IN THE ERA OF COVID19...BUYER'S MARKET? 9 9

[Paul © ® ⚽️💙™]

2 minutes ago, Motor City Rob said:

I still believe that as long as you are only bidding as much as you're willing to pay, including all fees and premiums...what's that problem??? Companies can charge whatever they want. If people think it's too much, don't buy from them. It's really thay simple. Obviously people continue to buy from them, so the premiums will continue until people stop. I don't blame Heritage at all. 

I take your point, and personally I do not buy from them.

I do blame Heritage. It's pure out and out greed, but until people make a stand and refuse to comply, and continue to chase books like a pack of wolves chasing a sheep, nothing will change.

It may well be an idealist POV, but nothing changes until people do something to enforce change. 

[Motor City Rob]

4 minutes ago, G G ® said:

I take your point, and personally I do not buy from them.

I do blame Heritage. It's pure out and out greed, but until people make a stand and refuse to comply, and continue to chase books like a pack of wolves chasing a sheep, nothing will change.

It may well be an idealist POV, but nothing changes until people do something to enforce change. 

I hear you. I've just never bought into the "greed" theory because it's not like the people being accused of greed are stealing. Buyers are willfully giving money to them. No one is twisting their arm. I agree with you that until people become more responsible with their money, nothing will change. 

 

[Paul © ® ⚽️💙™]

7 minutes ago, Motor City Rob said:

I hear you. I've just never bought into the "greed" theory because it's not like the people being accused of greed are stealing. Buyers are willfully giving money to them. No one is twisting their arm. I agree with you that until people become more responsible with their money, nothing will change. 

 

I'm still waiting for the day when I can be completely irresponsible with money. 

Sadly I don't think I will ever ascend into that decadent echelon of buyers. 

[lou_fine]

2 hours ago, G G ® said:

2 hours ago, Motor City Rob said:

I still believe that as long as you are only bidding as much as you're willing to pay, including all fees and premiums...what's that problem??? Companies can charge whatever they want. If people think it's too much, don't buy from them. It's really thay simple. Obviously people continue to buy from them, so the premiums will continue until people stop. I don't blame Heritage at all. 

I take your point, and personally I do not buy from them.

To tell you the honest truth, I actually have more of a problem with the CL auction format as opposed to either HA or CC's auction format since you will always know exactly what you have to pay in order to win the book.  It is up to you and you alone and nobody else, if you want to bump the price up to the next bidding increment in order to win the book.  

With the CL or I guess the eBay open auction format, you never really know what the other competing bidders or snipe bidders might be throwing in at the last second, and hence you are much more tempted to toss in a unwarranted higher bid if you really want to win a certain book than you might otherwise do.  In this type of auction format, you don't really know exactly what it would take to win a book and exactly how much you should really be bidding at the end. It's really much more like a shot in the dark with this type of auction format.  

Edited June 2, 2020 by lou_fine

[Paul © ® ⚽️💙™]

5 minutes ago, lou_fine said:

To tell you the honest truth, I actually have more of a problem with the CL auction format as opposed to either HA or CC's auction format since you will always know exactly what you have to pay in order to win the book.  It is up to you and you alone and nobody else, if you want to bump the price up to the next bidding increment in order to win the book.  

With the CL or I guess the eBay open auction format, you never really know what the other competing bidders or snipe bidders might be throwing in at the last second, and hence you are much more tempted to toss in a unwarranted higher bid if you really want to win a certain book than you might otherwise do.  In this type of auction format, you don't really know exactly what it would take to win a book and exactly how much you should really be bidding at the end. It's really much more like a shot in the dark with this type of auction format.  

I agree. I don't use CL either.

[lou_fine]

2 minutes ago, G G ® said:

I agree. I don't use CL either.

How about eBay then since their open auction format works on the same concept?  

As a counter argument though, it's always up to you as the bidder on the item to only bid as much as you really want to spend for the particular item in question.  

I just don't like the fact that you are tempted to throw in a higher bid just in case somebody else comes in at the last secon if it's a certain item that you really want.  

[Paul © ® ⚽️💙™]

Just now, lou_fine said:

How about eBay then since their open auction format works on the same concept?  

As a counter argument though, it's always up to you as the bidder on the item to only bid as much as you really want to spend for the particular item in question.  

I just don't like the fact that you are tempted to throw in a higher bid just in case somebody else comes in at the last secon if it's a certain item that you really want.  

I like ebay as a buyer generally, not as a seller.

On BINs I either source the seller's dot com site or I make an offer thru their system or via pm. If they say no, I move along. Most comic books are like buses...there's always another that will be along.

[Myowncollector]

Still on this huh. I don't have a problem with any of the sites formats. I snipe at the last second. I don't even look at the item until the last minute. Something that might be a good deal 2 days or 2 hours before end can already be maxed out at end of auction. I put in my max bid and that's it. I win or don't. Nothing is going to temp me to over pay. The last highest bid is the only one that matters so I only put in a single bid. Heritage can have a 50% or 80 % buyer fee. Just part of the price. Long as they make it clear which they do. If anything with heritage or comic connect format it allows the losing bidders to run you guys up more. Ok so my max wasn't enough. I will put in a few more bids, if I win it I can live with that price but most likely I will just run this guy up, he can have this book but gonna make him pay for it. 

[Myowncollector]

14 hours ago, G G ® said:

Or not, I never buy, and have never bought from them on principle.

You are a better person than me. I don't buy from them because I don't see any deals. But their are some books I want and ready to pay full pop so they can charge the seller whatever they want. I just want their book. Not worried about how much $ heritage is taking from them. They choose to use them. 

[Myowncollector]

11 hours ago, G G ® said:

Bold statement from someone who's been here 5 minutes.

At least doom is here. Nobody else is. Is it just me or is it dead. Same few people keeping any activity. Doom probably accounts for 20% of the activity. Once sports start, lockdiwnds and covid winds down how will it look in here then? 

Forum went off topic but it's not going to be a buyers market until unemployment is finished. 

[littledoom]

When I bid on ebay I bid immediately when I see the item with my max bid (factoring taxes and shipping). I rarely ever follow up with all the auctions I bid on. I don't have the time to see the dwindling hours, minutes, seconds... I'm starting to actually get deals now as "this era" tapers... the best way is to enter a best offer when the seller lists it as an auction as well

Edited June 3, 2020 by littledoom

[VintageComics]

9 hours ago, G G ® said:

I do blame Heritage. It's pure out and out greed, but until people make a stand and refuse to comply, and continue to chase books like a pack of wolves chasing a sheep, nothing will change.

It may well be an idealist POV, but nothing changes until people do something to enforce change. 

As a buyer, Heritage's fees don't affect you at all. You just bid what you want to bid.

As a seller, you can decide whether you want to sell with Heritage or not but you get a lot of benefits when you sell through them.

And I'm not defending Heritage because I use them...I rarely do. But what I will say that as far as auction houses go, their infrastructure is ridiculously good and all that costs money so that's where the fees are going.

Their website is top notch. Massive scans, easy to use, full database of all previous sales going back almost 20 years, video feed of live auctions. There really isn't another collectibles auction site like it. There's a reason they're the largest collectibles auction house in the world (they auction dozens of different types of collectibles, not just comics - if you want a meteor or a dinosaur bone you can buy one from Heritage). And they mail out a world class catalogue that most collectors keep and collect themselves. If you've never seen one of their catalogues they are the quality of a high end coffee table book.

All of that infrastructure brings a large swath of buyers from all over the world.

So it's not like they're just squandering the money they make.

[Hollywood1892]

4 hours ago, VintageComics said:

As a buyer, Heritage's fees don't affect you at all. You just bid what you want to bid.

As a seller, you can decide whether you want to sell with Heritage or not but you get a lot of benefits when you sell through them.

And I'm not defending Heritage because I use them...I rarely do. But what I will say that as far as auction houses go, their infrastructure is ridiculously good and all that costs money so that's where the fees are going.

Their website is top notch. Massive scans, easy to use, full database of all previous sales going back almost 20 years, video feed of live auctions. There really isn't another collectibles auction site like it. There's a reason they're the largest collectibles auction house in the world (they auction dozens of different types of collectibles, not just comics - if you want a meteor or a dinosaur bone you can buy one from Heritage). And they mail out a world class catalogue that most collectors keep and collect themselves. If you've never seen one of their catalogues they are the quality of a high end coffee table book.

All of that infrastructure brings a large swath of buyers from all over the world.

So it's not like they're just squandering the money they make.

So if I bid $1000 is that all I have to pay?

I'll elaborate

If a book generally sells for $1000 regardless of buyers premium ect ect, and I go to Heritage and bid a certain amount below that number because I'm factoring in the BP will the hammer drop at $1000 including the buyers premium? If that is the case then I'm paying FMV but if I bid at X and someone else bids at $1000 not factoring the BP % then they are paying well over $1000

That impacts GPA and gocollect in determining FMV of a product and now sellers outside of Heritage will demand what that final price was on Heritage for books they are selling

(If this is confusing I'll explain in greater detail when I wake up)

Edited June 3, 2020 by Hollywood1892

[theCapraAegagrus]

That a free-market economy...

[1Cool]

Fees seem high and I have not ever needed anything on their site so I avoid their site.  Pretty easy solution on both fronts.

[VintageComics]

4 hours ago, Hollywood1892 said:

So if I bid $1000 is that all I have to pay?

I'll elaborate

If a book generally sells for $1000 regardless of buyers premium ect ect, and I go to Heritage and bid a certain amount below that number because I'm factoring in the BP will the hammer drop at $1000 including the buyers premium? If that is the case then I'm paying FMV but if I bid at X and someone else bids at $1000 not factoring the BP % then they are paying well over $1000

That impacts GPA and gocollect in determining FMV of a product and now sellers outside of Heritage will demand what that final price was on Heritage for books they are selling

(If this is confusing I'll explain in greater detail when I wake up)

How is that any different than if someone bis $1200 for a book on eBay while you only wanted to bid $1000?

The bidder just wanted the book more and was willing to pay for it regardless of the site.

[Krismusic]

9 hours ago, VintageComics said:

As a buyer, Heritage's fees don't affect you at all. You just bid what you want to bid.

As a seller, you can decide whether you want to sell with Heritage or not but you get a lot of benefits when you sell through them.

And I'm not defending Heritage because I use them...I rarely do. But what I will say that as far as auction houses go, their infrastructure is ridiculously good and all that costs money so that's where the fees are going.

Their website is top notch. Massive scans, easy to use, full database of all previous sales going back almost 20 years, video feed of live auctions. There really isn't another collectibles auction site like it. There's a reason they're the largest collectibles auction house in the world (they auction dozens of different types of collectibles, not just comics - if you want a meteor or a dinosaur bone you can buy one from Heritage). And they mail out a world class catalogue that most collectors keep and collect themselves. If you've never seen one of their catalogues they are the quality of a high end coffee table book.

All of that infrastructure brings a large swath of buyers from all over the world.

So it's not like they're just squandering the money they make.

Dang I didn’t know they sold dinosaur bones... hmm might have to go check to see if I can get one. Meteorites something about them I don’t trust like how do I know it came from space and not from someone’s back yard... 

[VintageComics]

4 minutes ago, Krismusic said:

Dang I didn’t know they sold dinosaur bones... hmm might have to go check to see if I can get one. Meteorites something about them I don’t trust like how do I know it came from space and not from someone’s back yard... 

You could have bought an entire T Rex if you wanted to.

https://historical.ha.com/heritage-auctions-press-releases-and-news/tyrannosaurus-brings-1-052-500-at-heritage-auctions-new-york-event.s?releaseId=2213

[Paul © ® ⚽️💙™]

4 minutes ago, VintageComics said:

You could have bought an entire T Rex if you wanted to.

https://historical.ha.com/heritage-auctions-press-releases-and-news/tyrannosaurus-brings-1-052-500-at-heritage-auctions-new-york-event.s?releaseId=2213

 

 

[VintageComics]

When someone has had too much to drink and they're hunched over with their arms in front of them I call it 'T Rex mode'