Are there really lots of new collectors, and do they care about the older stuff? 1 1

[New School Fool]

9 hours ago, PhilipB2k17 said:

Unless the comic they are drawing gets turned into a big TV show or movie that reaches pop culture phenom status, It’s unlikely. Just because it’s a TV show isn’t enough.

Another thing I've observed which I feel is relevant to this conversation may negate this fact. 2019 saw the release of two Ms Marvel Kamala Khan Covers. One of her in a standing pose and the other of her in a more dynamic action pose. I've subsequently learnt from 'Comics, by Perch' on Youtube that the run these covers are from sold abysmally, so not many collectors would have been aware of them, even though (IMHO) the cover art was top notch.  I liked them both but had my eye on other things, both were selling in the $2000 range.

The standing pose cover took about 4 months to be snapped up. Not very fast in relation to the artwork on offer. The dynamic pose cover took about 2 years, and has only recently been sold. I would feel I missed out on these if it wasn't for the fact that I had my sights on something slightly better during the time.

The standing pose cover came up for auction recently. This was the 2nd chance I was looking for. I thought I may even get it cheaper seeing as it is modern comic art, (something that apparently no 'old school' collector goes for), and a character that isn't viewed as popular as the others, despite a TV show being announced, and the seeming lack of demand for the artwork.

In the end it went for just over $4000, I was an under bidder on the piece. more than 100% increase in value after 2 years. This confuses me because the dynamic cover by the same artist, which has a similar composition to the standing cover sat around unsold for 2 years at $2000

Edited February 10, 2021 by Shin-Kaiser

[Varanis]

2 hours ago, jjonahjameson11 said:

These recent posts about newer (younger) collectors, current titles and new artists (within the last 10 years) are things I’d love Bill Cox to explore in his YouTube videos.

so many of us are between the ages of 45-55 and we’ve been collecting for 15+ years already, but it’s mostly the same old, same old.

I don’t remember the last time I purchased a new comic, let alone flipped through the pages to see what the art looks like now , but I’m willing to give it a try based on some recommendations here, and who knows?  Perhaps I’ll like it enough to pick up a page or two?

Modern wise, I think it’s hard to go wrong with the following if you’re looking to check something out:

Thor: God of Thunder #1-#11 by Aaron and Ribic

Thanos #13-#18 by Cates and Shaw

Vision #1-#12 by King and Walta

I’m a Marvel guy, so definitely a bias. King’s Mister Miracle story is one of the best on the DC side. 

[Andahaion]

5 minutes ago, Varanis said:

Modern wise, I think it’s hard to go wrong with the following if you’re looking to check something out:

Thor: God of Thunder #1-#11 by Aaron and Ribic

Thanos #13-#18 by Cates and Shaw

Vision #1-#12 by King and Walta

I’m a Marvel guy, so definitely a bias. King’s Mister Miracle story is one of the best on the DC side. 

I second these suggestions, and keeping on the DC side I think Venditti's Hawkman run was revelatory for the character.  It's contained in four trades, the last of which was released a couple days ago.  

Tom King/Andy Kubert's 'Superman Up in the Sky' I put up there with All-Star Superman in terms of quality Superman tales.  This will be especially meaningful for Superman fans like myself.  

For two things non-big 2; 'Sara' by Ennis/Epting is a great tale of female Russian snipers in WWII.  I think TKO produces that.

Lastly, Jeffrey Alan Love's tales, 'Thousand Demon Tree' and 'Notes from the Shadowed City' are unique works.  

There's a lot of junk out there, but also some gems from just about every timeframe.

[Hockeyflow33]

 

3 hours ago, jjonahjameson11 said:

These recent posts about newer (younger) collectors, current titles and new artists (within the last 10 years) are things I’d love Bill Cox to explore in his YouTube videos.

so many of us are between the ages of 45-55 and we’ve been collecting for 15+ years already, but it’s mostly the same old, same old.

I don’t remember the last time I purchased a new comic, let alone flipped through the pages to see what the art looks like now , but I’m willing to give it a try based on some recommendations here, and who knows?  Perhaps I’ll like it enough to pick up a page or two?

New comics are tough because guys like King and Cates get all this praise but their stuff is so repetitive and such a slog to get through text-wise. Despite how nice he is I can't get through another King book and for the life of me Mister Miracle and Heroes in Crisis were absolutely terrible. 

My pull list is the smallest it's ever been now that DC has fired all their good writers.

I'd second the Venditti Hawkman recommendation.

If you like Kirkman, both Oblivion Song and Firepower have been fun reads.

Tynion's Batman is okay, if he can stop shoe-horning in Harley characters it would be much better.

Anything Brubaker puts out is fantastic so you can always count on him. 

Tomasi has been on fire the last few years between Batman, Super Sons and Detective Comics, all are excellent. I think he's the best modern writer out there today but DC won't let him stay on a book for very long. 

Before Bendis took over Superman (thumbs down), Dan Jurgens was writing some awesome Superman stories. 

[babsrocks31]

8 hours ago, Shin-Kaiser said:

 

From my observation, whether it's original art or monoprints from not so well known artists, the good pages go quick. People are definitely buying them. The rest sit there for 'years' until collectors realise the artist is a hot commodity and then snap up the less desirable pages as investment opportunities. This time last year you could still buy a Tradd Moore page or cover on Felix's site, they went untouched for a while. I heard that a dealer initially had trouble shifting the famous McFarlane ASM #300 cover back in the day, and sat unsold for a few years.

Then there's the fact that the collectors with buying potential are simply not reading modern comics and have no interest in modern artists...this may explain the lack of sales of 'The Milkman' art. I was able to purchase a great ensemble All New All Different Avengers cover in the Black Friday sale for less than $1000. Eight characters on one page for less than $1000 - Insane! The art was unsold on the site for a year and I bought it in a sale! I couldn't believe it. The piece is unquestionably great art, maybe I was only able to purchase it because this team was overlooked by the 'big boy' collectors.

All great points. I agree...

   I think many people with buying power are mostly focused on older art, and many newer fans don't have that buying power so they are less interested in older art from the get go.

[vodou]

4 hours ago, Varanis said:

it’s anyone’s guess what the future of cryptocurrency will look like

All will be outlawed. That's the guaranteed future.

NIRP globally means there cannot be any competition with central bank "official" e-currencies. We're not there yet, but very close.

Cryptos are a sticky wicket for those holding huge 'gains' in cryptos...hold and watch them become zero or cash out and give half back the government in capital gains tax.

[Will_K]

Re: the question about older collectors buying art by younger artists.

I see a lot of art on CAF from various artists.  I watch a lot of galleries even if they don't really overlap with my collection. 

As an older buyer, here are some reasons why I rarely buy art from newer artists:

I generally don't keep up with today's comics.  The stories don't interest me, I like the "one and done" model, no complicated storylines across several issues.  I'm too lazy to research new "one and done" comics.  Also, too many universe "reboots".  I have less time to invest in reading comics anyway.

The costumes are "off model" and I don't like keeping up with costume changes.  The characters are less recognizable to me.

The drawing styles are "too busy" for me, too many lines.  I'm not interested in researching a new artist to find what I like.

Even for convention sketches or commissions, newer artists seem to charge "a lot" (e.g. $500 or more) without blinking an eye and I don't want to take a chance.

Going back to the original question...

I can imagine that newer (and/or younger) collectors won't buy older art for some of the same reasons above.  But in the opposite manner.  Two examples... re: "off model", maybe they don't like the old school Batman costume... re: drawing style, by today's standards, could Curt Swan get a gig drawing Superman? 

And then there's the cost of older, "desirable" art.  How many younger collectors are willing to spend half a year's pay on a single piece of comic art ??

Edited February 10, 2021 by Will_K

[jjonahjameson11]

50 minutes ago, Will_K said:

Re: the question about older collectors buying art by younger artists.

I see a lot of art on CAF from various artists.  I watch a lot of galleries even if they don't really overlap with my collection. 

As an older buyer, here are some reasons why I rarely buy art from newer artists:

I generally don't keep up with today's comics.  The stories don't interest me, I like the "one and done" model, no complicated storylines across several issues.  I'm too lazy to research new "one and done" comics.  Also, too many universe "reboots".  I have less time to invest in reading comics anyway.

The costumes are "off model" and I don't like keeping up with costume changes.  The characters are less recognizable to me.

The drawing styles are "too busy" for me, too many lines.  I'm not interested in researching a new artist to find what I like.

Even for convention sketches or commissions, newer artists seem to charge "a lot" (e.g. $500 or more) without blinking an eye and I don't want to take a chance.

Going back to the original question...

I can imagine that newer (and/or younger) collectors won't buy older art for some of the same reasons above.  But in the opposite manner.  Two examples... re: "off model", maybe they don't like the old school Batman costume... re: drawing style, by today's standards, could Curt Swan get a gig drawing Superman? 

And then there's the cost of older, "desirable" art.  How many younger collectors are willing to spend half a year's pay on a single piece of comic art ??

Agree on Curt Swan not being able to get a gig drawing Superman, by today’s standards.

regarding younger collectors, i suppose that would depend on your profession and pay.

I hire many millennials on a contract basis as part of my job.  They are paid surprisingly well, and have minimal expenses.  If they were keen on picking up “Older” art, I’m certain they can pick up a few $20K pieces a year.  They certainly have the funds.

[furthur]

I am definitely the definition of an old collector (over 60-yikes!)  . When I first bought comic art it certainly wasnt for nostalgia-I was buying the stuff I was interested in within a year or two at most after publication. It was only after I started collecting for a while that I began collecting  older material, but once I went down that rabbit hole I was hooked. Part of it was simply seeing what kind of material that the folks I liked were influenced by, but that quickly gave way to just looking at things and deciding if I liked them myself. Virtually every piece of comic strip art I have purchased is far outside of any true nostalgia for me. I never read any the things I own other than Bloom County and a few others-but comic strip art is probably a good third of my collection. 

I have always read comics though. The thing I rarely read is superhero comics. They are full of the same tropes they always have had. The breath of fresh air that the gritty comics of the 70's and 80's brought to the table has long become just another stale formula so my interest in the form for reading purposes has migrated almost entirely to independent books. I collect art from those, but I also buy things from modern artists in the superhero field when I think they are doing something out of the box. I definitely started looking harder at some of the artists Felix Lu represents because I felt like a lot of them were pushing the envelope more than some of the other mainstream guys and that led me to look at some of the Inky Knuckles guys and others. What I try to do is to ask folks I know what they like-especially younger collectors and I have found some fantastic work that way. 

I don't know if newer collectors will follow the same path, but I suspect that if they enjoy the form, as I do, that they will likely find that there is a lot of material from the past that is of great interest. As the big two begin to slow their production to concentrate on using their IP in movies and games, folks who like comics may well find that the only way to reliably get new things to read, at least in the superhero genre,  is to go backwards rather than forwards and that might also influence collecting habits. 

[babsrocks31]

13 hours ago, jjonahjameson11 said:

These recent posts about newer (younger) collectors, current titles and new artists (within the last 10 years) are things I’d love Bill Cox to explore in his YouTube videos.

so many of us are between the ages of 45-55 and we’ve been collecting for 15+ years already, but it’s mostly the same old, same old.

I don’t remember the last time I purchased a new comic, let alone flipped through the pages to see what the art looks like now , but I’m willing to give it a try based on some recommendations here, and who knows?  Perhaps I’ll like it enough to pick up a page or two?

What a great, healthy attitude to have. Kudos.

As a newish collector (about 5 years) and about 15 years reading comics, I'm in the middle. I'm 31, with a steady job but not a high wage... I love discovering new artists when I walk into my local comic shop. Sure, nostalgia is a big thing for me too, but so is contacting a working artist to try to get page from a new book that I think is just as good as the older stuff.

Getting an old page that we remember fondly is its own thrill, and finding a new artist is its own fun too. We need to keep finding 'new' artists, otherwise the hobby will slowly wither.

Classics never die, that's why they earned the distinction of being called 'classic'. There will always be people going back to them or discovering for the first time.

Instead of worrying about that, I enjoy looking at all of the amazing artists we have now. Seriously, there are so many solid indie books now, and offshoots and mini series etc... Lots of great artists attached to these projects.

 

It's not that the classics don't matter. They do. It's just that rather than trying to preserve this hobby or make it exclusive, I'd like to see it grow and evolve, be inclusive. For the love of the art. 

Edited February 11, 2021 by babsrocks31

[dichotomy]

I’m mid-40s and buying mid 80s to current OA. Here’s my current pull list more or less. I’m clearly a Big 2 guy but I am trying (and finding) great material outside them too. 2 stand outs are Dept of Truth (Tynion/Simmonds and much more unique than Batman) and Something is Killing The Children. Cheers. 
 

The Clock

Undiscovered Country

Dept of Truth

Marvels

Marvels X

Wolverine

Giant Size X-Men

Marauders

New Mutants

X-Factor

X-Men

X-Men + Fantastic Four

Hawkeye Freefall

The Rise of Kylo Ren

Spider-Man (Abrams)

Strange Adventures

Superman’s Pal JO

Batman’s Grave

Batman White Knight

Dceased Dead Planet

Decorum

Star Wars

Darth Vader

SW : I High Republic

Future State: Swamp Thing

Future State: Wonder Woman

GIGA (Le)

Norse Mythology

x-Ray Robot

Immortal Hulk Trade

Daredevil Trade

Something is Killing the Children Trade 

 

 

[rlextherobot]

I bought my first piece of OA some two decades ago ago now, but I think by the standards of this discussion I am a new collector: I bought more OA in the last 12 months than in the previous 20 years combined. I can say that there is plenty of bronze and silver age art that interests me, but very little of it falls within my modest budget. I did splash out on a piece of SIlver Age art last year (which was very reasonably priced but still a lot of money for me) but I don't foresee many more in my future for pricing and availability reasons. Thankfully there's plenty of great modern art by up and coming creators that I have interest in for aesthetic reasons rather than historical ones. So yeah, I think the hobby can accommodate people at a lot of different price points, dependent on their interests. 

[Michael (OML)1]

On 2/10/2021 at 6:28 PM, furthur said:

I am definitely the definition of an old collector (over 60-yikes!)  . When I first bought comic art it certainly wasnt for nostalgia-I was buying the stuff I was interested in within a year or two at most after publication. It was only after I started collecting for a while that I began collecting  older material, but once I went down that rabbit hole I was hooked. Part of it was simply seeing what kind of material that the folks I liked were influenced by, but that quickly gave way to just looking at things and deciding if I liked them myself. Virtually every piece of comic strip art I have purchased is far outside of any true nostalgia for me. I never read any the things I own other than Bloom County and a few others-but comic strip art is probably a good third of my collection. 

I have always read comics though. The thing I rarely read is superhero comics. They are full of the same tropes they always have had. The breath of fresh air that the gritty comics of the 70's and 80's brought to the table has long become just another stale formula so my interest in the form for reading purposes has migrated almost entirely to independent books. I collect art from those, but I also buy things from modern artists in the superhero field when I think they are doing something out of the box. I definitely started looking harder at some of the artists Felix Lu represents because I felt like a lot of them were pushing the envelope more than some of the other mainstream guys and that led me to look at some of the Inky Knuckles guys and others. What I try to do is to ask folks I know what they like-especially younger collectors and I have found some fantastic work that way. 

I don't know if newer collectors will follow the same path, but I suspect that if they enjoy the form, as I do, that they will likely find that there is a lot of material from the past that is of great interest. As the big two begin to slow their production to concentrate on using their IP in movies and games, folks who like comics may well find that the only way to reliably get new things to read, at least in the superhero genre,  is to go backwards rather than forwards and that might also influence collecting habits. 

I love the golden age.  I hope everyone ignores it and sells their art to me.  Please do.