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off topic: I'm interested in the science of collecting
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86 posts in this topic

8 hours ago, comicginger1789 said:

Are comics the most commonly collected item? Will it fade or does it reach enough people to make it something that could last a long time?

Collectible things definitely come and go. Example, Western stuff and dolls. My grandma collected dolls in the 80s and it was a hot market. When she passed, however, most of what she collected was worthless. The people collecting dolls shrunk drastically. Similarly with Western stuff, although I would argue it is still stronger than dolls. 

 

Not sure how we can determine if it is the most collected item hm.   The SDCC is a huge metric, as to the popularity of the medium.  We don't see turnouts like that at train, stamp, antiquarian book or any other type of collectible event.   But let's face it, the current comic con landscape is more about pop culture and movie starts now, than it is about comic books and the artists.   The MCU has given a HUGE boost to the comic world.  I have a Captain America wallet, and at least once a week, a cashier at a store will say 'cool wallet'.  I don't think that reaction would have happened 25 years ago. 

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On 10/21/2020 at 1:43 PM, Ken Aldred said:

Happy to oblige.  There's such a broad spectrum of experience. :smile:

The older I get, the easier it is for me to mentally transport to my summer vacations surrounded by SA/BA comics stacked in the order I planned to read. For a time, my bedroom was the whole world, and I imagined everything outside was the Marvel Universe  :x

 

Edited by MR SigS
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Growing up long ago, I collected coins, cards (Star Wars and Wacky Packages) and comics.  I stopped coins and cards long ago, and continued with comics until college. I stopped for 20 years (work, family) before picking it up again this year (working from home).  I first started with Casper, Richie Rich, Uncle Scrooge and Dennis the Menace.  Then, one day in 1979, I saw Fantastic Four #204 on the rack at the local store and was blown away by the much more sophisticated artwork and story.  Since then, I've collected mostly Marvel and some DC, Image, Valiant.  

One of the coolest things was just finding out yesterday that my mom loved reading comics when she was in her teens and early 20's (she's almost 90 now).  Her favorites were Wonder Woman, Archie, Casper and Incredible Hulk. She was intrigued by the question mark on the front cover of the Hulk and initially thought he was a marine coming up out of the mud.  She was 26 when #1 came out and she had to be discreet about buying it, since she was a single woman back then.  In those days, she said that she and her friends loved going to the drugstore every Saturday and buying a comic or two.  Once they were done reading, they would pass it to their friends at school and never kept any.  I also just found out that my cousin was named after Wonder Woman (Diane).  My dad liked reading comics, but only from the newspaper.  In my parents world, they loved reading comics but they never thought to collect or keep them.  

My mom remarried and I remember one incident when she was wondering what to do with her 2nd diamond ring.  I was around nine or ten at the time and I asked her how much it was worth.  She said $10,000 and I begged her many times to sell it so I could buy more comics.  Of course she didn't, and now I tell her, if I had $300 back then, I could've bought AF15 and now it'd be worth xxxx...  You can definitely tell what I cared about... 

For me, it's nostalgic and it's been a lot of fun coming back to this magical world.  And with all of the Marvel movies and TV series coming out, it's exciting to go back and see if I have any of those issues that skyrocketed in value due to a first appearance (like going on a treasure hunt).  However, even if there were no Marvel movies or TV series, I'd still be here on these boards, buying comics and enjoying them (though at much more reasonable prices!).  

Thanks for indulging me.   

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On 10/19/2020 at 1:25 PM, Westy Steve said:

So I'm really interested in the science of collecting itself.  Like what motivates us to collect?  And what techniques can we use to do it better?  I find the economics associated with selecting a collectible fascinating  though I know that's not everyone's cup of tea.

Anyone else interested in that kind of thing?  Is there a forum somewhere that people get down to the nitty gritty on this stuff?

Here it is. The entire science of collecting explained in a 4 word nutshell, and he who dies with the most stuff wins, you're welcome. 

 

 

Packrat.gif

Edited by James J Johnson
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To the OP, I would gather what you are looking for is more of a data science angle. I.e. gathering factors and translating to potential profits,etc..

I don't see this as much of a Social Science experiment. 2c

I would add that everything I've heard and looked at, points to this generation being more of a clutter free generation. Someone was trying to understand why antique collecting has been on a decline, and a big part of what he found was just that -- the newer generations do not want to own physical things that burden them, and would rather be mobile and travel easily.

Edited by bronze_rules
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On 10/19/2020 at 8:50 PM, 1950's war comics said:

it seems that women truly do collect odd things.... i knew one who had a small fortune in faberge egg type knockoffs , she showed my her valuable ones she payed $300 dollars for and that she said were now worth $500 !! she even had two 6' display cases....

i looked them up on eBay and they were all trying to sell for those prices but there were nearly zero sold listings ... they were pretty much worthless..i never had the heart to tell and burst her bubble

knew other women over the years who collected penguins , cows, pigs, teddy bears ... you name it and they had lots of money tied up in that drek but it was all worthless

You are very, very wrong. Her Fabergé eggs aren't worthless. If it's not being actively peddled, the concept of "worth" of a collection can only be assessed from the viewpoint of the collector. The Fabergé knockoffs were very clearly a source of delight to the woman. If they weren't she would have been trying to sell them. This means that to her they were worth far more than that $500 figure. Who knows what price would even induce her to consider selling them, but that's at least their worth to her. The market values are meaningless to her, as they are to any hardcore collector who does it out of some combination of nostalgia, aesthetic delight or compulsion.

2c

 

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i think we just need to look at our own hobby of comics to know for the most part lots will always be worthless.  How many funny animal books are worth anything? then go for the dell or charlton comics that no one cares about it.  people of the new generation could care less about those books and therefore are not worth anything, the age of them matters very little because the people in their 60's or 70's simply dont collect anymore.  theres always exception with something of high rarity but again those books have had their audience pass by and no one new is coming along.  the only reason half the new books are worth anything is because of the movies and thats a fact.  what happens when the super hero movie comes the way of the western or the 80s action movie, that demand will drop significantly and therefore the resale price with it. and for those who say the movies will never go away, i dont think anyone thought the stallone and arnold movies getting pumped out every week would essentially cease to exist at that time either.

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On 8/25/2021 at 11:30 AM, classicaaron said:

i think we just need to look at our own hobby of comics to know for the most part lots will always be worthless.  How many funny animal books are worth anything? then go for the dell or charlton comics that no one cares about it.  people of the new generation could care less about those books and therefore are not worth anything, the age of them matters very little because the people in their 60's or 70's simply dont collect anymore.  theres always exception with something of high rarity but again those books have had their audience pass by and no one new is coming along.  the only reason half the new books are worth anything is because of the movies and thats a fact.  what happens when the super hero movie comes the way of the western or the 80s action movie, that demand will drop significantly and therefore the resale price with it. and for those who say the movies will never go away, i dont think anyone thought the stallone and arnold movies getting pumped out every week would essentially cease to exist at that time either.

well said

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On 8/22/2021 at 12:58 PM, Hepcat said:

You are very, very wrong. Her Fabergé eggs aren't worthless. If it's not being actively peddled, the concept of "worth" of a collection can only be assessed from the viewpoint of the collector. The Fabergé knockoffs were very clearly a source of delight to the woman. If they weren't she would have been trying to sell them. This means that to her they were worth far more than that $500 figure. Who knows what price would even induce her to consider selling them, but that's at least their worth to her. The market values are meaningless to her, as they are to any hardcore collector who does it out of some combination of nostalgia, aesthetic delight or compulsion.

2c

 

All I could think about while reading this is the number of parents who spend their whole lives proud of kids who are average in every way.  How do I know this happens often?  Because of the definition of "average". 

You're right, it really, really, doesn't matter to them, no matter how painfully obvious it is to every other person on the planet.  That's both an insult and a compliment to parents everywhere. :foryou:

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Robert Crumb has talked extensively in interviews and made comics about the "sickness" of collecting, the obsession. There's a great interview with him and Terry Zwigoff where they talk a ton about record collecting and the obsession of it all but I can't remember what that was in. But here is a good interview with Crumb about his record collecting that covers most of it....

http://matsgus.com/discaholic_corner/?p=2048

There is a also CD compilation called "The Stuff That Dreams Are Made of" that has liner notes that go into the obsession of record collecting too that is a good read if you can find track that down.

 

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I used to journal a lot about the topic of collecting ... I like reading articles about collecting and love seeing a well curated collection. Harry Rinker, the antiques writer, journaled for years about the topic. I found his website from reading the boards.

TLDR

Spoiler

True or false. Everyone collects something.

 

Over 70 animal species do some kind of collecting as a way to increase survival. Humans are unique in that we collect items purely for the satisfaction of seeking and owning them. The desire to collect only became possible about 12,000 years ago, once our ancestors gave up their nomadic lifestyles and settled down in one location (Jarrett, 2014).

 

One psychoanalytical explanation for why humans collect is that unloved children learn to seek comfort in accumulating belongings; another is that collecting is motivated by existential anxieties – the collection, an extension of our identity, lives on, even though we do not. More recently, evolutionary theorists suggested that a collection was a way for a man to attract potential mates by signaling his ability to accumulate resources (Jarrett, 2014). Collecting is a basic human instinct; a survival advantage amplified by eons of natural selection. Those of our ancient ancestors who managed to accumulate scarce objects may have been more prone to survive.

 

Now, there are MANY motivations to collect (after McKinley, 2007):

Nostalgia and/or a connection to history

Investment; accumulation and diversification of wealth (security and freedom)

Pure enjoyment (dopamine), relaxation and stress reduction; including appreciation of beauty, and pride of ownership

Expand one’s social lives; social interaction with fellow collectors and others (i.e. the sharing of pleasure and knowledge)

Preserve the past

The purpose of study, knowledge, and learning

The quest

Psychological security, filling a void in a sense of self; liberating psychic activity

Claim a means to distinction; a means to immortality or fame

Competitive challenge

Recognition by fellow collectors and perhaps even non-collectors

Altruism (since many great collections are ultimately donated to museums and learning institutions)

The desire to control, possess and bring order to a small part of the world

 

Many writers point out that the motives listed above are not mutually exclusive. The majority of collectors reap several benefits, though some may invest excessive amounts of time, energy and discretionary funds (McKinley, 2007). Many non-acquisition based pastimes provide similar levels of satisfaction, but serious collectors of rare objects will very often find that they have created some wealth at the end of the day (Halperin, 2015).

 

Perhaps Davis (2014) captures it best “so in one sense, collecting is a scholarly pursuit that can share information about the world we live in at the same time serving as a deeply private passion that feeds our individuality or our attempt to secure immortality” (Davis, 2014).

 

For me, I collect for nostalgia of my hippie days and a connection to the counterculture of the 1960s. I enjoy comic books as a real goods hedge against inflation and view my collection as diversification of wealth. Some items do give me pure enjoyment, but as the lady has pointed out it is sometimes the hunt for cool stuff that gives me the most pleasure. Moreover, I do get a small amount of stress reduction from hobbying. I like re-arranging and classifying parts of a-big-world-out-there, which can serve as a means of control to elicit a comfort zone in one’s life, e.g., calming fears, erasing insecurity. I largely spend money on my hobby and often I say that I am a better buyer than seller.

 

Sacrificing collecting over lifestyle

Benson (2011), in article titled “Collecting as pain and pleasure,” discusses the balance of collecting as walking the precipice of the temperate climes of hobby versus the tropics of unruly passion. There is time, energy, and money spent in acquiring, maintaining, displaying, updating, and upgrading. This drains resources from family, friends, community, work or self (Benson, 2011), which can have negative psychological implications.

 

Davis (2014) outlines the steps of a collector. The first stage is accumulating – or not throwing anything away. Stuff comes into your possession that looks good or interesting, or is amusing or historic, and you put it in a folder, or shove it in a drawer (Davis, 2014). The second stage is acquiring – when you go out deliberately to look for objects to add to your collection (Davis, 2014). The final stage is when you start buying the things you already have again, upgrading, because you want a better copy (Davis, 2014). If you collect, your first priority should be to develop an honest self-awareness of your personal ambitions. You might even try to predict how those ambitions are likely to evolve throughout the remainder of your life.

 

One of the more interesting theories on why a collector may start a new collection has to do with having two or more of something (after Stanford research I. Simonson). Owning two or more of the same items are difficult to justify psychologically. The redundancy of items is not easily justified by the mind. Therefore, individuals are likely to collect more of a thing. 

 

References

Davies, H. (2014, Nov. 7). Hunter Davies’ guide to becoming a collector. The Guardian [online]. Retrieved from http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2014/nov/07/hunter-davies-guide-becoming-collector

 

Jarrett, C. (2014, Nov. 9). Why do we collect things? Love, anxiety or desire. The Guardian [online]. Retrieved from http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2014/nov/09/why-do-we-collect-things-love-anxiety-or-desire

 

Halperin, J. (2015b). Why do we collect things? Intelligent Collector [online]. Retrieved from http://www.ha.com/intelligent-collector/why-do-we-collect-things.s?article=collect

 

McKinley, M.B. (2007). The psychology of collecting. The National Psychologist. Retrieved from http://nationalpsychologist.com/2007/01/the-psychology-of-collecting/10904.html

 

 

 

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I suppose I’m the same as many of f the other replies. 
 

firstly I love owning and expanding a collection of physical items, in my case it’s comic books and vinyl records. There’s something in me that is immensely proud of my collection. 
 

I love the historical aspect of it that something created decades ago is still as relevant now as it was then. 
 

A great story, wether it’s told via the medium of comic or song is an incredibly powerful thing. Humans have been doing it since day 1 for a reason. 
 

I’ve a urge to make my collection better and own more than I currently do. 
 

escapism and nostalgia. 

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On 8/26/2021 at 2:57 AM, The lips said:

I love the historical aspect of it that something created decades ago is still as relevant now as it was then. 

 

I’ve a urge to make my collection better and own more than I currently do. 
 

escapism and nostalgia. 

I'm uninterested in the "relevance" aspect since relevance intrinsically assumes society's endorsement. And I simply don't care what society thinks. With me it's all about the delight I derive from possessing my collectibles which is a function of both nostalgia and my personal aesthetic preferences.

:smile: 

Edited by Hepcat
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On 8/26/2021 at 11:35 PM, Hepcat said:

I'm uninterested in the "relevance" aspect since relevance intrinsically assumes society's endorsement. And I simply don't care what society thinks. With me it's all about the delight I derive from possessing my collectibles which is a function of both nostalgia and my personal aesthetic preferences.

:smile: 

Relevance and society endorsement  are two very seperate entities imo. 

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On 10/19/2020 at 6:41 PM, kav said:

If you google a bit there's really not much out there.  Freud claimed it started at birth with breast fixation which is ludicrous.  The best way to find an answer is look within and see why you collect-how it makes you feel, what motivates it.  
For me it is to reach the time when I was a kid and comics were magical, and rare.  Getting comics was like a mini christmas.  I related to these characters-they were real to me.  The fact that no other kids I knew read comics made me feel unique.  So for me it is connecting with part of the mind which had a childlike connection to the super real and magical, and people I wanted to know, not the neighborhood dolts I encountered.

Unrelated, but at a cross section of collecting things and Freud related objects I recently procured an original painting by one of Freuds most famous patients Sergei Pankejeff, or as he's better known the Wolf Man. It's not an incredible piece of art, nor am I a follower of Freuds, but I think the history of the whole topic is interesting, and it's a neat conversation piece if anybody asks about the inconspicuously small painting on my wall.

To further the topic I'll add, collecting is fun. If owning or obtaining something makes you happy, do it. I'm sure if you want a deep rooted psychoanalysis for collecting one could say growing up not having as much in comparison to ones peers, and now being able to afford most anything you want and trying to fill that void is probably up there. I'm sure it all stems from primitive hunter gatherer instincts subconsciously like value, scarcity, visual appeal, nostalgia, the drive for information and understanding, and whatever else you can come up with all being hardwired in your brain. That said it's a complex intersection of many things to many people, and I don't think you could distill the experience down to the same impetus for everyone. 

Really though I'm just a simple person, I like buying cool stuff. lol

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