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My experience with fractional ownership of comics: JIM #83 / $215,000
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444 posts in this topic

thinking of bitcoin, here is a post from 12/5/13 from a bitcoin thread here:

"Short answer - steer clear. Do not put your money into anything remotely resembling bitcoin.

Long answer - there is future for virtual currency, I just don't see bitcoin playing any part in that future. The anonymity aspect is the most troubling part, and the history of hacks showing how easily the network can be compromised hasn't helped."

I wonder how much $1K in 12/5/13 bitcoin is worth today?

I was broke in 2010-2013, not that I couldn't have found $500 for this to tuck away. The whole concept seemed completely insane to me. So much room for shenanigans, the bitcoin inventor watering down the currency. competing crypto currencies. regulations pretty much destroying it.

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I think it is a viable way for people to own part of something they couldn't buy outright (isn't this true with all shares when you buy into a company?).   I just don't like the model.  

I like being able to plunk my money into say- Apple at 9:30 a.m.   Then if I want to sell it at 9:31 a.m.  I can do that.  I also like companies that pay dividends, have a prospectus, and have a product I can support as a consumer.   

This is somebody owning a collectible, and charging you the honor of a fractional share, and at the end of the day, we get to see where the ticker is for AF15....oh wait we can't.   There is a lack of transparency that I don't need/want on this.

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This is going to look like bragging, but it's meant to be an explanation.

I turn 45 years old this year, with 30+ years of comic collecting experience.

I have a vested retirement plan that guarantees income until I die.

I own acres of property.

I own two cars.

I own two houses.

I own a $5,000+ Wayne Gretzky rookie card.

I own a $10,000+ Michael Jordan rookie card.

I own a $5,000+ Comics Magazine #1 (1936, 1st prototype of Superman).

I own a $10,000+ X-Men #1

I own a $30,000+ TMNT #1 first printing.

I own more than 1,000 other CGC slabs.

I own dozens of pages of original art.

I own stock in 20 companies.

I own Bitcoin and Ethereum and 50 other cryptocurrencies.

I also own shares in RallyRd assets... why?  Because all of the above doesn't let me put a few dollars into a half-dozen $50,000+ comic books at the very top of the hobby I love. 

RallyRd does.

Edited by valiantman
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25 minutes ago, Mercury Man said:

I think it is a viable way for people to own part of something they couldn't buy outright (isn't this true with all shares when you buy into a company?).   I just don't like the model.  

I like being able to plunk my money into say- Apple at 9:30 a.m.   Then if I want to sell it at 9:31 a.m.  I can do that.  I also like companies that pay dividends, have a prospectus, and have a product I can support as a consumer.   

This is somebody owning a collectible, and charging you the honor of a fractional share, and at the end of the day, we get to see where the ticker is for AF15....oh wait we can't.   There is a lack of transparency that I don't need/want on this.

Another problem is that there’s very little trading volume on the comics.  If you buy a significant chunk of a comic, you can’t get out of it without taking a big hit on the current market value.  They had a CGC 9.4 Tales of Suspense 39 trading today.  It started the day at $159k.  When I checked around noon, it was at $282k, up over 70% on the day and more than double the IPO price.  Great!  The people who bought early can cash in big, right?  Nope.  The highest bid was for one share at a $180k value.  The next bid was for one share at a $165k value.  Then one share at $159k.  Then 30 shares at $3k (not a typo).  Where did it end the day?  At $132k, down 17%.

When you look at the bid history, a lot of the transactions are for one or two shares.  Prices are moving up by tens and sometimes hundreds of thousands of dollars based on a tiny number of shares trading hands.  The Buzz Aldrin joystick mentioned a couple pages ago started at $300k on Tuesday, was up over $700k early in the day, and ended under $300k.

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2 hours ago, valiantman said:

This is going to look like bragging, but it's meant to be an explanation.

I turn 45 years old this year, with 30+ years of comic collecting experience.

I have a vested retirement plan that guarantees income until I die.

I own acres of property.

I own two cars.

I own two houses.

I own a $5,000+ Wayne Gretzky rookie card.

I own a $10,000+ Michael Jordan rookie card.

I own a $5,000+ Comics Magazine #1 (1936, 1st prototype of Superman).

I own a $10,000+ X-Men #1

I own a $30,000+ TMNT #1 first printing.

I own more than 1,000 other CGC slabs.

I own dozens of pages of original art.

I own stock in 20 companies.

I own Bitcoin and Ethereum and 50 other cryptocurrencies.

I also own shares in RallyRd assets... why?  Because all of the above doesn't let me put a few dollars into a half-dozen $50,000+ comic books at the very top of the hobby I love. 

RallyRd does.

I can appreciate this. 

I don't think it's a scam.  They are pretty up front about their valuations and what they do. 

I'm not interested in the model, but can appreciate that others are. And if it's a small part of your investment portfolio it's really no different than gambling on a stock. 

 

One of the things I don't love about it is the high valuations on graded comics. It creates a steeper hill for comics to climb before you see a return. But, with the markets looking right now, I imagine people are able to pull cash out pretty readily. So it's working for some people in the current market. 

 

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5 minutes ago, KCOComics said:

One of the things I don't love about it is the high valuations on graded comics. It creates a steeper hill for comics to climb before you see a return. But, with the markets looking right now, I imagine people are able to pull cash out pretty readily. So it's working for some people in the current market. 

True, but I'm in it because I love these books and want them in my collection, even if it's a small part.  The "steeper hill for comics to climb" isn't a problem when I wouldn't even own these books any other way.  My 30+ year collection gets to 40+ years pretty easily if I'm in no hurry.

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15 hours ago, William-James88 said:

You don't own any stocks? No pension fund? No 401k?

Of course 401K. That is my money that I own and can pull out and spend. Those numbers on the screen are mine and I will enjoy my money one day.
 

I can never own any of those books, and if I ever want to see a nice copy I can zoom in on a Heritage Auction to look at it.

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1 hour ago, BigLeagueCHEW said:

Of course 401K. That is my money that I own and can pull out and spend. Those numbers on the screen are mine and I will enjoy my money one day.
 

I can never own any of those books, and if I ever want to see a nice copy I can zoom in on a Heritage Auction to look at it.

All good points. I think that's it though. People are investing in these comics like you would a stock. I cant really see another way this would be interpreted. 

Edited by William-James88
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17 hours ago, the blob said:

thinking of bitcoin, here is a post from 12/5/13 from a bitcoin thread here:

"Short answer - steer clear. Do not put your money into anything remotely resembling bitcoin.

Long answer - there is future for virtual currency, I just don't see bitcoin playing any part in that future. The anonymity aspect is the most troubling part, and the history of hacks showing how easily the network can be compromised hasn't helped."

I wonder how much $1K in 12/5/13 bitcoin is worth today?

I was broke in 2010-2013, not that I couldn't have found $500 for this to tuck away. The whole concept seemed completely insane to me. So much room for shenanigans, the bitcoin inventor watering down the currency. competing crypto currencies. regulations pretty much destroying it.

My son is making a killing currently mining etherium. He is buying video game units/pcs with large video
cards and make his money back on them in 2 months time. His only problem is in the winter it works
great as he doesn't even run his furnace in his apartment. The summer will be his problem trying to keep
them cool. He pays his entire utility bill from it with cash left over each month so not a retirement, but for a college kid its easy money.

 

Edited by fastballspecial
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17 minutes ago, William-James88 said:

All good points. I think that's it though. People are investing in these comics like you would a stock. I cant really see another way this would be interpreted. 

As long as the value is there for the investors, to each their own.

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23 minutes ago, fastballspecial said:

My son is making a killing currently mining etherium. He is buying video game units/pcs with large video
cards and make his money back on them in 2 months time. His only problem is in the winter it works
great as he doesn't even run his furnace in his apartment. The summer will be his problem trying to keep
them cool. He pays his entire utility bill from it with cash left over each month so not a retirement, but for a college kid its easy money.

 

Embrace the grind.

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1 hour ago, William-James88 said:
2 hours ago, BigLeagueCHEW said:

Of course 401K. That is my money that I own and can pull out and spend. Those numbers on the screen are mine and I will enjoy my money one day.
 

I can never own any of those books, and if I ever want to see a nice copy I can zoom in on a Heritage Auction to look at it.

All good points. I think that's it though. People are investing in these comics like you would a stock. I cant really see another way this would be interpreted. 

Exactly - and there's no requirement that it's for a "quick flip".  People seem to be stuck on the premium that RallyRd adds for doing all the work and making the shares available.

I would love to have some fraction of Action Comics #1 at 1990 prices plus a premium of 200% - if it was 1990 prices - and I'd still own it 30 years later.

Long-term investing is always just numbers on a screen - but what do they represent?  Something that matters to you, or something a financial advisor once suggested?

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2 minutes ago, Muno42 said:

I have a question about trade/sale of the shares. If share values increase from trading/sales/etc, but the book does not grow in value to match, what happens if most of the owners jump to sell at the same time?

This...

madoff31309.jpg

Edited by Funnybooks
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1 hour ago, Muno42 said:

I have a question about trade/sale of the shares. If share values increase from trading/sales/etc, but the book does not grow in value to match, what happens if most of the owners jump to sell at the same time?

The price drops, exactly the same as if people decide to dump stocks on the same day or if the same not-very-expensive slab is put up for sale by lots of people at the same time.

The demand for $50,000+ comic books has always been limited to people who can pay $50,000+, and that is a small number of people who determined all the market activity.

If you could increase the number of people capable of participating in the $50,000+ comic market, you'd shift a traditionally exclusive market into a much wider area of activity - closer to stocks or lower valued comics.

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Time to stir the pot again...have added to my Rally holdings...

FF1 and 5 (46% funded in first hour of ipo) and DD1. The FF5 is a 9.2 at a $80k valuation.

(but I spent more than all that combined at my LCS yesterday.) #diversification

678F6C4B-271E-4839-B4E3-C3CB8E0FEA4C.jpeg

70D3457C-C4CD-4B77-812A-0F3045526FF6.jpeg

8430F7A6-E7C5-4323-8D91-5084C8DFCBB4.png

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