ASM 300 heating up 8 8

[Lorne Malvo]

One sold for $4,920 today on Heritage Auctions

[jjonahjameson11]

9 hours ago, ADAMANTIUM said:

Buying all the inflated price to stack the game I consider shenanigans

I didn't say it was imoral or anything and explained how it can be innocently done, @Hollywood1892

 No shenanigans on my part.  I assure you that my goal is true.  38 more copies to go and since I’m only collecting 9.6’s and 9.8’s going forward, it would cost me a bare minimum of $57K to achieve my goal if:

1. I focused on 9.6’s only

2. Average price of a 9.6 = $1.5K

what can I say?   Nostalgia can be expen$ive

Edited October 12, 2020 by jjonahjameson11

[Hollywood1892]

7 hours ago, Broke as a Joke said:

Seeing this very common and well preserved book hit $5000 in 9.8, makes you wonder when the next run up on New Mutants 98 will be.  $5000 for first Venom or $1000 for first Deadpool.  

Deadpool has $75 to go and at least on gocollect we aren't getting an accurate FMV based on sales so I'm going to go with NM 98

[Hollywood1892]

18 minutes ago, jjonahjameson11 said:

 No shenanigans on my part.  I assure you that my goal is true.  38 more copies to go and since I’m only collecting 9.6’s and 9.8’s going forward, it would cost me a bare minimum of $57K to achieve my goal if:

1. I focused on 9.6’s only

2. Average price of a 9.6 = $1.5K

what can I say?   Nostalgia can be expen$ive

I think Shenanigans is a poor word to use 

What we were saying though is....if a person bought 3 copies of ASM 300 at an inflated rate of say $3000 then other dealers would take note and sell their copies for the same price thus pushing the FMV up to the new price, but then say that person who bought those new books also had 7 books that he/she bought at $2000 they could turn around and sell 7 copies at the new price and make $7000 in profit.

A person could even be in possession of a large quantity of 9.8s and sell the book publicly at an auction or BIN and buy the book off themselves (having only to pay the fees) thus driving up the price of ASM 300. Let's face it everyone will buy that book. So the FMV is now double it was 3 months ago.

That is shrewd business 

Edited October 12, 2020 by Hollywood1892

[valiantman]

40 minutes ago, Hollywood1892 said:

I think Shenanigans is a poor word to use 

What we were saying though is....if a person bought 3 copies of ASM 300 at an inflated rate of say $3000 then other dealers would take note and sell their copies for the same price thus pushing the FMV up to the new price, but then say that person who bought those new books also had 7 books that he/she bought at $2000 they could turn around and sell 7 copies at the new price and make $7000 in profit.

A person could even be in possession of a large quantity of 9.8s and sell the book publicly at an auction or BIN and buy the book off themselves (having only to pay the fees) thus driving up the price of ASM 300. Let's face it everyone will buy that book. So the FMV is now double it was 3 months ago.

That is shrewd business 

That "shrewd" plan is tougher than it sounds.

First, you suggest buying 3 copies for $3,000 each - that's $9,000 out of pocket.  You suppose the person also has 7 copies they paid $2,000 each in the past - so that's $14,000 they spent earlier plus $9,000 spent recently ($23,000 costs).

Now, they'll need to find 7 buyers at $3,000 each, so they make $21,000 (or $18,900, if 10% goes to the selling fee/commissions).

At that point, they've spent $23,000 to make $18,900 and to hold 3 more copies of the book for later.  Theoretically, they could sell those 3 copies for $3,000 each (minus 10%), and they'd have all cash - $8,100 plus $18,900 - which is $27,000 cash.

So, they spend $23,000 to make $27,000 - requiring 10 other people with at least $3,000 to get involved - or some buyers with $6K, $9K, etc., since they need to sell 10 copies at $3K each.

That's a 17% return on a $23,000 investment - which could take months or years to complete.

Buying Amazon stock, instead, at $2,300 a share in May of this year - well after the Covid quarantines started, not some kind of early prediction - would be worth $3,250 a share now... a return of 41% that would have only required a few clicks on a website.

 

[Hollywood1892]

4 minutes ago, valiantman said:

That "shrewd" plan is tougher than it sounds.

First, you suggest buying 3 copies for $3,000 each - that's $9,000 out of pocket.  You suppose the person also has 7 copies they paid $2,000 each in the past - so that's $14,000 they spent earlier plus $9,000 spent recently ($23,000 costs).

Now, they'll need to find 7 buyers at $3,000 each, so they make $21,000 (or $18,900, if 10% goes to the selling fee/commissions).

At that point, they've spent $23,000 to make $18,900 and to hold 3 more copies of the book for later.  Theoretically, they could sell those 3 copies for $3,000 each (minus 10%), and they'd have all cash - $8,100 plus $18,900 - which is $27,000 cash.

So, they spend $23,000 to make $27,000 - requiring 10 other people with at least $3,000 to get involved - or some buyers with $6K, $9K, etc., since they need to sell 10 copies at $3K each.

That's a 17% return on a $23,000 investment - which could take months or years to complete.

Buying Amazon stock, instead, at $2,300 a share in May of this year - well after the Covid quarantines started, not some kind of early prediction - would be worth $3,250 a share now... a return of 41% that would have only required a few clicks on a website.

 

Brilliant! 

I would never understand stocks, though I put about $400 every couple weeks into mutual funds.

[valiantman]

1 minute ago, Hollywood1892 said:

7 minutes ago, valiantman said:

That "shrewd" plan is tougher than it sounds.

First, you suggest buying 3 copies for $3,000 each - that's $9,000 out of pocket.  You suppose the person also has 7 copies they paid $2,000 each in the past - so that's $14,000 they spent earlier plus $9,000 spent recently ($23,000 costs).

Now, they'll need to find 7 buyers at $3,000 each, so they make $21,000 (or $18,900, if 10% goes to the selling fee/commissions).

At that point, they've spent $23,000 to make $18,900 and to hold 3 more copies of the book for later.  Theoretically, they could sell those 3 copies for $3,000 each (minus 10%), and they'd have all cash - $8,100 plus $18,900 - which is $27,000 cash.

So, they spend $23,000 to make $27,000 - requiring 10 other people with at least $3,000 to get involved - or some buyers with $6K, $9K, etc., since they need to sell 10 copies at $3K each.

That's a 17% return on a $23,000 investment - which could take months or years to complete.

Buying Amazon stock, instead, at $2,300 a share in May of this year - well after the Covid quarantines started, not some kind of early prediction - would be worth $3,250 a share now... a return of 41% that would have only required a few clicks on a website.

 

Brilliant! 

I would never understand stocks, though I put about $400 every couple weeks into mutual funds.

There's certainly "shenanigans" involved in the comic book world - like everywhere else that money is involved - but it is far easier to make money buying and selling "intangibles" (things that don't need to be packaged and shipped) in "instant markets" (sales occur about two seconds after you click "sell") than to get rich on comic book price manipulation.  There's a reason banks don't recognize comic books as assets.  It's not worth their time... and the only thing they care about is making money.

[jjonahjameson11]

1 hour ago, valiantman said:

 

Buying Amazon stock, instead, at $2,300 a share in May of this year - well after the Covid quarantines started, not some kind of early prediction - would be worth $3,250 a share now... a return of 41% that would have only required a few clicks on a website.

 

Valiantman, once again, you are not comparing apples to apples because you deducted the fees off the sale of the ASM 300s to arrive at your ROI, but you did not deduct any expenses (front or back end) when purchasing/selling the AMZN share.

Edited October 12, 2020 by jjonahjameson11

[valiantman]

50 minutes ago, jjonahjameson11 said:

Valiantman, once again, you are not comparing apples to apples because you deducted the fees off the sale of the ASM 300s to arrive at your ROI, but you did not deduct any expenses (front or back end) when purchasing/selling the AMZN share.

There are no fees now.  Are you stuck in 1990s stock trading?

[jjonahjameson11]

So when you sell a share of a stock, you don’t pay capital gains tax?  

[valiantman]

1 minute ago, jjonahjameson11 said:

So when you sell a share of a stock, you don’t pay capital gains tax?  

Capital gains are the same for stock or comics.

[WolverineX]

3 hours ago, valiantman said:

That "shrewd" plan is tougher than it sounds.

First, you suggest buying 3 copies for $3,000 each - that's $9,000 out of pocket.  You suppose the person also has 7 copies they paid $2,000 each in the past - so that's $14,000 they spent earlier plus $9,000 spent recently ($23,000 costs).

Now, they'll need to find 7 buyers at $3,000 each, so they make $21,000 (or $18,900, if 10% goes to the selling fee/commissions).

At that point, they've spent $23,000 to make $18,900 and to hold 3 more copies of the book for later.  Theoretically, they could sell those 3 copies for $3,000 each (minus 10%), and they'd have all cash - $8,100 plus $18,900 - which is $27,000 cash.

So, they spend $23,000 to make $27,000 - requiring 10 other people with at least $3,000 to get involved - or some buyers with $6K, $9K, etc., since they need to sell 10 copies at $3K each.

That's a 17% return on a $23,000 investment - which could take months or years to complete.

Buying Amazon stock, instead, at $2,300 a share in May of this year - well after the Covid quarantines started, not some kind of early prediction - would be worth $3,250 a share now... a return of 41% that would have only required a few clicks on a website.

 

Absolutely true. But you probably derive more Joy staring at our slabs than seeing a stock in our portfolio.

Edited October 12, 2020 by Wolverinex

[BigLeagueCHEW]

Need vs. want is no longer the goal for most. I was expecting to pay the usual $800 - $1000 tops for a 9.8, and stumbled on the market being overrun by "I have to get this book now, next year it is going to be worth 10K"

I am not in a rush to pay 3K+, I'll wait until next year to check prices.

ASM 298 & 299 are a steady $350 - $450 range. Maybe purchase those and wait on a 300 later.

[BigLeagueCHEW]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Amazing-Spider-Man-300-CGC-9-8-WHITE-pages-1st-Venom-HOT-HOT-CHEAPEST/124377809025?hash=item1cf57ec081:g:oy0AAOSwgJdfgk2Y

$4,250 5 days left at auction.

[ADAMANTIUM]

16 minutes ago, BigLeagueCHEW said:

Need vs. want is no longer the goal for most. I was expecting to pay the usual $800 - $1000 tops for a 9.8, and stumbled on the market being overrun by "I have to get this book now, next year it is going to be worth 10K"

I am not in a rush to pay 3K+, I'll wait until next year to check prices.

ASM 298 & 299 are a steady $350 - $450 range. Maybe purchase those and wait on a 300 later.

I don't know when you went shopping, but it was going steadily for ,$2000 for at least 3 years....

So if you wait until next year, I just didn't want you to be disappointed in the price if it falls...

[BigLeagueCHEW]

 

1 minute ago, ADAMANTIUM said:

I don't know when you went shopping, but it was going steadily for ,$2000 for at least 3 years....

So if you wait until next year, I just didn't want you to be disappointed in the price if it falls...

 Have I been out of collecting comics that long

[Crushingame]

16 hours ago, Hollywood1892 said:

On the level?

There is absolutely nothing illegal or even ethically wrong with buying a book at an inflated price to push the FMV up. 

Honestly, why would you even say that there was shenanigans and then implying that I was subliminally or passively aggressive saying that it might be a board member?

I don’t think buying them at inflated prices to cement a new FMV is completely true. Wouldn’t shill bidding these books to inflate prices be the cause for the current FMV?

 I’m not insinuating that they are or never have been, but let’s be real. If sports cards are shill bidded then why not comic books?

Just sayin’

[ADAMANTIUM]

2 minutes ago, Crushingame said:

I don’t think buying them at inflated prices to cement a new FMV is completely true. Wouldn’t shill bidding these books to inflate prices be the cause for the current FMV?

 I’m not insinuating that they are or never have been, but let’s be real. If sports cards are shill bidded then why not comic books?

Just sayin’

it's touchy, in Texas shilling an auction is legal, but I don't agree with that precedent. I guess in other states it is NOT legal? might be something in the way of determining whether it is "moral" or just part of business but idk

[Hollywood1892]

9 minutes ago, Crushingame said:

I don’t think buying them at inflated prices to cement a new FMV is completely true. Wouldn’t shill bidding these books to inflate prices be the cause for the current FMV?

 I’m not insinuating that they are or never have been, but let’s be real. If sports cards are shill bidded then why not comic books?

Just sayin’

Oh of course that happens 

[Hollywood1892]

31 minutes ago, BigLeagueCHEW said:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Amazing-Spider-Man-300-CGC-9-8-WHITE-pages-1st-Venom-HOT-HOT-CHEAPEST/124377809025?hash=item1cf57ec081:g:oy0AAOSwgJdfgk2Y

$4,250 5 days left at auction.

49 bids already

Yikes

I'm gonna watch this one