Post grade damage on another of my submissions 2 2

[jokiing]

Wolverine Limited #1 just back from CGC with a grade of 9.8 and a chunk taken out of the back top corner. CGC was able to fix a bent corner on a previous submission, but this isn't fixable. Four other books have excessive debris (what they call contaminates) on the inner holder.

Been too busy to contact CGC until this weekend. What to expect as a fix has me concerned.

 

[thewritestuff]

That’s awful 

[Lightning55]

Ouch.  It would be hard for them to say it came in that way and got a 9.8.  Even if you don't have "before" photos.

When we do a submission, we enter a DV (Declared Value).  That is supposed to be the amount we believe it is worth, the amount that it is insured for while at CGC, and is included in the tier pricing.  Seems like something happened to it there.  Maybe you talk to CS about a claim.

I have seen a lot of the other problems you mention - contaminants, folded corners, cracked cases.  Usually they take care of it including shipping, but you have to lose time reporting it, photographing it, packing it up, waiting for the return package, etc. 

It seems to be happening quite a bit.  They have to find out what is causing all the errors.  Going to fast?  Untrained personnel?  Flawed procedures?  Improper shipping materials?  Case supplier the culprit? 

I think they need better quality control.  Just awful when you get a comic worth about $800 as a 9.8 but it has a folded corner.  Now it's worth about $200, and an awkward sale at that.  You have no choice but to try to get it fixed.

[William-James88]

So I am assuming it was not missing anything on the back when first submitted right?

[jokiing]

18 hours ago, William-James88 said:

So I am assuming it was not missing anything on the back when first submitted right?

Correct.... Summited 18 copies and had (3) 9.8, (3) 9.4 and rest 9.6

[jokiing]

18 hours ago, Lightning55 said:

When we do a submission, we enter a DV (Declared Value).  That is supposed to be the amount we believe it is worth, the amount that it is insured for while at CGC, and is included in the tier pricing.  Seems like something happened to it there.  Maybe you talk to CS about a claim.

Would I be correct in saying that declared value is based on the raw book with guesstimate of grade? Price difference between a 9.6 and 9.8 can be quite substantial, especially with some copper/modern books. Definitely contacting CGC about this.

[MatterEaterLad]

18 hours ago, Lightning55 said:

Ouch.  It would be hard for them to say it came in that way and got a 9.8.  Even if you don't have "before" photos.

When we do a submission, we enter a DV (Declared Value).  That is supposed to be the amount we believe it is worth, the amount that it is insured for while at CGC, and is included in the tier pricing.  Seems like something happened to it there.  Maybe you talk to CS about a claim.

I have seen a lot of the other problems you mention - contaminants, folded corners, cracked cases.  Usually they take care of it including shipping, but you have to lose time reporting it, photographing it, packing it up, waiting for the return package, etc. 

It seems to be happening quite a bit.  They have to find out what is causing all the errors.  Going to fast?  Untrained personnel?  Flawed procedures?  Improper shipping materials?  Case supplier the culprit? 

I think they need better quality control.  Just awful when you get a comic worth about $800 as a 9.8 but it has a folded corner.  Now it's worth about $200, and an awkward sale at that.  You have no choice but to try to get it fixed.

Something is going on post-grading that we all should be concerned about. I just sent back two slabs for regrading where the inner plastic is speckled with....something. Looks greasy or grimy and no one in encapsulation noticed or cared. I have so many books in the hopper right now, including a high grade ASM 129, and it feels like I'm sending them to CGC for grading and PGX for encapsulation. It feels like with the massive volume and growth of CGC as a company, we're the one's paying the price for their growing pains. (Like with the bonus plastic in my FF1).

Edited March 7, 2021 by MatterEaterLad
typo

[jokiing]

I've had to send back some high end books because of contaminates in the inner well.... got three on this submission to send back along with the damaged Wolverine.

[The Lions Den]

19 hours ago, Lightning55 said:

It seems to be happening quite a bit.  They have to find out what is causing all the errors.  Going to fast?  Untrained personnel?  Flawed procedures?  Improper shipping materials?  Case supplier the culprit? 

I think they need better quality control.  Just awful when you get a comic worth about $800 as a 9.8 but it has a folded corner.  Now it's worth about $200, and an awkward sale at that.  You have no choice but to try to get it fixed.

[The Lions Den]

15 minutes ago, MatterEaterLad said:

Something is going on post-grading that we all should be concerned about. I just sent back two slabs for regrading where the inner plastic is speckled with....something. Looks greasy or grimy and no one in encapsulation noticed or cared. I have so many books in the hopper right now, including a high grade ASM 129, and it feels like I'm sending them to CGC for grading and PGX for encapsulation. It feels like with the massive volume and growth of CGC as a company, we're the one's paying the price for their growing pains. (Like with the bonus plastic in my FF1).

[Lightning55]

1 hour ago, jokiing said:

Would I be correct in saying that declared value is based on the raw book with guesstimate of grade? Price difference between a 9.6 and 9.8 can be quite substantial, especially with some copper/modern books. Definitely contacting CGC about this.

The insurance aspect is a tough one.  On the site, CGC says that your comics are insured for the DV while in their possession, and that if something happens to them, you would be reimbursed for the DV or the fair market value, whichever is lower.  It's best that you get the straight story from customer service, but it wouldn't hurt to read up on it in the FAQ section.  Just in case what you are told does not match up with what you read.  Or maybe another boardie has some experience with it firsthand.

[jokiing]

41 minutes ago, Lightning55 said:

The insurance aspect is a tough one.  On the site, CGC says that your comics are insured for the DV while in their possession, and that if something happens to them, you would be reimbursed for the DV or the fair market value, whichever is lower.  It's best that you get the straight story from customer service, but it wouldn't hurt to read up on it in the FAQ section.  Just in case what you are told does not match up with what you read.  Or maybe another boardie has some experience with it firsthand.

From what you're stating, CGC expects a DV the cover replacement cost based on their assessment two months after submission. So, if I submit books that I estimate to grade between  9.4 and 9.8 I would have to choose standard tier (if a 9.8 values over $200) and pay $65. for each submission instead of $20 Modern tier and hope for the best and if I miss something like a small tear behind a staple and end up with an even lower grade the cost of grading may out weigh the book's value. That doesn't seem fair at all if the damage was due to neglect.

Edited March 8, 2021 by jokiing
Spellin

[Bird]

can I please see some photos of the matter at the bottom of the well? I have heard about this a few times but not seen any photos

[jokiing]

5 minutes ago, Bird said:

can I please see some photos of the matter at the bottom of the well? I have heard about this a few times but not seen any photos

It's not at the bottom. but right in the middle over Wolverine's face. Hard to photograph, but I'll give it a try.

[Lightning55]

8 minutes ago, jokiing said:

From what you're stating, CGC expects a DV the cover replacement cost based on their assessment two months after submission. So, if I submit books that I estimate to grade between  9.4 and 9.8 I would have to choose standard tier (if a 9.8 values over $200) and pay $65. for each submission instead of $20 Modern tier and hope for the best and if I miss something like a small tear behind a staple and end up with an even lower grade the cost of grading may out weigh the book's value. That doesn't seem fair at all if the damage was due to neglect.

I'm sure it's not fair, and that's why people hate insurance companies.  Insurance is rarely what people expect - it's a last resort.  There are countless stories of auto losses, homeowner losses, personal injury losses, etc. with less than satisfactory outcomes.  But we are being premature. 

CGC is insured, but maybe they use the insurance for their larger claims, and just cover the smaller ones out of pocket.  Otherwise, if they are constantly putting in claims, their rates skyrocket.  So it will depend on your conversation with them.

Someone hit my car late last year and paid the auto body shop $1500 cash directly instead of going through their insurance, as it was cheaper than the penalties.

I had a book come back that was a 9.8 worth $800 but had a corner folded.  I put it in at $200 DV, because as you said, I didn't know if it was going to be a 9.4, 9.6, 9.8 or whatever.  We don't know - that's why we send them in to be graded.  So technically, CGC was only on the hook for $200, at most.  They could also decide it was only worth the raw replacement cost, whatever that would be, might be even less.  I don't know how that would have worked out in the end, because they offered to correct the problem for me.  And that was very nice of them, worked out ok, so all good after all.

I think you will have good luck with your call.  They are reasonable people, and something definitely happened.  I would be very surprised if they couldn't help you out.

[jokiing]

39 minutes ago, jokiing said:

It's not at the bottom. but right in the middle over Wolverine's face. Hard to photograph, but I'll give it a try.

Best viewed at an angle and on this copy it looks like soiling to cover with line above eye and debris in white and black areas.

 

Edited March 8, 2021 by jokiing

[jokiing]

2 minutes ago, Lightning55 said:

I'm sure it's not fair, and that's why people hate insurance companies.  Insurance is rarely what people expect - it's a last resort.  There are countless stories of auto losses, homeowner losses, personal injury losses, etc. with less than satisfactory outcomes.  But we are being premature. 

CGC is insured, but maybe they use the insurance for their larger claims, and just cover the smaller ones out of pocket.  Otherwise, if they are constantly putting in claims, their rates skyrocket.  So it will depend on your conversation with them.

Someone hit my car late last year and paid the auto body shop $1500 cash directly instead of going through their insurance, as it was cheaper than the penalties.

I had a book come back that was a 9.8 worth $800 but had a corner folded.  I put it in at $200 DV, because as you said, I didn't know if it was going to be a 9.4, 9.6, 9.8 or whatever.  We don't know - that's why we send them in to be graded.  So technically, CGC was only on the hook for $200, at most.  They could also decide it was only worth the raw replacement cost, whatever that would be, might be even less.  I don't know how that would have worked out in the end, because they offered to correct the problem for me.  And that was very nice of them, worked out ok, so all good after all.

I think you will have good luck with your call.  They are reasonable people, and something definitely happened.  I would be very surprised if they couldn't help you out.

Thanks.... Not giving up on them yet and I'm hoping that they will compensate fairly.  I had a similar situation with a bent corner that they were able to fix, although the fix was damaged again when it was encased. Luckily, no damage from either fix so it worked out. And yes, the whole insurance thing is tricky....

[jokiing]

Got an email from CGC regarding the "small chip" on the back cover.

Quote

After a grader reviewed the book, it was determined that it will still maintain its 9.8 grade.  The chip is from a bindery tear which is common on marvel books from that era.

[Lightning55]

Quoting myself earlier: "Ouch.  It would be hard for them to say it came in that way and got a 9.8.  Even if you don't have "before" photos."

I guess it WASN'T hard for them to say it came in that way and got a 9.8.  I stand corrected.  I don't agree with their assessment, but no one cares about my opinion.

I just received 2 book of the same title and issue number in a graded lot from CGC.  One book had a huge corner missing from the front cover bottom right, almost a 1/4" triangle.  It's a very glaring defect, can't miss it.  They must have called it a bindery tear, as it was graded 9.6.

The other copy had a "healed" 3/16" tear a bit above the same corner on the front cover.  It's very hard to see, almost imperceptible.  The rest of the comic is superb.  That's an 8.0, worth half of what the 9.6 is valued. 

If both were raw, and I had to choose one to keep, it would be the one without the corner missing.

Edited April 14, 2021 by Lightning55

[jokiing]

I'm having a hard time agreeing with their assessment as well. I've seen small corner tears pass at a 9.8 but I have over 50 copies of this comic book and have yet to see this "bindery tear" on any of them. Hard to argue with a second grader's assessment. If that torn corner was originally there, I would not have chosen that copy to send in for grading, thinking there was no way to get a 9.8 or maybe not even a 9.6.... I guess CGC has proven me wrong...?