Am I the only one who finds the Comic Connect grades on raw off? 3 3

[William-James88]

And I mean obviously off. Like, I don't think sending these to CGC would give me anything close to what is being suggested here.

And I was skimming through the raw stuff on comic connect and ... ouch. But just so I am sure I myself am not off or expecting too much, I wanted to run it by you guys.

This here is said to be a 7.0, WTF?! You can see from the spine that this could never be that.

 

https://www.comicconnect.com/item/415679

 

 

Here's another 7.0 that I don't think would get that grade back if sent to CGC

 

And here's a "2.5" that's missing pages https://www.comicconnect.com/item/329931

You can't be missing pages at a 2.5, and it wouldn't get qualified with such a beat up book like this:

 

 

Edited May 20, 2020 by William-James88

[theCapraAegagrus]

4 hours ago, William-James88 said:

And I mean obviously off. I get that grading is subjective, but there are some established rules that most of us are aware of. 

And I was skimming through the raw stuff on comic connect and ... ouch. But just so I am sure I myself am not off or expecting too much, I wanted to run it by you guys...

Such as...?

While I don't agree with any of their grades, there is no universal scaling. Everyone has their own opinions on what impacts how. Gem Mint is (or should be) the only exception.

[Keys_Collector]

27 minutes ago, theCapraAegagrus said:

Such as...?

While I don't agree with any of their grades, there is no universal scaling. Everyone has their own opinions on what impacts how. Gem Mint is (or should be) the only exception.

While I get the sentiment and agree that there is no universal scale, there are certain accepted grading standards related to at least a book being in a certain range.  That is how the best graders can be so close to the actual number grade that they think the book will be when sending it in for grading.  I would agree that the specifics are debatable as far as the differences between 9.4-9.6, 9.8, etc. and there are definitely examples of books looking like a higher/lower grade then they were assigned.

I don't see any comic collector or professional grader for that matter giving any of these books the assigned grades.  These books shown are clearly not the listed grades and a good point of discussion on why Comic Connect would list them at those grades.  On the flipside, I find that Mycomicshop tends to undergrade their raw books.

Is it time to insert once again, "Buy the book, not the grade"?

[William-James88]

2 hours ago, theCapraAegagrus said:

Such as...?

While I don't agree with any of their grades, there is no universal scaling. Everyone has their own opinions on what impacts how. Gem Mint is (or should be) the only exception.

Such as how pages missing affects the grade. Or spines being split or the cover being detached. Even you wrote as such when I asked about the brave and the bold 200 which looked really nice but was almost completely detached. We do have a set of standards (set by what we get back from CGC and what we see in the overstreet grading guide). Or else the Help Me grade thread would yield a much larger range. No one is identifying vgs as vfs there.

[William-James88]

1 hour ago, Keys_Collector said:

On the flipside, I find that Mycomicshop tends to undergrade their raw books.

Is it time to insert once again, "Buy the book, not the grade"?

Yeah they do, but then you see that the price they list it as is what grade it resembles more (so a VG looking book selling for a VG price but listed as a GD/VG). But I am ok with that, it's a technique a lot of dealers do like that they cover their butts and avoid both returns and client dissatisfaction if they choose to send their books in for professional grading.  

[theCapraAegagrus]

1 minute ago, William-James88 said:

Such as how pages missing affects the grade. Or spines being split or the cover being detached. Even you wrote as such when I asked about the brave and the bold 200 which looked really nice but was almost completely detached. We do have a set of standards (set by what we get back from CGC and what we see in the overstreet grading guide). Or else the Help Me grade thread would yield a much larger range. No one is identifying vgs as vfs there.

There are no such universal standards, though. CGC, CBCS, PGX, Overstreet, and I all have different methods of grading comics. Obviously, Comic Connect has their own as well.

There are countless examples of posters ranging from 1.8-3.5, 3.5-5.5, etc etc etc. Those are big differences. There is ultimately no authority on a comic's grade. Missing page = NG for me. Is that CGC's standard? OPG? Idk. I don't often look at their personal guidelines.

[William-James88]

3 minutes ago, theCapraAegagrus said:

There are no such universal standards, though. CGC, CBCS, PGX, Overstreet, and I all have different methods of grading comics. Obviously, Comic Connect has their own as well.

There are countless examples of posters ranging from 1.8-3.5, 3.5-5.5, etc etc etc. Those are big differences. There is ultimately no authority on a comic's grade. Missing page = NG for me. Is that CGC's standard? OPG? Idk. I don't often look at their personal guidelines.

Well in the end, I was more curious if anyone here agreed with the grades being shown on comic connect I presented here. So far it's a no from both you and Keys_collector. 

[theCapraAegagrus]

Just now, William-James88 said:

Well in the end, I was more curious if anyone here agreed with the grades being shown on comic connect I presented here. So far it's a no from both you and Keys_collector. 

Correct. It seems like you want to buy the book and not the "grade", which is best practice IMO.

I'm not saying that you can't or "shouldn't" agree with CGC/OPG, either. I'm just saying that you can't expect everyone else to.

[1950's war comics]

19 minutes ago, William-James88 said:

Well in the end, I was more curious if anyone here agreed with the grades being shown on comic connect I presented here. So far it's a no from both you and Keys_collector. 

they are usually a grade or two less than CGC standards for GA

[Artboy99]

My comment on this is that Comicconnect is owned by Metropolis Comics. Metropolis is known to have lots of books that are not easy to find so they are a great source, however it is my opinion they also over grade on their raws.

I have been disappointed so many times by purchasing raw from them that I will no longer do so.

Edited May 20, 2020 by Artboy99

[alexgross.com]

i only ever buy raw books in person at conventions (remember those?) or from the few dealers that i really trust and respect. and occasionally here on these boards from respected boardies. your evaluation seems to be accurate here. 

[William-James88]

8 minutes ago, www.alexgross.com said:

i only ever buy raw books in person at conventions (remember those?) 

What's that?

Thanks for all your input guys! 

[Black_Adam]

52 minutes ago, Artboy99 said:

My comment on this is that Comicconnect is owned by Metropolis Comics. Metropolis is known to have lots of books that are not easy to find so they are a great source, however it is my opinion they also over grade on their raws.

I have been disappointed so many times by purchasing raw from them that I will no longer do so.

The only two times I bought raw Golden Age (EC) comics from ComicConnect they BOTH came back from CGC with undisclosed restoration. Needless to say, I no longer buy raw comics from them.

[Tim Weaver]

I purchased three raw Planet Comics from Metropolis about 1.5 years ago.  One came back from CGC with undisclosed restoration, one came back five (yes, 5) full grades lower due to brittle pages, and the other was within a half a grade.  To be fair, they did allow me to return the restored book.  In any event, I also will no longer buy raw comics from CC or Metropolis.

I understand that reasonable people can disagree about grading, but the books you posted are overgraded.

[Artboy99]

3 minutes ago, Tim Weaver said:

I purchased three raw Planet Comics from Metropolis about 1.5 years ago.  One came back from CGC with undisclosed restoration, one came back five (yes, 5) full grades lower due to brittle pages, and the other was within a half a grade.  To be fair, they did allow me to return the restored book.  In any event, I also will no longer buy raw comics from CC or Metropolis.

I understand that reasonable people can disagree about grading, but the books you posted are overgraded.

it frustrates me that instead of adjusting their selling practices they allow it to continue. With so many years of selling experience I am sure they have learned how to grade to be in line with cgc standards. 

[Tim Weaver]

24 minutes ago, Artboy99 said:

it frustrates me that instead of adjusting their selling practices they allow it to continue. With so many years of selling experience I am sure they have learned how to grade to be in line with cgc standards. 

Agreed.  I don't generally post about unpleasant buying experiences, as I prefer to deal with these issues privately.  But the CC/Metropolis raw sales are so bad that I thought I would comment in the hopes that someone else could avoid this situation--or at least understand the risk involved and factor that risk into the price.

[The Lions Den]

2 hours ago, William-James88 said:

Such as how pages missing affects the grade. Or spines being split or the cover being detached. Even you wrote as such when I asked about the brave and the bold 200 which looked really nice but was almost completely detached. We do have a set of standards (set by what we get back from CGC and what we see in the overstreet grading guide). Or else the Help Me grade thread would yield a much larger range. No one is identifying vgs as vfs there.

I agree that a book missing pages shouldn't be graded a 2.5. And that spine on the Marvel Family #48 looks quite alarming to me. When I see stuff like this, I simply move on to greener pastures...  

[The Lions Den]

2 hours ago, William-James88 said:

Well in the end, I was more curious if anyone here agreed with the grades being shown on comic connect I presented here. So far it's a no from both you and Keys_collector. 

As Robert Plant once sang:  "No nuh nuh no no Nooooo..!"

[William-James88]

59 minutes ago, Artboy99 said:

it frustrates me that instead of adjusting their selling practices they allow it to continue. With so many years of selling experience I am sure they have learned how to grade to be in line with cgc standards. 

They also sell plenty of slabbed books, it's not like they don't have an idea. Makes them seem really disingenuous. 

[shadroch]

1 hour ago, Artboy99 said:

it frustrates me that instead of adjusting their selling practices they allow it to continue. With so many years of selling experience I am sure they have learned how to grade to be in line with cgc standards. 

Metropolis invented the current 100 point grading system, and is one of the highest grossing shops on the planet.  Why are you upset they don't use CGC's standards but it's okay if MCS doesn't.  

Perhaps if CGC standardized their grading and actually published theses standards, dealers might use them.