Is Dylan Still Trying to Scam People with Restored Books? 6 6

[The Lions Den]

On 8/26/2020 at 10:22 AM, october said:

His raw grading needs some help. Interesting "7.0". 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Amazing-Spider-Man-42-MARVEL-1966-1st-Mary-Jane-and-2nd-Rhino-7-0/224125766723?hash=item342eefcc43:g:q0kAAOSw4VJfPwbq

   

[Buzzetta]

5 hours ago, Lazyboy said:

Uh huh.

So, if you believe that, is it a problem that can't be fixed or did they just wait months and months after we know they knew about it to fix it for some reason?

Is it the same "programming error" that has caused other restored books to be slabbed with (regular) blue labels in the past (and I'm not talking about the GA compromise)?

I've worked for people where there was an error and it took almost two years for them to address it.  It took time for them to realize and verify that the problem actually existed. It took time to devise a strategy to properly address it.  It took time to implement that strategy.  It took time for anyone to actually see results. 

Many of the books in these types of holders have been incidental.  The only one who may have overtly exploited it is Dylan as seen by the timeline, if accurate, of submitting books in the other thread.  That appears to have been addressed as mentioned by Brittany and Harshen. 

Now I ask this of you.  Given something like this that damages the grading reputation and reliability of CGC as a third party grader in the face of other grading companies and the consumer, why would they dismiss it or overtly continue with this practice?    At first it may have been considered that it was a one off printing mistake.  We have all seen those before.  The second time it may have been seen as another mistake.  We have all seen mislabeling or swapped labels in batch orders.  I do not believe that they realized that there was an actual programming issue until the Dylan incident and given the response, I would say they were pretty quick to come to action. 

 

BTW... I love that this type of mislabeling seems to be known as a "Dylan Book."

[The Lions Den]

3 hours ago, StreetPreacher said:

And again on the Xmen book, the label might be BLUE, but it clearly states that the book has "restoration including a piece reattached to the cover..."?

I guess the problem is that people spending large sums of cash on slabbed books ONLY look at the label colour, and don't bother reading the details written on it?

Yes, there are a number of problems going on here. A bit of a domino effect, IMO...   

[The Lions Den]

2 minutes ago, Buzzetta said:

I've worked for people where there was an error and it took almost two years for them to address it.  It took time for them to realize and verify that the problem actually existed. It took time to devise a strategy to properly address it.  It took time to implement that strategy.  It took time for anyone to actually see results. 

Many of the books in these types of holders have been incidental.  The only one who may have overtly exploited it is Dylan as seen by the timeline, if accurate, of submitting books in the other thread.  That appears to have been addressed as mentioned by Brittany and Harshen. 

Now I ask this of you.  Given something like this that damages the grading reputation and reliability of CGC as a third party grader in the face of other grading companies and the consumer, why would they dismiss it or overtly continue with this practice?    At first it may have been considered that it was a one off printing mistake.  We have all seen those before.  The second time it may have been seen as another mistake.  We have all seen mislabeling or swapped labels in batch orders.  I do not believe that they realized that there was an actual programming issue until the Dylan incident and given the response, I would say they were pretty quick to come to action. 

 

BTW... I love that this type of mislabeling seems to be known as a "Dylan Book."

Right on, as usual...  

[Qalyar]

3 hours ago, Keys_Collector said:

• As far as CGC, saying that they are taking care of it is not a good enough of a response. They should answer the question about how many of these books are floating out there but I don't think they will.  This situation makes them look worse for not catching it sooner especially when this was brought up last year.  

I actually suspect they haven't because they can't -- or don't think they can. The census tracks "grade category", but not the specific type of label associated with the book. For example, the problematic X-Men above is Cert #2133081001, with a grade category of B-1 (as correct for a restored book). It doesn't say that it has a character label. Indeed, no book in the census indicates which books are slabbed with character labels. If I was in charge of CGC, and had their system to build all over from scratch, I'd be sure to include slab model and label version as tracked fields. That'd be helpful for other QC issues too. Now, it's possible that they have that data and just don't display it externally, but... I kind of doubt it.

I really do not think they have any easy way to retroactively search for this. It might be possible for accounting to provide a list of the times that someone has paid for a character label, then run that list against the database to look for books with a restored grade category. But depending on how they store those two data sets, that might not be as trivial as it sounds.

[The Lions Den]

5 hours ago, Lazyboy said:

Uh huh.

So, if you believe that, is it a problem that can't be fixed or did they just wait months and months after we know they knew about it to fix it for some reason?

Is it the same "programming error" that has caused other restored books to be slabbed with (regular) blue labels in the past (and I'm not talking about the GA compromise)?

And this opens the door for one of my favorite quotes:  "A computer is only as smart as the person operating it..."   

[wombat]

This isn't rocket surgery where it might be difficult to spot potential errors. At a bare minimum would they not make part of the final QC checklist "check for notation of resto on the character labels". I don't care how complicated this might be on the front end (and come on, how complicated can it be?) they should have caught 100% of all issues after they were made aware of it. 

[The Lions Den]

17 hours ago, William-James88 said:

Or make them available on all labels. What upsets me here is how dumb this whole situation is. All CGC had to do was program so that you can have character labels on any label, be it universal, pedigree, purple, whatever. 

And at some point, this would ultimately involve putting the correct label into the printer...  

[The Lions Den]

19 hours ago, William-James88 said:

I'm pretty sure this proves the opposite. CGC has what I would say is a beyond amateurish problem with these labels, to the point where it means some people at CGC don't even know their job outside of the one task they are assigned for (the person putting the coloured label inside the plastic never raised a hand after seeing that trimming was always getting purple labels and now not). And worse, they knew of this for months and didn't fix it. All that sounds terrible.

The responsibility for things like this usually falls on the QC department...  

[onlyweaknesskryptonite]

9 hours ago, kav said:

-that was super subtle.

 that means it is not resto! Love how you trimmed that part out of all that I quoted.  Also not resto.

[Guardian Comics]

5 hours ago, StreetPreacher said:

Well the label does clearly state that "TOP EDGE OF COMIC TRIMMED"...

It also clearly states Universal Grade (which it's not)...so we have a confused buyer pool.  As well the last time he listed a batch of these, he was getting GPA blue prices for them and then even argued that trimming is not resto, and stands behind selling them as blue labels because it's not his fault it's CGC's.

[The Lions Den]

2 hours ago, Qalyar said:

I actually suspect they haven't because they can't -- or don't think they can. The census tracks "grade category", but not the specific type of label associated with the book. For example, the problematic X-Men above is Cert #2133081001, with a grade category of B-1 (as correct for a restored book). It doesn't say that it has a character label. Indeed, no book in the census indicates which books are slabbed with character labels. If I was in charge of CGC, and had their system to build all over from scratch, I'd be sure to include slab model and label version as tracked fields. That'd be helpful for other QC issues too. Now, it's possible that they have that data and just don't display it externally, but... I kind of doubt it.

I really do not think they have any easy way to retroactively search for this. It might be possible for accounting to provide a list of the times that someone has paid for a character label, then run that list against the database to look for books with a restored grade category. But depending on how they store those two data sets, that might not be as trivial as it sounds.

Searching for individual books without the label number is like looking for the proverbial needle in the haystack. It would likely require searching each individual entry that was graded with that title and issue number, which can be a very time consuming process. And time is very important at CGC...   

[The Lions Den]

45 minutes ago, Guardian Comics said:

It also clearly states Universal Grade (which it's not)...so we have a confused buyer pool.  As well the last time he listed a batch of these, he was getting GPA blue prices for them and then even argued that trimming is not resto, and stands behind selling them as blue labels because it's not his fault it's CGC's.

The theory of comic collecting relativity is: Actions = Consequences. 

[bc]

4 minutes ago, The Lions Den said:

Searching for individual books without the label number is like looking for the proverbial needle in the haystack. It would likely require searching each individual entry that was graded with that title and issue number, which can be a very time consuming process. And time is very important at CGC...   

Database query

For each $book$ processed from %known_start_date% to %known_end_date%

     If %invoice% contains "character_label" and if %restoration_category% exists

    Then %cert_number% > %std_out%

 

or something similar.....

-bc

Edited August 28, 2020 by bc

[manetteska]

1 hour ago, bc said:

Database query

For each $book$ processed from %known_start_date% to %known_end_date%

     If %invoice% contains "character_label" and if %restoration_category% exists

    Then %cert_number% > %std_out%

 

or something similar.....

-bc

May not necessarily need that first qualifier — bring back every book no matter the processed date (and output a lot more than just cert number).

And while I agree a query like that is very simple, I don’t know if such a query is possible at CGC. I am basing this on Lion’s reply as he used to work there. 

[The Lions Den]

31 minutes ago, manetteska said:

May not necessarily need that first qualifier — bring back every book no matter the processed date (and output a lot more than just cert number).

And while I agree a query like that is very simple, I don’t know if such a query is possible at CGC. I am basing this on Lion’s reply as he used to work there. 

Perhaps a simple picture is worth a thousand words:    

[UncleBEN]

17 hours ago, StreetPreacher said:

And I've always wonered exactly what's going on in this cover?  What is beast swinging on?  Is Jean Grey just modeling her new outfit?  And Iceman is attacking Magneto with snowballs?  It appears that the 'angel' with a bazooka is the only 'threat', and we know magneto could easily disable a metal gun!   At least Cyclops appears to be making a dent...

Sorry, was responding to different posts...  apologies. But thanks for the label info,  I'll go stand in the corner now.

Wonder who this really is .

New to the forum , I don't think so .

 

 

[theCapraAegagrus]

On 8/29/2020 at 1:49 AM, UncleBEN said:

Wonder who this really is .

New to the forum , I don't think so .

Probably starts with an "S".

[THE_BEYONDER]

14 minutes ago, theCapraAegagrus said:

Probably starts with an "S".

 

[ADAMANTIUM]

6 minutes ago, Wees 2e said:

2 hours ago, theCapraAegagrus said:

Probably starts with an "S".

Nope 

An R? an e? spect?