What does CGC consider Restoration that should NOT be 0

[Chicago Boy]

5 hours ago, N e r V said:

All trimming or just some of the “micro trimming”? There’s a difference between some of the hack off jobs and some of the micro trims that apparently CGC (and others) may or may not be able to spot anyway.

I’ve always looked at trimming as destruction not restoration because you are taking away from its original form.  Downgrade yes but not restoration. Imo.  I can see the gray area with micro trimming though. 

[N e r V]

4 hours ago, Mmehdy said:

I tend to disagree with water cleaning and press, and tiny amount of color touch...its the idea....and I know I am old school, that comic book is what is, when you get it off the newsstand for from a collector who has purchased the book in original condition. Unrestored should be just that..ORIGINAL condition...that was the "old" term for unrestored before the professional restoring came in or just the first few years or so. it is a real shame, that something cannot be called for what it really is or appreciated for what it really is..it degrades the impossible copy kept in a wooden chest untouched and really defines rareness rather than manufactured and getting away with some restoring or upgrading which is not called that. Today...I do not even know if any book could be original other than Mile High copies. It just takes something away for comic book itself being special....and I think and every GA collector when he holds a book in his hands thinks back to the time it was on the newsstand ...that how it used to be in the "good" old days. Today, its can I pancake it up the grade ladder and pretend it was like this all along. 

 Good, Bad, or Indifferent things change over time...I accept it, but I don't have like it.

 

I know I feel the same way about my GF changing her hair 3-4 times in a week...

[Mmehdy]

4 hours ago, Tri-ColorBrian said:

Tiny color touches are no different than names written all over a cover that gets a blue label.  Check this out Mitch, which of these are more desirable?

Small amount of amateur color touch in the yellow and black areas on the center crease:

Writing all over the cover:

The book itself presents better with the color touch...but in terms of collectability and a premium on the price of the book, that is where I take issue

[Tri-Color Brian]

2 hours ago, Mmehdy said:

The book itself presents better with the color touch...but in terms of collectability and a premium on the price of the book, that is where I take issue

So, do you take issue with books that have names and other stuff written on the cover?  Why should those get a blue label, and not the books with amateur color touch (like little dots to help make a crease disappear)?

[Mmehdy]

51 minutes ago, Tri-ColorBrian said:

So, do you take issue with books that have names and other stuff written on the cover?  Why should those get a blue label, and not the books with amateur color touch (like little dots to help make a crease disappear)?

It is the intent of the person, putting one name on a book is not meant to restore or increase or change  the condition or hide a flaw of a previous condition. But color touch is Made with the intent of changing the condition of the book, sometimes hiding the real or true condition of the GA/SA boo. Apple v Orange here

[Tri-Color Brian]

45 minutes ago, Mmehdy said:

It is the intent of the person, putting one name on a book is not meant to restore or increase or change  the condition or hide a flaw of a previous condition. But color touch is Made with the intent of changing the condition of the book, sometimes hiding the real or true condition of the GA/SA boo. Apple v Orange here

I respectfully have to disagree.  Addition to the cover in the form of color touch or writing are still additions, no matter what the intent was.  Minor writing or color touch can be noted on the blue label, and the buyer can make his own choice.  Purple labels should include serious changes to the books original state, such as pieces added or major color touch. 

[Mmehdy]

12 hours ago, Tri-ColorBrian said:

I respectfully have to disagree.  Addition to the cover in the form of color touch or writing are still additions, no matter what the intent was.  Minor writing or color touch can be noted on the blue label, and the buyer can make his own choice.  Purple labels should include serious changes to the books original state, such as pieces added or major color touch. 

If it can be done...where do you draw the line to show consistent grading ...what is a little, what is a lot...I do not think you can set a practical standard in which too many people will disagree, better any..than inconsistent ..we have enough of that going around here anyway..

[porcupine48]

On 12/29/2020 at 3:24 PM, Tri-ColorBrian said:

Tiny color touches are no different than names written all over a cover that gets a blue label.  Check this out Mitch, which of these are more desirable?

Small amount of amateur color touch in the yellow and black areas on the center crease:

Writing all over the cover:

 

Spoiler

Did I show you this yet Brian?

 

[pemart1966]

On 12/29/2020 at 6:22 PM, Chicago Boy said:

I’ve always looked at trimming as destruction not restoration because you are taking away from its original form.  Downgrade yes but not restoration. Imo.  I can see the gray area with micro trimming though. 

A lot of time trimming (micro trimming included) is done with the intent to deceive while "improving eye appeal", and yes I agree, it is a form of destruction.  You're not adding anything to or improving upon what's there, you're taking away - that's destruction.

Edited December 31, 2020 by pemart1966

[Tri-Color Brian]

12 hours ago, Mmehdy said:

If it can be done...where do you draw the line to show consistent grading ...what is a little, what is a lot...I do not think you can set a practical standard in which too many people will disagree, better any..than inconsistent ..we have enough of that going around here anyway..

 

[The Lions Den]

On 12/29/2020 at 10:31 AM, Cat-Man_America said:

There used to be a green Qualified label ...I’m not even sure it’s utilized by CGC any more... that applied to staples and married pages (I think), but I believe that’s lumped into the Restored category today.

According to the information here, they still use the Green Qualified label as well as a Green and Yellow Signature Series label...

[Cat-Man_America]

6 minutes ago, The Lions Den said:

According to the information here, they still use the Green Qualified label as well as a Green and Yellow Signature Series label...

Good to know.  Don't have any green label books and haven't seen any in years, so I was covering the bases. 

[N e r V]

11 minutes ago, The Lions Den said:

According to the information here, they still use the Green Qualified label as well as a Green and Yellow Signature Series label...

It seems to be their misc. dumping label for anything that misses their other labels. Hated it and never bothered to look at any books with it. If purple was death then green was everlasting hell for books...🔥

[The Lions Den]

19 minutes ago, N e r V said:

It seems to be their misc. dumping label for anything that misses their other labels. Hated it and never bothered to look at any books with it. If purple was death then green was everlasting hell for books...🔥

Love that fire emoji...  

[N e r V]

10 minutes ago, The Lions Den said:

Love that fire emoji...  

[Tri-Color Brian]

On 12/30/2020 at 6:05 PM, porcupine48 said:

  Hide contents

Did I show you this yet Brian?

 

No, you didn't.  Nice.  Now, put some color touch on it to tick off Mitch...

[50YrsCollctngCmcs]

On 12/31/2020 at 5:56 PM, N e r V said:

It seems to be their misc. dumping label for anything that misses their other labels. Hated it and never bothered to look at any books with it. If purple was death then green was everlasting hell for books...🔥

I've seen some interesting qualified green labels. If I couldn't afford to get a book any other way I would certainly be interested in an otherwise beautiful qualified label designating a coupon cut out. The only difference would be giving it a higher grade ignoring the coupon cut.

I do think there are some ways to get some really good deals on beautiful books with otherwise very minor imperfections or issues that would result in a purple label. The book below is an example with very minor color touch picked up for a fraction of the cost of a blue label. A very respectable copy that you can read and enjoy.

 

[N e r V]

3 hours ago, 50YrsCollctngCmcs said:

I've seen some interesting qualified green labels. If I couldn't afford to get a book any other way I would certainly be interested in an otherwise beautiful qualified label designating a coupon cut out. The only difference would be giving it a higher grade ignoring the coupon cut.

I do think there are some ways to get some really good deals on beautiful books with otherwise very minor imperfections or issues that would result in a purple label. The book below is an example with very minor color touch picked up for a fraction of the cost of a blue label. A very respectable copy that you can read and enjoy.

 

Stuff cut out wouldn’t get me to buy a green label but I do remember a boardie I believe posting he got a green because of a stamp on the cover. Apparently unless it’s a date stamp or such anything else is considered green label material?

 

I could live with the above...

 

[porcupine48]

On 12/31/2020 at 8:56 PM, N e r V said:

It seems to be their misc. dumping label for anything that misses their other labels. Hated it and never bothered to look at any books with it. If purple was death then green was everlasting hell for books...🔥