boards Color on back of comic transferring to backing board 0

[kaejol]

I'm coming up on two years soon and recently I've noticed on some of my comics backing boards there's some color, and on the comic some of the color is gone, I have the glossy side to the comic. I have taken comics out of the bags a boards a couple times to read or re read, is it cause by me taking them out, or is it that I need to change the boards? If it's from me taking it out should I be putting my comics in and taking them out with the board at the same time? I'm still new to this and want to make sure I'm doing everything correctly.

Also thinking of getting fullbacks from egerber because I heard they're good, if this is because I need to change the boards would that solve the problem?

[Conacon]

Couple of things I'm wondering here...

Are your bags the right size for the board? Sometimes old modern bags are overly wide compared to new backing boards. 

This would allow the comic to shift more, causing the color rub. Also, as the rub is along the spine which sits thicker than the rest of the book, maybe your books are packed too tight or even too loosely?

[Comicshows]

Fullback or half back boards you will never have to change them out. 

[Artboy99]

get better quality backing boards.

Yes take the comic and the board out of the bag, then when you are putting it back into the bag place the comic on the board and put comic on board back into the bag.

[theCapraAegagrus]

Are they allegedly "acid-free" backing boards!?

[comicginger1789]

Hmm, couple things to do. One has already been mentioned. If taking the same book out rather frequently, do as suggested above. Place comic on board and slide board into bag. Also make sure bags and boards are proper size.

Another thing is where are these comics stored? I know I have bought newer books from people who stored them in their garage. Where I live, humidity levels fluctuate a fair bit between the seasons and moisture can cause something like this to happen as the book gets "damp" and then you will see the inks transferring. You want a dry dark spot that fluctuates as little as possible otherwise you might see what you are seeing and, if extreme enough, you will start to see wrippling and warping, especially on newer comics because of what they are printed on. 

[marvelmaniac]

Also, are you using Mylites or Poly Bags?

Poly Bags are not Archival Safe and need to be replaced every 5 years since they breakdown and produce acids that will damage the book and board, Mylites and a Quality Acid Free Board are a Once In A Lifetime investment.

As already stated but worth repeating, comic books need to be stored in a...

Temperature/Humidity Controlled Environment, Away for ALL UV Light Sources, Away from All Sources of Heat, Away from Heater/AC vents, Away from Water/Moisture, NOT Stored in an Unfinished Garage/Basement/Attic.

[kaejol]

On 10/15/2020 at 6:18 AM, comicginger1789 said:

Hmm, couple things to do. One has already been mentioned. If taking the same book out rather frequently, do as suggested above. Place comic on board and slide board into bag. Also make sure bags and boards are proper size.

Another thing is where are these comics stored? I know I have bought newer books from people who stored them in their garage. Where I live, humidity levels fluctuate a fair bit between the seasons and moisture can cause something like this to happen as the book gets "damp" and then you will see the inks transferring. You want a dry dark spot that fluctuates as little as possible otherwise you might see what you are seeing and, if extreme enough, you will start to see wrippling and warping, especially on newer comics because of what they are printed on. 

I'll be honest when I started I was pretty bad about storage. I was storing them on a shelf like normal books (Yes I know this is stupid, but I didn't know at the time, now I do.). But back in July I bought comic boxes and they're stored in my closet, my bedroom is in the basement, the closet isn't close to any pipes or windows. I was taking them out frequently. But I have some comics I haven't taken out the bag since I bought them from the comic book store and they have the same thing. So is it the rubbing, the board, both, or a combination of that and other things?

Edited October 20, 2020 by kaejol

[marvelmaniac]

Comic books start to decay/degrade the moment they are produced due to the acids used in the paper and inks, it is a natural process. I assume modern books use a better quality paper than was used from the 30's - 80's(?) which was newspaper, very low quality.

Storing books in the proper environment only "SLOWS DOWN" the decaying process, if stored properly the books should/will last many generations with absolutely no issues, if not stored properly the book can decay rather quickly depending on its circumstances.

Is your basement Climate Controlled?

Are you using Poly Bags or Mylites?

Are the original boards Acid Free?

A Non-Climate Controlled Area, Poly Bags and Non-Acid Free/Non Buffered Boards all contribute to Acids being produced as the Bag/Board start to breakdown and the more the comic has to expand/contract/adjust to its environment the more acids are released from the book itself, all leading to further/quicker decay of the book.

Proper storage methods would include Mylites (Inert Material, No Acids, Archival Safe), Acid Free Boards, Temperature/Humidity Controlled, Stored away from All UV Light, All Heat Sources (Including Heater/AC Vents) Dampness/Water.

The conditions listed above also hold true for CGC Graded Books since they are not UV protected nor are they Hermetically sealed.

[Arkham]

Lots of solid advice above and questions for more detail. 
My $0.02 is that I can verify the advice above. I live in the subtropics, very humid a lot of the year, and I’ve got my “good” books from the 70s in 725 M2’s on a 700 FB and they look completely unchanged after years sitting in those bags. 
 

OP said they were keen to get some E Gerber’s - I say go for it! 

[kaejol]

On 10/21/2020 at 9:33 AM, marvelmaniac said:

Comic books start to decay/degrade the moment they are produced due to the acids used in the paper and inks, it is a natural process. I assume modern books use a better quality paper than was used from the 30's - 80's(?) which was newspaper, very low quality.

Storing books in the proper environment only "SLOWS DOWN" the decaying process, if stored properly the books should/will last many generations with absolutely no issues, if not stored properly the book can decay rather quickly depending on its circumstances.

Is your basement Climate Controlled?

Are you using Poly Bags or Mylites?

Are the original boards Acid Free?

A Non-Climate Controlled Area, Poly Bags and Non-Acid Free/Non Buffered Boards all contribute to Acids being produced as the Bag/Board start to breakdown and the more the comic has to expand/contract/adjust to its environment the more acids are released from the book itself, all leading to further/quicker decay of the book.

Proper storage methods would include Mylites (Inert Material, No Acids, Archival Safe), Acid Free Boards, Temperature/Humidity Controlled, Stored away from All UV Light, All Heat Sources (Including Heater/AC Vents) Dampness/Water.

The conditions listed above also hold true for CGC Graded Books since they are not UV protected nor are they Hermetically sealed.

I'm just using standard bcw resealable and their normal backing boards. My basement isn't climate controlled, it's just a basement that's fully furnished, it's where I sleep and it's warm in the winter, and pretty normal in the summer, I mean it's still warm but not crazy. I am going to switch soon to e gerber stuff though once I can afford it, it's more expensive since I live in Canada.

[kaejol]

On 10/21/2020 at 3:47 PM, Arkham said:

Lots of solid advice above and questions for more detail. 
My $0.02 is that I can verify the advice above. I live in the subtropics, very humid a lot of the year, and I’ve got my “good” books from the 70s in 725 M2’s on a 700 FB and they look completely unchanged after years sitting in those bags. 
 

OP said they were keen to get some E Gerber’s - I say go for it! 

Are M4's good? I'm just curious, I'm just looking for the most overkill solution so I never have to change them out ever again. Like if they're too thick I can understand that being more of an issue. Also for thicker books, like the annotated version of marvels, should I be using a size up from standard? And should I use current size for newer books that have recently come out, or just standard? Just wondering because most of my collection is from the last 5 years, and the oldest book I have is from 85. Just trying to figure out what works without damaging my collection.

[The Lions Den]

5 hours ago, kaejol said:

Are M4's good? I'm just curious, I'm just looking for the most overkill solution so I never have to change them out ever again. Like if they're too thick I can understand that being more of an issue. Also for thicker books, like the annotated version of marvels, should I be using a size up from standard? And should I use current size for newer books that have recently come out, or just standard? Just wondering because most of my collection is from the last 5 years, and the oldest book I have is from 85. Just trying to figure out what works without damaging my collection.

I'm kind of an old school guy when it comes to comic storage. For my most treasured raw books, I like to use a high quality mylar bag with an acid free board. The books look great and the protection is impressive. I've used many different kinds of mylars and mylites, but I prefer the ones from BCE. They're a little more expensive but you get what you pay for.

For less expensive books, I just use a poly bag with a standard backing board. If I notice any yellowing or cloudiness with the bag or board, I replace them. It's cheap and effective. 

I don't know of any product that will last forever, but I've had certain books stored with the same mylar bag and acid free board for many years and I haven't seen any signs of degradation yet...

[marvelmaniac]

15 hours ago, kaejol said:

I'm just using standard bcw resealable and their normal backing boards. My basement isn't climate controlled, it's just a basement that's fully furnished, it's where I sleep and it's warm in the winter, and pretty normal in the summer, I mean it's still warm but not crazy. I am going to switch soon to e gerber stuff though once I can afford it, it's more expensive since I live in Canada.

The main issue with non-climate controlled/unfinished basements/garages/attics is the extreme temperature changes, you want to keep the temp/humidity as consistent as possible, (70 degrees/50% humidity), do what you can.

If the basement your books are stored in has a concrete floor (no flooring/carpeting) I would suggest you keep the books up off the ground as concrete gets cold and absorbs moisture.

IMO, any Mylite is better than any Poly Bag, I have books that have been in the same 1 Mil Mylite since the early 80's when I was first introduced to Mylar bags.

Ultimately the decision is yours, read the advice folks are posting and hopefully make an educated decision.

[EC Star&Bar]

I think the cold concrete floor of the basement actually causes moisture in the air to condense on top of it.

Anyway, regarding Poly, I much prefer polyethylene over polypropylene.  And I've had good luck in having polyethylene last for many years.

[joeypost]

With some of the more modern books you need to double bag. Put the comic in a bag all by itself without the board. The place the bagged comic into another bag with a board or two. This will keep any ink loss to an absolute minimum. The newer inks can rub off very easily and CGC deducts for this. 

[Arkham]

On 10/23/2020 at 8:26 AM, kaejol said:

Are M4's good?

Yeah - they are. Thicker/firmer... For some, this is an issue with storage space (i.e. fewer books will get into your long/short box with 4mil + full backs).  But, otherwise, it is great.  As someone said above - having books in Mylar is amazing - they really “pop” visually. 

[kaejol]

On 10/26/2020 at 5:29 PM, Arkham said:

Yeah - they are. Thicker/firmer... For some, this is an issue with storage space (i.e. fewer books will get into your long/short box with 4mil + full backs).  But, otherwise, it is great.  As someone said above - having books in Mylar is amazing - they really “pop” visually. 

I've heard m4s are too thick, and make it difficult to fit books in with fullbacks. Is that true, and would I be fine just going with m2s?

[Arkham]

11 hours ago, kaejol said:

I've heard m4s are too thick, and make it difficult to fit books in with fullbacks. Is that true, and would I be fine just going with m2s?

Might depend a bit on the book. Big issue spectaculars, one-shots, some of the modern prestige stuff - all could be a bit thick - I don’t know, I haven’t had a problem.  But, that said, 99% of what I’ve ever had has been M2 and, in my opinion, that would be just fine.  I live in the sub-tropics, high humidity - all my books in M2’s are doing great.  

AFAIC, this is the authority on sizing: 

 

[kaejol]

On 11/6/2020 at 5:44 AM, Arkham said:

Might depend a bit on the book. Big issue spectaculars, one-shots, some of the modern prestige stuff - all could be a bit thick - I don’t know, I haven’t had a problem.  But, that said, 99% of what I’ve ever had has been M2 and, in my opinion, that would be just fine.  I live in the sub-tropics, high humidity - all my books in M2’s are doing great.  

AFAIC, this is the authority on sizing: 

 

One last question, I've heard of scoring the flap. What does that mean, and is it important?