Has anyone figured out the rhyme or reason to CGC pricing? Their grading seems great? 0

[Yeahiwasder4dat]

CGC seems to grade pretty hard. Which personally I like because you know exactly what you're getting. I've seen some wild mess from BGS especially when it gets below like an 8.5(7s that look like 5) Most of the cards I sent in on last submission are .5 lower than what I was thinking they would be. In hindsight should've got sub grades on some bit oh well.

The cases are clearer, and cleaner. Better eye appeal. Grading is tough. Both positives to me but the sell prices on some aren't as high. Can't figure out if people don't trust CGC as much because they're newer or what. After this round of cards came back, it instilled faith in me as to their competence in grading accurately. Sell prices just don't seem to be there. Any thoughts as to why?

[Sambuck2]

You answered it yoursel. New kids in the block. If you've got 100 PSA or 100 BGS slabs of a certain set or style of cards it might not be as fun to collect a new slab design. Plus trust takes a long time to build for consumers,with time their prices may continue to get closer.

[Ron Churches]

They key factor for me thinking CGC closes the gap is that almost everyone acknowledges that their grading is more stringent; that tells me that over time (especially when we have their population report), people will be able to charge for the grade.  If I'm a collector and I see CGC high grades going cheap, I would scoop them.  You KNOW the card is represented right, and the card is the whole point. I think some of the noise around the cases being 'weak' or whatever, which is mostly nonsense, is rooted in a small contingent wanting to knock whatever they can to prop up the gap between CGC and PSA/BGS. I'm frequently on Virbank (on Facebook Marketplace), looking for deals, and I am seeing way more CGC slabs and way less of the comment ambush that was happening before.

[alohaboyz]

Being the strictest does  not mean better. 

Consistency is most important to succeed in the long run.

GMA graded easier in the past, i would buy there cards knowing to just down grade the grades by 1.

Now GMA is overly strict on some cards.  now i do not even buy the cards because i do not know what i am dealing with grade wise.

CONSISTENCY IS KING. 

Consistently easy graders, fine.

Consistently strict graders fine.

INCONSISTENT GRADERS,  HORRIBLE.

 

 

 

[Ron Churches]

GMA was never, ever considered a strong option.  They have holes in their process and are not viewed as legitimate by anyone I've ever seen and their sales land around NM prices consistently on every marketplace I have seem them offered (if they are able to sell, at all).  To date, I have seen little data that would support that CGC is inconsistent with their grading results.  If anything, I'd expect they'd grade the same card fairly consistently, since they state they lean on technology as a major factor in their grading process. This is likely why their centering and surface grading is seen as 'tougher' overall and would lead to a more objective grading result.  

[alohaboyz]

24 minutes ago, Ron Churches said:

GMA was never, ever considered a strong option.  They have holes in their process and are not viewed as legitimate by anyone I've ever seen and their sales land around NM prices consistently on every marketplace I have seem them offered (if they are able to sell, at all).  To date, I have seen little data that would support that CGC is inconsistent with their grading results.  If anything, I'd expect they'd grade the same card fairly consistently, since they state they lean on technology as a major factor in their grading process. This is likely why their centering and surface grading is seen as 'tougher' overall and would lead to a more objective grading result.  

Have you actually used GMA?   

I have submitted and bought GMA slabs.  They are inconsistent.  But there are great finds in GMA Slabs.   i have bought GMA 8 slabs that grade PSA 10.   GMA 10 that grade PSA 10.   But, i have bought GMA 10 slabs that look like 8's also .

At this point ,  CGC seems to be consistent.  But a little to strict on the centering in my opinion.    As CGC grows and hire more graders, we will find out how consistent they will be.   I use PSA(1000's),BGS(1000's) ,SGC(past),CGC(1,000+) and GMA(20 cards)

They all have a use to me personally.   Good and Bad.  But i base my opinions on actual use , not hearsay. 

 

[Yeahiwasder4dat]

34 minutes ago, Ron Churches said:

GMA was never, ever considered a strong option.  They have holes in their process and are not viewed as legitimate by anyone I've ever seen and their sales land around NM prices consistently on every marketplace I have seem them offered (if they are able to sell, at all).  To date, I have seen little data that would support that CGC is inconsistent with their grading results.  If anything, I'd expect they'd grade the same card fairly consistently, since they state they lean on technology as a major factor in their grading process. This is likely why their centering and surface grading is seen as 'tougher' overall and would lead to a more objective grading result.  

Don't think anyone has ever considered GMA legit for anything other than a glorified top loader. Simply never considered them due to that, at least in baseball card realm. Resale value is non-existent.

[alohaboyz]

8 minutes ago, Yeahiwasder4dat said:

Don't think anyone has ever considered GMA legit for anything other than a glorified top loader. Simply never considered them due to that, at least in baseball card realm. Resale value is non-existent.

"legit" ?   i think GMA is legit up to $100 cards.   For me, all the companies are "legit" up to a certain value that  differs for each company.

 

Edited January 11, 2021 by alohaboyz

[Yeahiwasder4dat]

33 minutes ago, alohaboyz said:

"legit" ?   i think GMA is legit up to $100 cards.   For me, all the companies are "legit" up to a certain value that  differs for each company.

 

Legit in terms of grade. Too many people see their grades as inconsistent and all over the map. Will a 10 be an actual 10, or an 8. I think it was on net54 someone tried them and got a ten on a card with a 1/16-32" of the corner bent. It was pretty easy to see without much effort.

 

Could have been reddit I saw it not net54 but there are other cases like that I've seen as well where there's no way a card was a 10.

Edited January 11, 2021 by Yeahiwasder4dat

[alohaboyz]

2 minutes ago, Yeahiwasder4dat said:

Legit in terms of grade. Too many people see their grades as inconsistent and all over the map. Will a 10 be an actual 10, or an 8. I think it was on net54 someone tried them and got a ten on a card with a 1/16-32" of the corner bent. It was pretty easy to see without much effort.

I seen horrible PSA/BGS  graded cards. Totally off centered PSA 10's.  counterfeit cards slabbed in PSA/BGS Slabs.   

It is what it is.  I use PSA,BGS,SGC,CGC and even GMA for a test.   They all suck and are great at the same time.

[Yeahiwasder4dat]

14 minutes ago, alohaboyz said:

I seen horrible PSA/BGS  graded cards. Totally off centered PSA 10's.  counterfeit cards slabbed in PSA/BGS Slabs.   

It is what it is.  I use PSA,BGS,SGC,CGC and even GMA for a test.   They all suck and are great at the same time.

I feel you, it's weird how the market goes. I sent some Handcuts to SGC because they will give it a numerical grade. PSA will only label authentic if it doesn't have the entire border regardless of how good everything else is. mess was probably cut by 8 year olds 60 years ago. Thousands of dollars can depend on how skilled they were with scissors and following the outside of the line??? 🙄 

Vintage goes to SGC, Modern to PSA for me. Can't wait for CSG for my personal collection. Not trying to get any money out of the grading so it should be decent turn around but still get them encapsulated.

Edited January 11, 2021 by Yeahiwasder4dat

[alohaboyz]

1 hour ago, Yeahiwasder4dat said:

I feel you, it's weird how the market goes. I sent some Handcuts to SGC because they will give it a numerical grade. PSA will only label authentic if it doesn't have the entire border regardless of how good everything else is. mess was probably cut by 8 year olds 60 years ago. Thousands of dollars can depend on how skilled they were with scissors and following the outside of the line??? 🙄 

Vintage goes to SGC, Modern to PSA for me. Can't wait for CSG for my personal collection. Not trying to get any money out of the grading so it should be decent turn around but still get them encapsulated.

Yes,

Honestly,  Flippers will get "grade shock" if CSG grades like they do CGC cards.  The grades will be lower and the flippers will go back to PSA/BGS for resale prices and easier grades. Could be a good or bad thing.  But i will submit the day CSG opens the doors.   But the wait is like waiting for grades to pop.   "SOON" is like months.  "DAYS" are like months.  I have no idea what "SOON" is at this point.  LOL.  (it was in a couple of weeks in Dec 2020, Then it was beginning of Jan 2021, now it is Feb 2021.  LOL.

[DB Cards]

2 hours ago, alohaboyz said:

Yes,

Honestly,  Flippers will get "grade shock" if CSG grades like they do CGC cards.  The grades will be lower and the flippers will go back to PSA/BGS for resale prices and easier grades. Could be a good or bad thing.  But i will submit the day CSG opens the doors.   But the wait is like waiting for grades to pop.   "SOON" is like months.  "DAYS" are like months.  I have no idea what "SOON" is at this point.  LOL.  (it was in a couple of weeks in Dec 2020, Then it was beginning of Jan 2021, now it is Feb 2021.  LOL.

Agreed. I have a bunch of cards coming in from COMC this week and I will likely give CSG a shot with the more valuable ones in a bulk order because the turnaround time will likely be great out the gate (like CGC's was).

[Mephisto]

On 1/11/2021 at 12:12 PM, Ron Churches said:

GMA was never, ever considered a strong option.  They have holes in their process and are not viewed as legitimate by anyone I've ever seen and their sales land around NM prices consistently on every marketplace I have seem them offered (if they are able to sell, at all).  To date, I have seen little data that would support that CGC is inconsistent with their grading results.  If anything, I'd expect they'd grade the same card fairly consistently, since they state they lean on technology as a major factor in their grading process. This is likely why their centering and surface grading is seen as 'tougher' overall and would lead to a more objective grading result.  

Way too small of a period of time on business to even judge consistency. Go look through the comics general section here as there is often threads commenting on periods of strict vs loose grading, mention of periods of both, and people asking what the current grading for comics is like as they might hold of submitting depending on the current trend. About a half a year is way too small a sample size to get an idea of how consistency will be for any grading company.

[bulldog1986]

When it comes to GMA, as far as I know it's literally one gentleman who is grading everything on his own. You even ship it to his residential home. I was actually considering them for cheap loose grades and slabbing prior to their price increase and CGC arriving on the market. I could never justify paying GMA the same amount as someone like PSA or CGC when their grades are all over the place.

I think the problem is the mindset of "I want to be a winner" comes in and gives business to places like PSA and GMA. They grade more loosely than I've seen with BGS and CGC thus far and since you're more likely to get a 10 with your submission, and 10's equal better resale value, why wouldn't you go for them?

I hope that mindset changes over time though, and I think with good competition it will. If CGC can keep up their current pricing for a while and PSA continues to be backlogged, I think you'll start seeing the market shift. Hell I would like to see more competition make it's way in to the market, if places like SGC can enter in the pokemon market competitively, that would be awesome. I would even root for MNT to get in on the US market if they could ever figure out a good way around the shipping costs to Canada cause their labels look pretty cool.

 

 

Edited January 13, 2021 by bulldog1986