Key silver age Marvel pages. What does and doesn’t exist? 2 2

[Grant Turner]

Spider-Man pages, is there anything out there prior to issue #6?

I’ve seen FF 3, 5, 9, and above. What about 4, 6, 7, 8?

Hulk 1, 2?

Avengers 4?

x-men 3, 4?

TOS 39, 57?

Strange Tales other than 117?  What about 135?

Does anyone know any stories about the existence of any of the above?
 

[JadeGiant]

I spoke with a comic shop owner who said he personally saw 2 complete early ASM issues in a collection. It was either issues 2 and 3 or issues 3 and 4. Does that mean I "know" of their existence? No, but I have no reason to doubt him. 

[jjonahjameson11]

5 hours ago, Grant Turner said:

Spider-Man pages, is there anything out there prior to issue #6?

I’ve seen FF 3, 5, 9, and above. What about 4, 6, 7, 8?

Hulk 1, 2?

Avengers 4?

x-men 3, 4?

TOS 39, 57?

Strange Tales other than 117?  What about 135?

Does anyone know any stories about the existence of any of the above?
 

There was a thread it too long ago on this board about the artwork that was catalogued by marvel employee Irene Vartinov? In the early/mid 1970’s.  That list was later printed in an issue of The Comics Journal, and it was noted that stacks of OA were stored in the Marvel offices at some time, grew legs, and disappeared.

 

[Unstoppablejayd]

Anthony Snyder has the splash to xmen 4 I have seen it in person

[Twanj]

X-Men #1

https://www.ha.com/c/search-results.zx?N=0+790+231&Ntk=SI_Titles-Desc&Nty=1&Ntt=kirby+x-men+1&ic4=KeywordSearch-A-K-071316

[kbmcvay]

The complete book of FF 11 (no cover) appeared on that Profiles in History tv series a few years ago. I think they auctioned it, but I'm not 100% on that.

[JadeGiant]

Someone needs to set up a virtual archive - this is great info!

[glendgold]

7 hours ago, Grant Turner said:

Spider-Man pages, is there anything out there prior to issue #6?

I’ve seen FF 3, 5, 9, and above. What about 4, 6, 7, 8?

Hulk 1, 2?

Avengers 4?

x-men 3, 4?

TOS 39, 57?

Strange Tales other than 117?  What about 135?

Does anyone know any stories about the existence of any of the above?
 

It's weird how knowledge keeps vanishing over and over now that all the knowledge in the world is preserved on the internet.  Never get how that works, but it's pretty consistent.

Anyway, all of these exist.  Have we seen pages to them in the marketplace?  Not all of them.  But the only real question about what exists and what doesn't in Marvel's past are pre-1966 covers.  No one knows for sure what happened to them, but odds are pretty strong 95% of them ended up in landfill.  Interiors, not so much.  They seem to have kept all of those.  Books that haven't shown up (like FF 4) are strongly believed to be in long-time collections.  Of everything you've listed, I'd say the ones I've never even heard whispers about are Hulk 1 and Hulk 2.  But I very much doubt they're shredded -- just buried.

FF 7 pages are out there and have been auctioned off.  FF 8 is complete. TOS 39 has been auctioned off twice. A few collectors have seen pages to every early ASM book except #2, and even then some folks insist they've seen it. 

Are you asking about every single Strange Tales book?  You mean the Ditko stories or are you including the Torch/SHIELD stuff?  They exist.  Have you look at the HA archives or in CAF?  There are pages from (just at a glance) 125, 129, 131, 141, etc.  #114, that story where the woman's face was redrawn by Bell or Heck - that one's out there, too.  Ditko did seem to get more of these back than ASM work, but the specifics are unclear.  If you're talking about Kirby's part of #135, yeah, there are multiple pages around.  According to the manifest, Jack got 8 pages back in 1987, which suggests Ayers got the rest.

I only know for sure of a couple pages actually being destroyed, and not for the reasons you'd think.  The most famous is FF 5 -- the first three pages were ripped so that the top tiers are now gone.  Someone would need to look up the specifics in the Jack Kirby collector, but IIRC, a guy who worked in the warehouse said his manager made him tear the pages up to show his contempt for the job.  (I know, right?)  The story about Ditko using Strange Tales stories as a cutting board seems to have been a fantasy.  Back in the '90s, when I was buying my first Kirby art, the dealer offered me a couple other pages to the same story -- Monstrollo -- which I couldn't afford.  So he sold them to another collector along with a complete story, The Ghost Rode a Rollercoaster.  A week or so after the deal, the collector called the dealer and asked where all the pages were -- he'd opened the package, taken everything out, and only realized the two Monstrollo pages weren't there - along with a couple pages to the Ghost story.  Turns out the dealer had spread the pages out in multiple layers of the package and the collector had mistaken one of them for extra padding.  So he tossed out four pages.  Oops. 

One caveat about that story - the collector in question wasn't exactly the most trustworthy guy in the world.  I'm not 100% sure the story is true, but if anyone would accidentally throw out Kirby art, it's also this guy.

 

 

 

[Twanj]

Here are some old threads, not sure which is the one with all the info:

 

 

 

 

[pemart1966]

6 hours ago, JadeGiant said:

I spoke with a comic shop owner who said he personally saw 2 complete early ASM issues in a collection. It was either issues 2 and 3 or issues 3 and 4. Does that mean I "know" of their existence? No, but I have no reason to doubt him. 

I think that the pin up for #3 is out there so the story itself may be complete but probably not the entire issue - if that makes sense

[grapeape]

5 hours ago, pemart1966 said:

I think that the pin up for #3 is out there so the story itself may be complete but probably not the entire issue - if that makes sense

Yep David Mandel owns it

[NoMan]

22 hours ago, Twanj said:

Here are some old threads, not sure which is the one with all the info:

 

 

 

 

My threads usually have the most info.

That being said, I wish I had the AF15 OA. I'd make prints of it and sell 'em on t-shirts at that Forever-21 store on Rodeo Drive in Beverly Hills and the one in Sherman Oaks. I'd bring the t-shirts to the store in person, they would sell out so I'd have to restock the store. I'd become friends with all the young lady sales staff, maybe asking one or two for a date. I'd go out with lots of young ladies. Meet their friends. Go to parties and stuff. I think this would be a better use of AF15 OA then having it sit in some musty old museum nobody goes to.

 Actually after watching some "Forever 21 Sales Women" on Youtube, I want to stab my eyes out and take a screwdriver to my ear drums. So I guess I'm not the right person for ownership of AF15 OA after all. I yearn for the days of yesterday when you had to know how to load a film magazine, know what lighting instrument does what, know your way around a light meter and lighting ratios and know how to use a Steinbeck flatbed before you could just post vomit on the internet.

I've been inside too long...

Edited April 8, 2020 by NoMan

[RBerman]

1 hour ago, NoMan said:

I wish I had the AF15 OA. I'd make prints of it and sell 'em on t-shirts at that Forever-21 store on Rodeo Drive in Beverly Hills and the one in Sherman Oaks. I'd bring the t-shirts to the store in person, they would sell out so I'd have to restock the store. I'd become friends with all the young lady sales staff, maybe asking one or two for a date. I'd go out with lots of young ladies. Meet their friends. Go to parties and stuff. I think this would be a better use of AF15 OA then having it sit in some musty old museum nobody goes to.

Speaking of an amazing fantasy...

[joefixit2]

If someone could post if the early Hulk pages still exist along with who owns them, where that person lives, and what times during the day they are not at home, I would appreciate it.

 

It would be great to have a list somewhere showing what pages are definitely know to exist.    Along with maybe artwork we know no longer exists.  Erik Larsen had that house fires years past and lost a lot of OA, not sure if it was ever documented what exactly he lost.

[NoMan]

who owns the Dark Knight Returns cover for #1? I know somebody posted a picture standing next to it. Some kinda comic artist. I dunno, Rob Leitchfield? I don't need their home address just nosy is all.

Edited April 9, 2020 by NoMan

[artdealer]

2 hours ago, NoMan said:

who owns the Dark Knight Returns cover for #1? I know somebody posted a picture standing next to it. Some kinda comic artist. I dunno, Rob Leitchfield? I don't need their home address just nosy is all.

Well, I sold it several years ago, but not to an artist.

[delekkerste]

6 hours ago, NoMan said:

who owns the Dark Knight Returns cover for #1? I know somebody posted a picture standing next to it. Some kinda comic artist. I dunno, Rob Leitchfield? I don't need their home address just nosy is all.

IIRC, Rob Liefeld posed with it and posted a photo when it was displayed at NYCC in 2018 at Frank Miller's booth, but, he's not the owner. 

[NoMan]

4 hours ago, artdealer said:

Well, I sold it several years ago, but not to an artist.

Love to know the whole story, but again I'm always putting my nose where it doesn't belong. Good for you, I guess.

[Unstoppablejayd]

1 hour ago, NoMan said:

Love to know the whole story, but again I'm always putting my nose where it doesn't belong. Good for you, I guess.

As of 2011 it was in possession of Lynn Varley according to there divorce battle

https://ohdannyboy.blogspot.com/2020/04/original-art-stories-miller-vs-varley.html?spref=fb&fbclid=IwAR2zSJfiF-bTxFrGWyI06h4bjRlN15nUTxhE1zeGcLWu3wu0JTh8rhmPxpk

[NoMan]

19 minutes ago, Unstoppablejayd said:

As of 2011 it was in possession of Lynn Varley according to there divorce battle

https://ohdannyboy.blogspot.com/2020/04/original-art-stories-miller-vs-varley.html?spref=fb&fbclid=IwAR2zSJfiF-bTxFrGWyI06h4bjRlN15nUTxhE1zeGcLWu3wu0JTh8rhmPxpk

thank you. gonna read that after I try to get the dog away from the door/mailman

Edit: Just read it. What a mess. Now I've got a headache. Who wants to get involved with that? Keep the artwork.

Edited April 9, 2020 by NoMan