Book Damaged by CGC Case 2 2

[thehumantorch]

Hi guys

I don't want this thread to turn into a CGC bashing thread but felt it was important to start this thread.

Sent 7 books to CGC and when I was inspected the books noticed that one had 2 rips on the bottom of the back cover.  I noticed that the case had what I would call a spacer at the bottom to prevent the book from moving in the case but it wasn't doing it's job and the book could slide about an inch up and down.  As I tilted the case I could see the book slide and snag on the spacer and the two rips were located where the book bumped against the spacer.  I have no doubt that if I shook the book hard the rips would have got bigger.  I also looked at every CGC case in my collection that had a spacer and none of them could move in the case.

Grader notes indicated rips on cover but not where and not size.  I sent the book back for review and CGC pressed it, graded it and sent it back to me.

Book was originally graded 4.0 and 4.0 the second time so I'm not sure I can argue any loss of value.  Because I did not scan the back cover before submission, something I will do for any book submitted in the future, I can't prove the book was actually damaged by the case but as I told the CGC rep "I don't know how anyone could look at these pictures and not agree that the case damaged my book"

The damage is easier to see on the left side but there's a very similar rip on the right side.

[theCapraAegagrus]

This makes me sad.

[bc]

42 minutes ago, thehumantorch said:

 

Is that "spacer" actually inside the inner well?

-bc

Edited July 31, 2020 by bc
clarity

[thehumantorch]

7 minutes ago, bc said:

Is that "spacer" actually inside the inner well?

-bc

As far as I know.  Perhaps someone who has disassembled a case with a spacer could answer that.

[bc]

1 minute ago, thehumantorch said:

As far as I know.  Perhaps someone who has disassembled a case with a spacer could answer that.

The reason I ask is that from the pics, it's hard to tell if there is an inner well at all.

[thehumantorch]

Just now, bc said:

The reason I ask is that from the pics, it's hard to tell if there is an inner well at all.

If by inner well you mean a cavity between the top and bottom of the case I believe there is.

[bc]

Watching a video by MrB

About 2:25 into it, he extracts the book from the case and the book is sealed in what he calls an "envelope".

I'm just wondering if the spacer is (a) inside the envelope, (b) outside the envelope (and cutting thru it and the book) or (c) that the envelope is missing.

-bc

[bc]

I forgot option (d) only MrB's books get an envelope

-bc

[Ditch Fahrenheit]

Wedges are used as spacers when the right size core (inner well) is not available to fit the book properly.  They are inside the core, and touch the book.  In your case the wedge is 100% the reason why the pages were torn.

Here's another example where the same thing occurred.

CGC Wedge Causing Damage

[thehumantorch]

10 minutes ago, Ditch Fahrenheit said:

Wedges are used as spacers when the right size core (inner well) is not available to fit the book properly.  They are inside the core, and touch the book.  In your case the wedge is 100% the reason why the pages were torn.

Here's another example where the same thing occurred.

CGC Wedge Causing Damage

Thanks Ditch

[comicginger1789]

Yuck

See I know this is in the minority of bad things that happen but it deters me from getting stuff grading. That and I like to read my books.

In 20 years of collecting I’ve ruined one book myself with a tape pull and that was when I was 12. I trust myself the most:)

[SkintDoctor]

That really sucks man! Is CGC taking any accountability or will they be doing anything?

[thehumantorch]

1 hour ago, BaronSamedi said:

That really sucks man! Is CGC taking any accountability or will they be doing anything?

After I resent the photos and said I didn't believe anyone could look at them and deny the case had damaged the book I was asked what I wanted but by then I'd decided I'd rather stay mad than get my grading fees back or a couple free grades in the future.  I understand mistakes happen but I really thought an apology would have been a good start and that never happened.

[Artboy99]

I will add I personally saw the book before it was encapsulated and the damage is definitely new and clear to me the damage caused by the case / spacer.

[Iceman399]

No one believes you Alberta Canadians... We only believe greggy! 

Yikes this seems to be a 'common' thing popping up recently on FB. 

[Randall Ries]

On 7/31/2020 at 6:13 PM, thehumantorch said:

I understand mistakes happen but I really thought an apology would have been a good start and that never happened.

Bingo. THAT is the problem. The sheer arrogance. An apology to them means admission of guilt and responsibility for the damage. A GOOD COMPANY SUCKS IT UP AND MAKES IT RIGHT. AND THAT'S THE FIRST THING TO BE SAID: "WE ARE SO SORRY." THE NEXT SHOULD BE "HOW CAN WE MAKE YOU HAPPY?"

This is what liability insurance is for. But that is also why they chose to be an LLC. So they can't be held liable for damages. Before I sent a book to ANY grading company, these are the things I would be asking.

If things go south, what will you do to make it right?
What is your damage by the grading process policy?
Who is your insurance company?

If they aren't willing to own up to damaging my property, I wouldn't go through the process. If my vehicle gets damaged while at the shop, well that's what their insurance policy is for. Liability insurance. I am under THEIR coverage while my car is at the shop.

Any company that doesn't fix their eff ups is not a company to do business with. Now my book has a tear and you will comp me a grading for next time? Stuff it.

[JazzMan]

[thehumantorch]

12 minutes ago, Randall Ries said:

Bingo. THAT is the problem. The sheer arrogance. An apology to them means admission of guilt and responsibility for the damage. A GOOD COMPANY SUCKS IT UP AND MAKES IT RIGHT. AND THAT'S THE FIRST THING TO BE SAID: "WE ARE SO SORRY." THE NEXT SHOULD BE "HOW CAN WE MAKE YOU HAPPY?"

This is what liability insurance is for. But that is also why they chose to be an LLC. So they can't be held liable for damages. Before I sent a book to ANY grading company, these are the things I would be asking.

If things go south, what will you do to make it right?
What is your damage by the grading process policy?
Who is your insurance company?

If they aren't willing to own up to damaging my property, I wouldn't go through the process. If my vehicle gets damaged while at the shop, well that's what their insurance policy is for. Liability insurance. I am under THEIR coverage while my car is at the shop.

Any company that doesn't fix their eff ups is not a company to do business with. Now my book has a tear and you will comp me a grading for next time? Stuff it.

I was disappointed and I know they could and should have handled it better but I also believe CGC is the best comic grading company and I continue to submit.  Anyone submitting cards or comics or frankly anything else should realize that their collectible can be damaged somewhere in the process and there is risk.

[Randall Ries]

2 minutes ago, thehumantorch said:

Anyone submitting cards or comics or frankly anything else should realize that their collectible can be damaged somewhere in the process and there is risk.

It's your own thing, of course. Don't you think though it's about time that they started taking some responsibility when the damage is their fault? I get the sense they don't. They seem to be fine with the idea that WE are supposed to be the ones taking the risk. How about if they start taking some risks and own up to their mistakes? A few costly errors and I guarantee those errors will become a lot more scarce.

I understand things happen. It's the way they are handled after they happen that either makes a company shine or makes it look like a dolt. They are going to pull that on the wrong person someday and that person will make them pay one way or another. If someone in the grading process ripped a 9.0 Batman 1 I bet fur would fly.

[thehumantorch]

Just now, Randall Ries said:

It's your own thing, of course. Don't you think though it's about time that they started taking some responsibility when the damage is their fault? I get the sense they don't. They seem to be fine with the idea that WE are supposed to be the ones taking the risk. How about if they start taking some risks and own up to their mistakes? A few costly errors and I guarantee those errors will become a lot more scarce.

I understand things happen. It's the way they are handled after they happen that either makes a company shine or makes it look like a dolt. They are going to pull that on the wrong person someday and that person will make them pay one way or another. If someone in the grading process ripped a 9.0 Batman 1 I bet fur would fly.

They did tell me to send it back and paid for the shipping.  And they did ask what they could do to make me happy so when push comes to shove they did offer to make it right.