How did this non-SS signature get a blue label? 1 1

[Coolio McCool]

Shouldn't this be qualified grade / "Jim Lee Written on Cover"? Did grading standards change when I wasn't looking, or is this a clear mistake?

Edit: One possibility I didn't consider is that the slab is signed, not the book.

Edited August 11, 2020 by Coolio McCool

[Lightning55]

Could be that the slab is signed, as you suggest.  The registration number shows it as a 9.8 Modern, no mention of a signature.  If the signature was on the comic, it should be a Green label.  They got it signed pretty fast, as it was graded on 7/23.  Not an easy feat these days.

[IbukiLord]

Looks like it is on the slab.

[theCapraAegagrus]

You can still get a Universal label with a signature treated as a potential 'defect'.

[William-James88]

5 hours ago, theCapraAegagrus said:

You can still get a Universal label with a signature treated as a potential 'defect'.

But it wouldn't be a 9.8.
Anyways, this is a case where they signed the slab.

[theCapraAegagrus]

1 minute ago, William-James88 said:

But it wouldn't be a 9.8.
Anyways, this is a case where they signed the slab.

Unlikely, yes, but it still could be.

[William-James88]

1 minute ago, theCapraAegagrus said:

Unlikely, yes, but it still could be.

Has that ever happened? I have never seen such a thing. If you have a pic, please share.

[revat]

Absent other evidence, i'd assume the slab was signed.

[theCapraAegagrus]

3 minutes ago, William-James88 said:

Has that ever happened? I have never seen such a thing. If you have a pic, please share.

I don't have a pic. Google isn't helping me, either.

[seanfingh]

This is a Gen 13 Chromium which only came out of the red and/or black sealed boxes.  Some of the Chromiums were signed by Jim Lee and some were signed by J. Scott Campbell.  All of the signed copies I have seen have been signed in gold ink pretty much exactly like that. So, if the gold ink sig is on the slab, then they have done a great job of simulating the signed book.

But if it is on the book then that leaves me with one of two choices:

(1) It is a mistake or

(2) CGC has decided that since they were "produced" by Image with the signature on them, the signature will be ignored.

I believe that it is #1 not #2, if the sig is on the book. 

[Coolio McCool]

20 minutes ago, seanfingh said:

This is a Gen 13 Chromium which only came out of the red and/or black sealed boxes.  Some of the Chromiums were signed by Jim Lee and some were signed by J. Scott Campbell.  All of the signed copies I have seen have been signed in gold ink pretty much exactly like that. So, if the gold ink sig is on the slab, then they have done a great job of simulating the signed book.

But if it is on the book then that leaves me with one of two choices:

(1) It is a mistake or

(2) CGC has decided that since they were "produced" by Image with the signature on them, the signature will be ignored.

I believe that it is #1 not #2, if the sig is on the book. 

Correct. There are also Garner + Choi sealed boxes. The black boxes have the comic sig'd by the respective artist / writer (label on the box), the red boxes have the un-sig'd book.

Very unlikely that the slab is sig'd. I will double check with the owner.

Can we get a comment from CGC on this situation? AFAIK, the sig'd comics have always received qualified grade (you can find many examples on Ebay). The unsigned / universal grade book is actually pretty rare, but if CGC is now grading the sig'd books with universal grade then the census data is meaningless.

Realistically speaking, we all know that signature is legit (99.9999% chance), nobody is going to forge Jim Lee's signature on an unsigned book that is rarer / worth more unsigned. But that's not the point, historically this book has received universal grade and there needs to be consistency.

Edited August 11, 2020 by Coolio McCool

[Deadpoolica]

Looks like on the slab itself to me

[Coolio McCool]

CONFIRMED that the book is signed (NOT the slab) which was almost certain given the timing / signature ink + location.

So it's a mistake? Or is there a new policy to grade these "factory signed" books with blue label?

[seanfingh]

26 minutes ago, Coolio McCool said:

CONFIRMED that the book is signed (NOT the slab) which was almost certain given the timing / signature ink + location.

So it's a mistake? Or is there a new policy to grade these "factory signed" books with blue label?

That's where I would have put my money.  I'll double down on the belief that it is a mistake.

[Lightning55]

In October of 2018, I was looking at purchasing a Venom: Lethal Protector 1 that was signed by Mark Bagley, blue Universal label.  This was on eBay.  I thought it odd that it had the blue label.  I messaged the seller, and they said CGC lets them decide if it will be a blue label with a grading hit due to "writing on the cover", or the actual grade with a green Qualified label.  To be sure this was right, I wrote to CGC customer where it was soundly refuted:

Thanks for your email.  It seems like the owner of this book is not giving you correct information.  Books with signatures that were not witnessed will never get a Blue Universal label.  They would always get a qualified label.  We do not offer a "choice" to the customer in a case like that.  There are some instances where we will give an unsigned book a universal label even if there is some major defect if the grade of the book is very low.  In a case like that the low grade is already factoring in the defect.  But this would apply to unsigned books only and only very low grade books.  

 

It looks like for this book, there was an error when it was encapsulated and the wrong label was used.  It should have been a qualified label and that is what it is showing in our system. 

 

If you have any other questions, please let us know.  Thank you!

 

Customer Service 
Certified Guaranty Company

[William-James88]

4 hours ago, Coolio McCool said:

 

Can we get a comment from CGC on this situation? AFAIK, the sig'd comics have always received qualified grade (you can find many examples on Ebay). The unsigned / universal grade book is actually pretty rare, but if CGC is now grading the sig'd books with universal grade then the census data is meaningless.

Realistically speaking, we all know that signature is legit (99.9999% chance), nobody is going to forge Jim Lee's signature on an unsigned book that is rarer / worth more unsigned. But that's not the point, historically this book has received universal grade and there needs to be consistency.

Post in the "Ask CGC" section. Since it's a mistake, they will have you send the book back at their cost and reslab it properly with the green label.

[oldrover]

I had a raw mid grade FF48 with Stan's sig, unverified. I'd just been through a bout with Voldy, and didn't want to do it again, so I slabbed it with CGC, asking them to state "Stan Lee written on cover" in the notes.

They did, and it got a 4.5 blue. 

[The Lions Den]

Boy, the more you think you know...  

There have definitely been cases where a book with an unverified signature on the cover has been given a low to mid-grade blue label (such as the FF #48 above). I've also seen cases where a high grade book received a green label with an unverified signature on the cover. But I've personally never seen a case where a book correctly received a 9.8 blue label with an unverified signature on the cover. 

So what we seem to be looking at is a book that should have been either a sig series 9.8 or a green label 9.8...but not a blue label 9.8. There should also be a notation on the label regarding the signature.

So yes, it does appear to be one of these... 

 

[bobotski]

Looks to be it should be in the same family as this (photo from eBay).

[The Lions Den]

35 minutes ago, bobotski said:

Looks to be it should be in the same family as this (photo from eBay).