OA stream of consciousness thread
0

221 posts in this topic

14 minutes ago, Rick2you2 said:

My gut just got involved this morning when the pencil piece showed up. The other one won’t be around very long. 

One thing I hate are non-buying regrets. There have been several times I have passed on a minor piece, and to this day, kick myself over it.

But yes, I am going through a form of withdrawal.

 

 

Very true, I regret far more decisions to pass than to buy. Good luck with your decision!

Link to post
Share on other sites

Pages that are held together with acidic rubber cement from back in the 60s and 70s, unless conserved, will eventually fall apart and become brittle. There should be a premium paid for all solid state unaltered pages versus ones with glued on stats and effects. As time goes on those pages will be considered more valuable as they are more likely to survive/not need costly intervention.

Edited by zhamlau
Link to post
Share on other sites

Any thoughts on Jesus Merino's pencils? The reason I am asking is that Kirby's Comic Art is now listing his work at a higher price point (still below $1K) than a fair number of other pieces that have been or are being sold elsewhere. In my view, the limited number of pieces I have seen are very good, but not exceptional. So, I question the newer pricing level. Counterpoints are welcome.

Edited by Rick2you2
Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, skrilla1212 said:

“When a piece becomes available, you cannot hesitate and have to be ready to go all out because it will likely never be available again.”

”There is always another piece around the corner.”

Both of these are true.

Just something that’s been running through my mind recently.

They are, and they can co-exist.

If you are looking for something specific, then yes, if you miss it then it could be gone (e.g. one of 4 covers to a 4 issue limited series)

Another piece that interest you could turn up, but likely a different title that scratches a different itch.

Malvin

Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, batman_fan said:

I spent quite a bit of time thinking about my exit strategy and actually consulted a professional to help with finalizing my plan.  I can sum it up pretty quick but feel free to ask me for more details if you want.

Step 1 die

Step 2 don't care, that's my heirs problem

Even though I have been selling off and on for twenty years, my collecting has continued apace.  I have sold many pricier pieces to help out my heirs, but I will likely die with a few pieces that will have instructions and provenance, estimates, etc. to help the family.  And, a heck of a yard sale, I imagine.

My mother tried to sell off stuff for years before she died and still managed to retain enough for a long weekend of selling at yard sale prices.

We also have a good local auction house who uses Live Auctioneers for halfway decent material, though comic art is a little too specific to expect a good result for mill run art.

I will suggest Heritage to the family for high-end comic book art, and even small piles of low-mid comic art stuff like strips, copper/modern interior pages, etc. (weekly auctions).  My wife knows the drill and will be happy to box it up and make it disappear!  That plan involves her surviving me.  Me surviving her is another story, because I would be in charge of dispatching hundreds of oil paintings by a deceased artist.  David

Jun 24 2016_2506.JPG

Edited by aokartman
grammar
Link to post
Share on other sites

Someone at Marvel should start a small imprint and call it Marvel:1975 or something to that effect only the trick would be to have all of the artwork and printing for the book be done using the same production processes as 1975. 
 

All of the artwork would be pencilled, inked, on-page lettered, and completed by guys who worked in or around the era like Pollard, Buscema, who ever. The printing will be on the same cheaper stock, coloring using same old school methods. Should keep costs down on it.

The twist is that it will allow you to take a completely different line on already existing stories and characters but have it occur naturally using many of the same era creators to give it authenticity. Maybe some cataclysmic event caused this alternate world and so we have to see how the heroes and villains react to this sea change event. Maybe alliances/priorities shift?  It also would provide a lot of work for those guys and produce pages they could sell and maybe bring people back into reading who have “outgrown” that part of the collecting.

You could have small to order print runs and format the fonts and graphics to align with the era, only you could do more in-depth dialogue and story content. Anyone brought on would have to work in the more traditional marvel style of the era, understanding the world they create would still have to exist in a 1970s world view. 

Edited by zhamlau
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, zhamlau said:

Someone at Marvel should start a small imprint and call it Marvel:1975 or something to that effect only the trick would be to have all of the artwork and printing for the book be done using the same production processes as 1975. 
 

All of the artwork would be pencilled, inked, on-page lettered, and completed by guys who worked in or around the era like Pollard, Buscema, who ever. The printing will be on the same cheaper stock, coloring using same old school methods. Should keep costs down on it.

The twist is that it will allow you to take a completely different line on already existing stories and characters but have it occur naturally using many of the same era creators to give it authenticity. It also would provide a lot of work for those guys and produce pages they could sell and maybe bring people back into reading who have “outgrown” that part of the collecting.

You could have small to order print runs and format the fonts and graphics to align with the era, only you could do more in-depth dialogue and story content. Anyone brought on would have to work in the more traditional marvel style of the era, understanding the world they create would still have to exist in a 1970s world view. 

Creatively, that sounds amazing.

Financially, that sounds like an amazing way to lose a load of money IMO.

Its a shame but I don't think you can go back home so to speak, at least not with industry conditions being what they are.

Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Bronty said:

Creatively, that sounds amazing.

Financially, that sounds like an amazing way to lose a load of money IMO.

Its a shame but I don't think you can go back home so to speak, at least not with industry conditions being what they are.

I don’t think it would. You would have to get the word out it was coming but I bet you could sell similar numbers to many current books at a much smaller production cost. Cheaper paper and technique to offset hiring letterers and a few colorists. It might not make a ton of money at first but the value it brings to the community in taking care of older artists and providing them a voice again could generate good will and positive PR that Disney could use right now. That alone makes it a “profitable” idea.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Rob Kirkman just did something akin to your idea.  Him and Ryan Ottley released (unbeknownst to anyone) a sort of "what if" random one off book which supposes the Walking Dead never took off.  I only heard about it on a podcast, but it apparently used the older style paper.  The creative team also used their characters in new ways, I think Michonne was one of the protagonists...?  Sounded interesting.  It's called Solid Blood #17.  

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, zhamlau said:

I don’t think it would. You would have to get the word out it was coming but I bet you could sell similar numbers to many current books at a much smaller production cost. Cheaper paper and technique to offset hiring letterers and a few colorists. It might not make a ton of money at first but the value it brings to the community in taking care of older artists and providing them a voice again could generate good will and positive PR that Disney could use right now. That alone makes it a “profitable” idea.

The thing is, print runs are small today.    Paper and printing costs are variable costs and were the chief costs back then.      Today, fixed costs are the big ticket item and the variable costs are smaller because of the small print runs.   Meaning, in today's environment, you save very little by reducing paper costs.    It costs a set amount as a minimum, essentially, to create a book.   The lower the number of copies sold the more you have to charge just to cover the fixed costs before you even worry about the variable costs.   Saving a few bucks on paper does very little.    As a creative choice like on the kirkman book it can work but at any point if you are hoping for much smaller production costs, I don't think that's realistic.     Reducing variable costs was what you wanted in the 1970s.   Reducing fixed costs is what you want today, but that's hard to do.     Which is why the cover price of every book is so high these days.     You simply don't sell enough copies today to cover your fixed costs unless the cover price is high.    Its not an accident that the whole industry has gone that direction.

Edited by Bronty
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, vodou said:

The biggest fixed cost is nobody wants to or is willing to work for $8/pg pencils and inks, and no rights retained.

Which is why the future may be a percent of sales to artists and writers plus a guaranteed minimum.

Link to post
Share on other sites

You should be able to print a book on that stock for 1.25-1.55 a copy since much of it’s in house from what I’ve read. I can imagine a print run of 25-35k could be doable. You sell at 2.99 a book to mostly older established collectors who might be willing to step back in for the nostalgia and see where you go. 
 

The value comes from the free press this generates beyond the book sales. Marvel giving back to the creators, hell you would get main stream media pick ups on that. Shop owners would be more In support to take a chance on this product than some rando inhumans relaunch. 
 

The marketing alone makes this book a guaranteed hit. Like Marvel doing a hero’s initiative version of their own. Any proceeds extra goes to a fund for older artists and creatives. 
 

This is tip-money to Disney, a guaranteed PR win in the era of dark days for them. It makes it seem like a big happy family looking out for its past and maybe opening up a nice new product line that could catch fire considering their readers skew older.

Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, zhamlau said:

Marvel:1975

I dig it. If you are tight with any creators of this era, a writer and artist should pitch it to a Marvel editor. A whole month of newsprint comics would make for a kitschy local news day piece at press outlets. Fans would definitely get behind this.

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, BCarter27 said:

I dig it. If you are tight with any creators of this era, a writer and artist should pitch it to a Marvel editor. A whole month of newsprint comics would make for a kitschy local news day piece at press outlets. Fans would definitely get behind this.

What’s more...what if you let them get creative? Huge event occurs that literally wrecks the earth? In our earth the disaster (as always) is averted...what if in theirs it didn’t? Sea change (lit and fig) occurs and we now see villains and heroes in this new reality. Maybe bad guys become semi good guys (stealing and revenge mean little in a world where a large portion have perished and basic necessities aren’t being easily meet). Maybe some heroes succumb to this horrible new reality and they shift to a less noble version. 
 

The world works because it was easy and it made sense. What happens when it stops making easy low effort sense? 

Anyway Ive pitched the idea before and I’ve yet to hear anyone think it totally sucked. I’d love to have a shot to talk it over with someone at Marvel, I’ve been thinking about this idea for like a decade...and it all started because I thought it would be neat to see them go back to lettered on page pencil Ink originals lol.

Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, zhamlau said:

You should be able to print a book on that stock for 1.25-1.55 a copy since much of it’s in house from what I’ve read. I can imagine a print run of 25-35k could be doable. You sell at 2.99 a book to mostly older established collectors who might be willing to step back in for the nostalgia and see where you go. 
 

The value comes from the free press this generates beyond the book sales. Marvel giving back to the creators, hell you would get main stream media pick ups on that. Shop owners would be more In support to take a chance on this product than some rando inhumans relaunch. 
 

The marketing alone makes this book a guaranteed hit. Like Marvel doing a hero’s initiative version of their own. Any proceeds extra goes to a fund for older artists and creatives. 
 

This is tip-money to Disney, a guaranteed PR win in the era of dark days for them. It makes it seem like a big happy family looking out for its past and maybe opening up a nice new product line that could catch fire considering their readers skew older.

I think that's wildly optimistic.     I mean hey, maybe I'm dead wrong and its a smash hit but even if it is, for how long?   Three months until you start bleeding money when all the 55 year olds remember they are 55 again?

Again, as a creative idea I think its cool.    As a financial proposition of "lets sell lots of comics at a discounted price" I think if it worked, you'd already have seen it.   Its not a completely original idea.    Budget comics (disney penny pinchers and probably others I'm not aware of) were tried.   They don't work.

I think its a wonderful idea.    Just at $3.99 or $4.99 is all.

Let me ask you a question.

If your target market is 55 year olds as you said (with lots of money relative to young readers)... why are you discounting?   They don't give AF about $2 vs $4.     They just want something they want to read.

Edited by Bronty
Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, zhamlau said:

Shop owners...

Man, I don't like going this negative but...do these even exist anymore - in numbers that matter to a publisher?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
0