grapeape Posted July 12, 2020 Share Posted July 12, 2020 5 hours ago, Rick2you2 said: Personally, I would not be too interested in whether there was original art under a stat or not. A lot of the value in this hobby, both financially and aesthetically, is based on a nostalgia factor. So, the original is what would matter most. The fact that there is, essentially, “rejected” art under a stat is a very small consolation prize. I would value it like an artist’s simple sketch, doodle, or a piece of a prelim. With that said, I go my own way in OA, and many may not agree. Stats don’t bother me for background like a panel of buildings etc. if a major character is a stat panel it does put me off buying/ unless the original art is there underneath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjonahjameson11 Posted July 12, 2020 Share Posted July 12, 2020 1 hour ago, Michael Browning said: I thought that Amazing Spider-Man #266 cover by Cowan and Rubenstein sold really low at $13,000 ($16,200 with BP). What caused it to sell so low? It’s so fugly that a lot of the usual suspects didn’t bid on it marktom, vodou and AnkurJ 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronty Posted July 12, 2020 Share Posted July 12, 2020 Oh wow, yeah, I just googled it. THAT one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlo M Posted July 12, 2020 Share Posted July 12, 2020 (edited) My summary thoughts on this auction: Strong (unxpected) prices - JBuscema Thor 209 splash 20400 - iconic image but I don't recall seeing anything that high from so late in the run - JBuscema FF 107 (9000) and Avengers 77 (9600) - again I don't think I have seen those levels before from those runs if you exclude the Hulk vs Thing pages - D Cockrum XM 100 second last page 23400 - this was 19600 just a year ago, strong performance there (+18% in one year)- - - BWS Machine Man fight page vs Iron Man - 11400, another record, I believe... About right - JKirby FF 95 114000 - right level considering smallish FF and somewhat annymous villain - JKirby Cap 101 page 10800 - there that seems like the right, stabilised level of a nice Kirby SA page - Bob Brown DD splash 6600, one of the best splashes from his run, otherwise quite forgettable, IMHO - SBuscema Defenders 6 cover 43200 - that is the current level for high quality Busema covers, regardless what the haters say... Good Buys NAdams Batman 226 cover 52800 - looks great to me, anybody knows why it was so "affordable"? GColan Tales of Suspense large art page (Iron Man) - 12000, must look great in large art size Not many good buys...so much for the Corona effect... Carlo Edited July 13, 2020 by Carlo M Correction of one number Hekla, zhamlau and Twanj 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delekkerste Posted July 12, 2020 Share Posted July 12, 2020 (edited) 59 minutes ago, Carlo M said: My summary thoughts on this auction: JKirby FF 95 132000 - right level considering smallish FF and somewhat annymous villain It only fetched $114K. I also think the figures are quite nicely sized. Edited July 12, 2020 by delekkerste Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grapeape Posted July 12, 2020 Share Posted July 12, 2020 5 hours ago, Michael Browning said: I thought that Amazing Spider-Man #266 cover by Cowan and Rubenstein sold really low at $13,000 ($16,200 with BP). What caused it to sell so low? Michael I thought it would hit $20 K so it was not to far off. Michael Browning 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delekkerste Posted July 12, 2020 Share Posted July 12, 2020 2 minutes ago, grapeape said: Michael I thought it would hit $20 K so it was not to far off. I don't know anyone who had it even at $20K. Consensus among The Cabal my friends was the mid-teens, which was bang-on the mark. I think the feeling was that there was good nostalgia there for those of us of a certain age, but, at the end of the day, it's not one of the artists most associated with the run and it was a pair of D-list villains. On the plus side, decent image, black costume, nostalgia. I think it sold for the right price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grapeape Posted July 12, 2020 Share Posted July 12, 2020 5 minutes ago, delekkerste said: I don't know anyone who had it even at $20K. Consensus among The Cabal my friends was the mid-teens, which was bang-on the mark. I think the feeling was that there was good nostalgia there for those of us of a certain age, but, at the end of the day, it's not one of the artists most associated with the run and it was a pair of D-list villains. On the plus side, decent image, black costume, nostalgia. I think it sold for the right price. I don’t disagree I think the price is on target. I just guessed that a collector would round up to $20 K to say they have an ASM cover. I would never argue with the Cab....ahh never mind —some things are best left unsaid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjonahjameson11 Posted July 12, 2020 Share Posted July 12, 2020 1 hour ago, Carlo M said: My summary thoughts on this auction: Strong (unxpected) prices - JBuscema Thor 209 splash 20400 - iconic image but I don't recall seeing anything that high from so late in the run - JBuscema FF 107 (9000) and Avengers 77 (9600) - again I don't think I have seen those levels before from those runs if you exclude the Hulk vs Thing pages - D Cockrum XM 100 second last page 23400 - this was 19600 just a year ago, strong performance there (+20% in one year)- - - BWS Machine Man fight page vs Iron Man - 11400, another record, I believe... About right - JKirby FF 95 132000 - right level considering smallish FF and somewhat annymous villain - JKirby Cap 101 page 10800 - there that seems like the right, stabilised level of a nice Kirby SA page - Bob Brown DD splash 6600, one of the best splashes from his run, otherwise quite forgettable, IMHO - SBuscema Defenders 6 cover - that is the current level for high quality Busema covers, regardless what the haters say... Good Buys NAdams Batman 226 cover 52800 - looks great to me, anybody knows why it was so "affordable"? GColan Tales of Suspense large art page (Iron Man) - 12000, must look great in large art size Not many good buys...so much for the Corona effect... Carlo Carlo, I think you’re right about the Sal Buscema Defenders covers. It’s rather surprising to see the strong uptick in Sal cover art over the past 3 years. Actually, looking over some results on Heritage Archives, the rise has been incredibly strong! some very recent company include: -Defenders 9 cover = $102K -Defenders 8 cover = $42K zhamlau, grapeape and Twanj 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlo M Posted July 13, 2020 Share Posted July 13, 2020 15 hours ago, delekkerste said: It only fetched $114K. I also think the figures are quite nicely sized. That is absolutely right, thank you for the correction. I had 114k in mind when I wrote the comment but I mechanically transcripted the wrong line from my notes. I have edited the post with the right number. Not sure what you mean by "the figures are quite nicely sized"....any other mistakes? I checked them again.... Carlo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinkininkin Posted July 13, 2020 Share Posted July 13, 2020 18 hours ago, Carlo M said: My summary thoughts on this auction: Strong (unxpected) prices - JBuscema Thor 209 splash 20400 - iconic image but I don't recall seeing anything that high from so late in the run - JBuscema FF 107 (9000) and Avengers 77 (9600) - again I don't think I have seen those levels before from those runs if you exclude the Hulk vs Thing pages - D Cockrum XM 100 second last page 23400 - this was 19600 just a year ago, strong performance there (+18% in one year)- - - BWS Machine Man fight page vs Iron Man - 11400, another record, I believe... About right - JKirby FF 95 114000 - right level considering smallish FF and somewhat annymous villain - JKirby Cap 101 page 10800 - there that seems like the right, stabilised level of a nice Kirby SA page - Bob Brown DD splash 6600, one of the best splashes from his run, otherwise quite forgettable, IMHO - SBuscema Defenders 6 cover 43200 - that is the current level for high quality Busema covers, regardless what the haters say... Good Buys NAdams Batman 226 cover 52800 - looks great to me, anybody knows why it was so "affordable"? GColan Tales of Suspense large art page (Iron Man) - 12000, must look great in large art size Not many good buys...so much for the Corona effect... Carlo Neal Adams art is a big focus of my collecting, and that Batman 226 is just not a well drawn cover. Adams stuff can look "wonky" and awkward at times, even stuff from his prime and this is no exception. I'd have zero interest in this cover (no disrespect to the buyer and seller) and I'm it's target audience, so I don't think the price is a "bargain" IMHO. Sideshow Bob 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delekkerste Posted July 13, 2020 Share Posted July 13, 2020 2 hours ago, Carlo M said: Not sure what you mean by "the figures are quite nicely sized"....any other mistakes? I checked them again.... Carlo The figures don't look "smallish" to me on the cover. That's how I would describe Spider-Man on the Web of Spidey Annual #2 cover that was posted earlier in this thread. At least 3 of the 4 FF are decently sized here. So much so that there isn't even any room to add a villain or other key element to the cover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlo M Posted July 13, 2020 Share Posted July 13, 2020 56 minutes ago, delekkerste said: The figures don't look "smallish" to me on the cover. That's how I would describe Spider-Man on the Web of Spidey Annual #2 cover that was posted earlier in this thread. At least 3 of the 4 FF are decently sized here. So much so that there isn't even any room to add a villain or other key element to the cover. Got it! Yoe were referring to the sizes of the FF images, I thought you were making references to the numbers in email. Got to be patients with those foreigners! On the size of the figures on the FF cover, what I meant - and I think there was another post to this effect - is that you can really see only part of Sue's and Reed's faces. Yes you have most of Reed's body, but not exactly in the most heroic representation (admittedly Reed's power is not easy to make iconic). And the Torch is definitely looking away. But I agree it is a good cover, with great architecture backgrounds and the pogo plane etc. I just did not expect it to go much higher than that. Re the N Adams Batman 226 cover I had another look. I am definitely not a Batman Adams expert, but Batman's image seems quite good to me, but I may be skewed by the black background (I tend to be partial to lots of black on OA). But the foe's legs are definitely out or proportion. exitmusicblue 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exitmusicblue Posted July 13, 2020 Share Posted July 13, 2020 I see what both sides are getting at here. The Thing's expression is pretty funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delekkerste Posted July 13, 2020 Share Posted July 13, 2020 15 minutes ago, Carlo M said: I am definitely not a Batman Adams expert, but Batman's image seems quite good to me, but I may be skewed by the black background (I tend to be partial to lots of black on OA). More ink spilled on the page = More $$$ People laughed when I first said that, but, it's true (up to a point...it's like a Laffer Curve. 100% black ink on a comic art page isn't going to be worth anything on a comic art page). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will_K Posted July 13, 2020 Share Posted July 13, 2020 13 minutes ago, Carlo M said: Re the N Adams Batman 226 cover I had another look. I am definitely not a Batman Adams expert, but Batman's image seems quite good to me, but I may be skewed by the black background (I tend to be partial to lots of black on OA). But the foe's legs are definitely out or proportion. No comment on the price, Adams is not where I would spend that kind of $$$ anyway. I think the Batman figure is generally fine. But it looks like Adams was trying for some Kirby-style foreshortening on Bats' hands/arms. Bats' right hand is a little exaggerated and the left arm is a little wonky. The figure in the back also has some foreshortening "issues". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skizz Posted July 13, 2020 Share Posted July 13, 2020 (edited) 15 minutes ago, delekkerste said: More ink spilled on the page = More $$$ This does seem to be the case unfortunately. Throw in some cross-hatching or ink splatter, and collectors lose their mind! Takes the skills of somebody like Moebius to alter this perception. Edited July 13, 2020 by Skizz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vodou Posted July 13, 2020 Share Posted July 13, 2020 1 hour ago, delekkerste said: The figures don't look "smallish" to me on the cover. Yeah. Same size as usual. Not sure why people can't see this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vodou Posted July 13, 2020 Share Posted July 13, 2020 24 minutes ago, Skizz said: Takes the skills of somebody like Moebius to alter this perception. I see your Moebius will raise with a Toth. Skizz 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhamlau Posted July 14, 2020 Share Posted July 14, 2020 On 7/12/2020 at 5:40 PM, jjonahjameson11 said: Carlo, I think you’re right about the Sal Buscema Defenders covers. It’s rather surprising to see the strong uptick in Sal cover art over the past 3 years. Actually, looking over some results on Heritage Archives, the rise has been incredibly strong! some very recent company include: -Defenders 9 cover = $102K -Defenders 8 cover = $42K The committee had a long hard look at this comment, much debate was had. We have decided to allow this to stand. While it comes close to complimenting TMWMNBP (‘The Man Who Must Not Be Praised’ for you newcomers) it never crossed the line. -ARTSOC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
