medical community doesn’t have enough data on immunity after recovery to determine reinfection rate because the virus hasn’t been around long enough to conduct a valid statistical analysis.

An argument could be made that #2 negates #1

the scientific/medical community doesn’t have enough data on  long term physical consequences . . . because the virus hasn’t been around long enough to conduct a valid statistical analysis.

[tabcom]

2 hours ago, Cat-Man_America said:

3. There is no “wonder drug” ...just a couple of Hail Mary pharmaceuticals (chloroquine and hydro chloroquine) that certain parties are investing heavily in and promoting.

The intel I’ve read is less a Hail Mary, but more a chip shot.

[szav]

5 hours ago, Cat-Man_America said:

1. Sooner rather than later, a single payer medical system.  The Covid-19 crisis is exposing all the weaknesses of our existing insurance based health care system.  The public demand for single payer or some combination of insurance & government health care will win out.

Are you thinking were going to look at such single payer system Covid 19 successes as Italy, Portugal, and Spain and all clamor for single payer? 

Our healthcare system has problems for sure but its still the best in the world.  Pretty sure no other country has the number of medical tourists that the USA does, there's a reason for that.  Personally I'd rather see all health insurance abolished except catastrophic coverage that kicks in after a certain dollar amount (want to make sure no one is financially ruined by bad luck).  Make everything cash pay up to that point, so that people have some incentive to take care of themselves and not to overutilize our limited heath care resources. That has about as much chance as becoming reality as single payer does though.

Further, I'd encourage single payer advocates to take a look at what historically happens when the Fed takes something over...like say student loans.  Government guarantee to pay = no incentive to keep costs down, less innovation, more bloat.

5 hours ago, Cat-Man_America said:

just a couple of Hail Mary pharmaceuticals (chloroquine and hydro chloroquine) that certain parties are investing heavily in and promoting

Since this is actually my area of expertise I'll say that the truth on Hydroxychloroquine is probably somewhere in the middle.  It very likely helps a certain subset of people, people who are dying as a result of their immune system overresponse to the virus.  Hydroxychloroquine's method of action in helping with lupus and RA are not well understood, and for these conditions different people have a very wide range of reactions to even small doses.  I think when they do finally get to compile a lot of data they'll find that it has a small but statistically significant beneficial effect for a very small number of people who meet a very specific set of criteria.  It's not going to help everyone or even the majority of people, but it will help some people.  Hopefully we'll be able to figure out soon out which people can actually benefit from it, because it is a very nasty drug that can cause a lot of problems (though the worst problems it causes usually don't manifest until someone has been taking it for a long period of time).

[lou_fine]

7 hours ago, Cat-Man_America said:

As for the “what have you got to lose?” argument, the best response is “your life!”

If I were you, I would be very careful with what you say on these boards here because you might be upsetting some boardies' feelings if they know who you might be referring to with some of your comments.  

If so, being the cry babies they are, they'll go running and crying to big Mommy (nothing personal here as I really do love Mommy   ) who's working full-time from home.  Sadly, Mommy's going to have to apply the big boot to you in order to appease the cry babies..............so you should definitely be careful with saying either positive things or negative things one way or the other when it comes to this whole Coronavirus topic because it's definitely seen as burning red hot political dynamite by some members on the boards here.    

Edited April 8, 2020 by lou_fine

[Mmehdy]

29 minutes ago, lou_fine said:

If I were you, I would be very careful with what you say on these boards here because you might be upsetting some boardies' feelings if they know who you might be referring to with some of your comments.  

If so, being the cry babies they are, they'll go running and crying to big Mommy (nothing personal here as I really do love Mommy   ) who's working full-time from home.  Sadly, Mommy's going to have to apply the big boot to you in order to appease the cry babies..............so you should definitely be careful with saying either positive things or negative things one way or the other when it comes to this whole Coronavirus topic because it's definitely seen as burning red hot political dynamite by some members on the boards here.    

This thread is not political...it deals with reality. It would be safe to say, that  true GA/SA comic book collectors have vast experience not only in  comic book collecting but life in general. Everybody's best guess or opinion is welcome.

 I believe that the Virus cure and recovery  issues are tied to  FUTURE GA/SA comic book values. Any opinion, any speculation goes as far as I am concerned if it leads  to where we are headed in the future..bright or dark is fair game.. I think every board member will agree on two things 1-we do not have an exact time line for a cure of this virus nor a actual time line when we will be at full recovery of the economic and REGAIN stable GA/SA pricing. 2-We all want it sooner, than later. Bringing  these issues out will give everyone on this board a head up as to where we might be going in the future, and making life choices as to keeping your GA/SA comic book collection, retainment of future value of your collection, and what will our GA/SA comic book collecting  community look like and be after we get thru this crisis( and we will win). I tend to agree with Tabcom that it will be a chip shot beating this, its a question of time..which in todays, instant news society it will seem like forever. Our decision to Buy, Sell or Trade is at stake here. We will not act in a panic, but carefully.

 What makes me mad the most, when it comes to our GA/SA comic book collecting community is that this crisis will force some GA/SA comic book collectors not to have to sell by choice but by necessity.  This virus will not care how many years it took you to collect you GA/SA comic books., how much emotional  joy your collection has brought you., and that feeling of loss when part or all of your collection is gone. I understand much larger issues are at play here. But a loss is a loss..especially for our fellow collectors, some of whom may never return.

I am hopping that some of this downtime will increase activity on HA.com for example, collectors whom have time on their hands might discover other ways, such as E-Bay to find their GA/SA in different ways, and that might increase buying activity way after this crisis is over. Especially on platforms that do not rely upon in person sales. Our of boredom we could see big interest on HA's upcoming Signature auction. I am hoping that GA/SA collectors who have not read any great material lately do so. Our ability to rediscover, what is really great and important is NOW..and that excuse that we were too busy and too tired are out the door. Some of your GA/SA collectors have been in the "math" collecting business too long and just looking at the numbers...rediscover why you are here in the first place..GA/SA is great period. Writing, Illustrations, and truth, justice ,and the American way is our bloodline.

 Take advantage of this period of time, reread the books that you can or order some of the outstanding GA/SA reprint volumes and get back to GA/SA reality.

 

[lou_fine]

33 minutes ago, Mmehdy said:

2-We all want it sooner, than later.

On this, I think we can most definitely all agree on this 110%.  

[waaaghboss]

5 hours ago, szav said:

Are you thinking were going to look at such single payer system Covid 19 successes as Italy, Portugal, and Spain and all clamor for single payer? 

Our healthcare system has problems for sure but its still the best in the world.  Pretty sure no other country has the number of medical tourists that the USA does, there's a reason for that.  Personally I'd rather see all health insurance abolished except catastrophic coverage that kicks in after a certain dollar amount (want to make sure no one is financially ruined by bad luck).  Make everything cash pay up to that point, so that people have some incentive to take care of themselves and not to overutilize our limited heath care resources. That has about as much chance as becoming reality as single payer does though.

Further, I'd encourage single payer advocates to take a look at what historically happens when the Fed takes something over...like say student loans.  Government guarantee to pay = no incentive to keep costs down, less innovation, more bloat.

Since this is actually my area of expertise I'll say that the truth on Hydroxychloroquine is probably somewhere in the middle.  It very likely helps a certain subset of people, people who are dying as a result of their immune system overresponse to the virus.  Hydroxychloroquine's method of action in helping with lupus and RA are not well understood, and for these conditions different people have a very wide range of reactions to even small doses.  I think when they do finally get to compile a lot of data they'll find that it has a small but statistically significant beneficial effect for a very small number of people who meet a very specific set of criteria.  It's not going to help everyone or even the majority of people, but it will help some people.  Hopefully we'll be able to figure out soon out which people can actually benefit from it, because it is a very nasty drug that can cause a lot of problems (though the worst problems it causes usually don't manifest until someone has been taking it for a long period of time).

Well, with your student loan comparison, the loan is given to the student, who then is at the mercy of the bloated higher ed industry.  With single payer, doesn't the government itself negotiate the rate it pays?  Does the government pay whatever health care providers ask for with regard to Medicare and Medicaid?

[Cat-Man_America]

7 hours ago, tabcom said:

An argument could be made that #2 negates #1

the scientific/medical community doesn’t have enough data on  long term physical consequences . . . because the virus hasn’t been around long enough to conduct a valid statistical analysis.

Not really, that conflates two different issues.  The physical consequences are based on reports that 20% of recovered Covid-19 patients may have heart damage... 

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/heart-damage-in-covid-19-patients-puzzles-doctors/

Reinfection by the virus is where there isn't enough scientific data available to conduct valid statistical analysis.  

4 hours ago, szav said:

Are you thinking were going to look at such single payer system Covid 19 successes as Italy, Portugal, and Spain and all clamor for single payer? 

Our healthcare system has problems for sure but its still the best in the world.  Pretty sure no other country has the number of medical tourists that the USA does, there's a reason for that.  Personally I'd rather see all health insurance abolished except catastrophic coverage that kicks in after a certain dollar amount (want to make sure no one is financially ruined by bad luck).  Make everything cash pay up to that point, so that people have some incentive to take care of themselves and not to overutilize our limited heath care resources. That has about as much chance as becoming reality as single payer does though.

Further, I'd encourage single payer advocates to take a look at what historically happens when the Fed takes something over...like say student loans.  Government guarantee to pay = no incentive to keep costs down, less innovation, more bloat.

Since this is actually my area of expertise I'll say that the truth on Hydroxychloroquine is probably somewhere in the middle.  It very likely helps a certain subset of people, people who are dying as a result of their immune system overresponse to the virus.  Hydroxychloroquine's method of action in helping with lupus and RA are not well understood, and for these conditions different people have a very wide range of reactions to even small doses.  I think when they do finally get to compile a lot of data they'll find that it has a small but statistically significant beneficial effect for a very small number of people who meet a very specific set of criteria.  It's not going to help everyone or even the majority of people, but it will help some people.  Hopefully we'll be able to figure out soon out which people can actually benefit from it, because it is a very nasty drug that can cause a lot of problems (though the worst problems it causes usually don't manifest until someone has been taking it for a long period of time).

I'm not advocating or dismissing, just reading the tea leaves.  It depends on whether most folks come out of this believing the health care system as it exists today is working.  Not casting blame, just acknowledging the reality.  

Eventually it becomes a perception issue.  Did someone drop the ball, or not?  It's human nature to assess fault in retrospect, and the chips will fall where they may.  

An iceberg, misfortune and poor engineering sunk the Titanic, but who did the public consider culpable? (rhetorical question)

[lou_fine]

10 hours ago, szav said:

Our healthcare system has problems for sure but its still the best in the world.  Pretty sure no other country has the number of medical tourists that the USA does, there's a reason for that. 

Not sure if your point of view is correct here since I have yet to heard of any Canadian that would want to have the American user pay health care system over the government funded Canadian health care system.  

On a slightly different side issue, why are there caravans of American drug tourists that come all the way up to Canada to clean all of the insulin and other cheap drugs out of our pharmacies?    

[szav]

1 hour ago, lou_fine said:

Not sure if your point of view is correct here since I have yet to heard of any Canadian that would want to have the American user pay health care system over the government funded Canadian health care system.  

On a slightly different side issue, why are there caravans of American drug tourists that come all the way up to Canada to clean all of the insulin and other cheap drugs out of our pharmacies?    

The Canadians you know must be a lot more patient than the ones I know (there are many snowbirds where I live) and not mind that average 5 month wait for what they deem non critical care.  Also 2/3s of Canadians carry supplementary/private health insurance for all the things not covered by their 'universal' coverage.. 

On drug costs in the United States you're right.  There is rampant collusion and price fixing within that industry and with their accomplices in insurance and government here.  Single payer isn't the answer to that.  It's a real shame that our political parties here cant find the time between all the finger pointing, tweeting, and politicking to get to work on the prescription drug pricing reform.  I had been, perhaps naively, hopeful something was going to get done on that.

But … getting back on topic.  Comic books...

Edited April 8, 2020 by szav

[ArkhamCastle]

The drugs being touted as "why Not" seem to be working in many cases [See Representative from Michigan}.  As to side effects that seems to be a bit foolish in the sense that almost all drugs have side affects.  Just listen to any drug commercial on TV or read the paperwork included with the RX.  In many cases they seem worse than the illness.  Yes, I our drug companies have many faults but just watch where the cures come from.  Not interested in single payer system.  " You can keep your doctor, hospital and insurance company" Yea Right!

[tabcom]

A voice from the distant past has a message for all today.

‘This is the CENTRAL SCRUTINIZER… it is my responsibility to enforce all the laws that haven’t been passed yet. It is also my responsibility to alert each and every one of you to the potential consequences of various ordinary everyday activities you might be performing which could eventually lead to The Death Penalty….

.. Our studies have shown that this horrible force is so dangerous to society at large that laws are being drawn up at this very moment to stop it forever! Cruel and inhuman punishments are being carefully described in tiny paragraphs so they won’t conflict with the Constitution … which, itself, is being modified in order to accommodate THE FUTURE.’

 

[Readcomix]

2 hours ago, tabcom said:

A voice from the distant past has a message for all today.

‘This is the CENTRAL SCRUTINIZER… it is my responsibility to enforce all the laws that haven’t been passed yet. It is also my responsibility to alert each and every one of you to the potential consequences of various ordinary everyday activities you might be performing which could eventually lead to The Death Penalty….

.. Our studies have shown that this horrible force is so dangerous to society at large that laws are being drawn up at this very moment to stop it forever! Cruel and inhuman punishments are being carefully described in tiny paragraphs so they won’t conflict with the Constitution … which, itself, is being modified in order to accommodate THE FUTURE.’

 

Do I get a doughnut? 

[bluechip]

On 4/7/2020 at 6:32 PM, szav said:

 

Further, I'd encourage single payer advocates to take a look at what historically happens when the Fed takes something over...like say student loans.  Government guarantee to pay = no incentive to keep costs down, less innovation, more bloat.

 

What you describe only happened with student loans because the Congress designed it to be corrupted, carving out sweet sweet deals for the middlemen who took taxpayer money at extremely low interest which they were then able to loan to students at highly inflated interest.   And to top it off they rigged the bankrupcty laws so that student loans could never be forgiven -- essentially making it so the swampy middlemen got guaranteed profits with no risk.   

When an attempt was made to fix the middleman problem it was decried as a "government takeover of the student loan industry" even though it was, and remains, government money behind the loans.

That was not a problem "...when the Fed takes something over..." but a problem when the Fed created an unholy alliance between the government and private industry to ensure private profits and subvert the supposed good intentions behind the program.   As economic "ism"s go that made our student loan program a lot less like the "S" word ism and more like the "F" word.  

[fifties]

3 hours ago, bluechip said:

 

That was not a problem "...when the Fed takes something over..." but a problem when the Fed created an unholy alliance between the government and private industry to ensure private profits

Nothing new.  Ike warned about "the military-industrial complex", a union of defense contractors and the armed forces, back in 1961...

[porcupine48]

6 hours ago, Readcomix said:

Do I get a doughnut? 

Donuts only! 

[Tri-Color Brian]

On 4/7/2020 at 9:47 PM, Mmehdy said:

1-we do not have an exact time line to.... REGAIN stable GA/SA pricing....

When has GA/SA pricing been stable in the last 30 years?  Seems to me we have had many fluctuations in price.  Prices rise steeply, plateau, drop a little, plateau again, and then rise again.  It has never seemed stable to me.  A true collector does not panic, is in it for the long haul, and waits for the next upswing or hot genre to take off.  I think the idea of mass liquidation is absurd.  We're mostly collectors...not investors that watch the ups and downs of the market all day long.  Most of us do not have our fortunes tied up in this hobby to the point of financial ruin (unless you are a dealer or speculator).  All my comics are paid for.  I am not in debt because of this hobby, and if some of you are you might want to rethink what your idea of a hobby is.  And, if by some miracle we see a major sell off and prices drop by 50% or more, I think most of us will think it's Christmas and buy as much as we can.  I know I would...

Edited April 9, 2020 by Tri-ColorBrian