Are there any grading/slab services more low rent than PGX! 1 1

[Randall Ries]

2 hours ago, Funnybooks said:

I jest, however, my biggest concern is not the wrap but missed restoration and/or interior undisclosed/missed defects. How many of us are willing to take a gamble on a PGX book of a dollar value that "matters"? 

Well, how many documented cases of missed restoration are there? Is CGC clean as far as missed restoration? I doubt it. I have to imagine there are other companies who do a MUCH more thorough job of detecting restoration with far more sophistication than a lousy black light.

AFAIC, graders notes should be present with every single grade as part of the package. If I have a book that is an obvious 9.0 and it comes back a 7.5, I want to know why and I shouldn't have to beg or buy to get my own results from the grading process I paid for. It's like getting an x-ray and the doc tells me I'm dying but won't tell me from what. Seriously. Is CGC the only company that WON'T provide grader notes for your submission? I'm starting to think that's probably true.

I have a feeling most grading companies aren't that far apart. Because this is a CGC forum, the boardies will become apologists. I've seen misgrades with all the companies. I don't think it's anything malevolent. It's imperfect people with differing opinions of what grade is what. There are low 9.0's and high 9.0's. Buy the damned book if it looks right to you. Or don't.

[InfantTerrible]

12 minutes ago, Randall Ries said:

Well, how many documented cases of missed restoration are there? Is CGC clean as far as missed restoration? I doubt it. I have to imagine there are other companies who do a MUCH more thorough job of detecting restoration with far more sophistication than a lousy black light.

AFAIC, graders notes should be present with every single grade as part of the package. If I have a book that is an obvious 9.0 and it comes back a 7.5, I want to know why and I shouldn't have to beg or buy to get my own results from the grading process I paid for. It's like getting an x-ray and the doc tells me I'm dying but won't tell me from what. Seriously. Is CGC the only company that WON'T provide grader notes for your submission? I'm starting to think that's probably true.

I have a feeling most grading companies aren't that far apart. Because this is a CGC forum, the boardies will become apologists. I've seen misgrades with all the companies. I don't think it's anything malevolent. It's imperfect people with differing opinions of what grade is what. There are low 9.0's and high 9.0's. Buy the damned book if it looks right to you. Or don't.

It's not like we're apologists, it's more like we have no other choice.

I wish there were more competitions on par to CGC to keep them in check, I wish there were standardized grading guidelines, problem is that we don't have those......so like it or not we're stuck with CGC.....Admit it, most, if not all of us, see this comic collecting as fun hobby AND some sort of investment (or at least as asset that maintain its value). If it's some form of investment, then it better be liquid, easy to sell. And CGC-graded books are the most liquid of them all 

Edited April 9, 2021 by IronMan_Cave

[theCapraAegagrus]

[Tec-Tac-Toe]

16 hours ago, AJD said:

https://halocertificationptyltd.com/index.html

Is the company name "Hell No, Certification?"

[valiantman]

19 hours ago, IronMan_Cave said:

It's not like we're apologists, it's more like we have no other choice.

I wish there were more competitions on par to CGC to keep them in check, I wish there were standardized grading guidelines, problem is that we don't have those......so like it or not we're stuck with CGC.....Admit it, most, if not all of us, see this comic collecting as fun hobby AND some sort of investment (or at least as asset that maintain its value). If it's some form of investment, then it better be liquid, easy to sell. And CGC-graded books are the most liquid of them all 

It's not limited to comic books.  Sportscard grading (slabbing) is older than comic book grading, the leading grading company (PSA) has had several scandals through the years, and they still completely dominating the market.  Beckett (BGS) - the "Overstreet" of sportscards before slabbing was a thing can't really make a big dent in the PSA domination.  BGS is a solid company for sportscard grading, but compare grade-to-grade prices and PSA wins by a long shot.

CGC is the PSA of comics... because PSA was dominating before slabbing comics was even a thing.

Slabbing coins was a thing back in the 1970s, and there are a few companies surviving in coins. 

Maybe the comic book industry will have a more balanced grading field when it has been around for 45+ years, too.  We're almost halfway there.

Edited April 9, 2021 by valiantman

[1950's war comics]

isn't there a comic book grading company called "The Vault" 

[MB1952]

Every single PGX books I have send to CGC has return same grade or .5 below original grade.

I try using CBCS early but their grading sucks over graded comics or assigned restoration when there’s no restoration. 👎🏻 My crossover grading  CBCS 9.4 returns CGC 8.5 

[Randall Ries]

On 4/8/2021 at 9:07 PM, IronMan_Cave said:

It's not like we're apologists, it's more like we have no other choice.

I wish there were more competitions on par to CGC to keep them in check, I wish there were standardized grading guidelines, problem is that we don't have those......so like it or not we're stuck with CGC.....Admit it, most, if not all of us, see this comic collecting as fun hobby AND some sort of investment (or at least as asset that maintain its value). If it's some form of investment, then it better be liquid, easy to sell. And CGC-graded books are the most liquid of them all 

Then why do I suspect if other grading companies begin grading books the attitude toward them will be just like the attitude shown toward all the others? Halo looks reasonable but I bet people will come up with some reason why they suck. Why is it when CGC graders are grading for CGC, they rock and when they move to another company they suck?

It's weird. I was just on ebay looking at Bat 251's. There was a graded PGX 9.4. Thought "Yeah. That's not a 9.4." A few stalls down, there was a CGC 9.4. Thought "Yeah. That's not a 9.4. either". And they weren't. Neither of them were even close. There's just too much ambiguity in grading because of the human factor.

I think we DO have a choice. The choice I give myself is buying the book itself. If I look at a supposed 9.4 and it's looking like an 8.5, I'm not buying it. Not at a 9.4 price. I wonder if sellers have that problem? KNOWING full well the grade is just wrong and have to price it according to the grade and the book sits there because people can clearly see it isn't  the assigned grade. Or if the reverse happens. Have a 7.5 that looks like a 9.2 and it flies outta there because it looks a whole lot nice than the assigned grade but has to be sold at the price of a 7.5.

Seems like CGC spends a lot of money self promoting. Maybe that's why they are "#1" in the "Industry".

[graffix13]

On 4/9/2021 at 3:48 PM, MB1952 said:

Every single PGX books I have send to CGC has return same grade or .5 below original grade.

I try using CBCS early but their grading sucks over graded comics or assigned restoration when there’s no restoration. 👎🏻 My crossover grading  CBCS 9.4 returns CGC 8.5 

Kind of off topic, but if you send your PGX/CBCS to CGC for reholder, you don't need to crack them, correct? CGC will crack and reholder with the same PGX/CBCS grade? Or do you submit them for regrade still in the PGX/CBCS slab? 

[ADAMANTIUM]

7 minutes ago, graffix13 said:

Kind of off topic, but if you send your PGX/CBCS to CGC for reholder, you don't need to crack them, correct? CGC will crack and reholder with the same PGX/CBCS grade? Or do you submit them for regrade still in the PGX/CBCS slab? 

CGC regrades them

used to be something like 50% off the grading tier if it came back lower grade or something I think, but no longer

Edited April 22, 2021 by ADAMANTIUM

[graffix13]

3 minutes ago, ADAMANTIUM said:

CGC regrades them

used to be something like 50% off the grading tier if it came back lower grade or something I think, but no longer

Thanks.

So if I submit, do I submit it like a raw book or for a Reholder? 

[ADAMANTIUM]

1 minute ago, graffix13 said:

6 minutes ago, ADAMANTIUM said:

CGC regrades them

used to be something like 50% off the grading tier if it came back lower grade or something I think, but no longer

Thanks.

So if I submit, do I submit it like a raw book or for a Reholder? 

it's not a reholder, I believe it is called "crossover"

[the blob]

I knew the guy who started one in New Jersey around 2000 or so. I forget the name of it. They didn't last long. That really was out of his basement or garage or something. Anyone remember?

 

[toro]

I have done very well over the years when I send old PGX books into CGC.   The first time they all came back higher.  One from 8.5 to a 9.6, one from a 9.0 to a 9.6.  The last batch I sent in out of 10 I think 4 dropped 1/2 to 1 grade.  2 went up and 4 stayed the same.  I was real happy when the FF48 stayed the same.  I thought it would drop a full grade. 

Of course, I do cherry pick my PGX books, I only select the ones I think are good candidates to improve.

[MetalPSI]

I've heard too much shade coming from PGX to ever use them 

[BabaLament]

I took a shot on an ASM #127 that was on a PGX slab for my PC. Guy was asking a little over CGC slab price for that grade, and I was able to "dude, its PGX" my way down to half price. Submitted it to CGC under the Crossover promotion & it came back .5 higher in grade. So there are wins out there, but I wouldn't gamble like that every day and expect to walk away positive. Basically, I treat PGX slabs like I treat a trip to Las Vegas; it can be fun, but always remember those pleasure palaces weren't built because of winners.

I have considered purchasing a book that is on a HALO slab, just as a conversation piece. Any Aussies on the boards who can knowingly discuss the quality of the grade/slab from them?

Edited April 22, 2021 by BabaLament

[Qalyar]

PGX is nowhere near the bottom shelf, anymore at least, although I don't believe I'd ever forgive them for some of their prior decisions. Also, seriously, (almost the) ugliest labels you can find on a slab. As for their competition, although several of the real shady graders are now out of business:

• CBGC was shut down by CGC's lawyers, although I'm not sure precisely why (guessing trademark confusion, but who knows?). I'm not sure they ever graded more than a handful of books.
• 6DGrading / 60 Day Grading was a basically Canada-only grading service that stuck a sticker over the flap of a bagged and boarded comic then slipped it in a Mylar. As with many of these companies, the owner used his own service. Quietly went out of business somewhere around 2016-17.
• Vault did put books in slabs, to their credit. On the other hand, a lot of those books belonged to the company's owner. Also bit the dust in the 2016-17 period.
• Midwest Comic Grading is still around with their ... unusual grading scale that includes hundredths-of-points of grade. See an 8.55 on ebay now!
• Expert Grading Service is also still around, and still using Comic Skin kit-cases (although they no longer seem to advertise the value of having easily-opened cases, so I think they may be getting a better quality product from Comic Skin these days). They now have a rainbow variety of label color choices, and allow for custom art labels, thus allowing them to beat out PGX for ugliest labels possible on a currently-available slab.

I have no real opinion on the two very much non-North American graders (Halo in Australia and EGS -- but not the EGS above! -- in Europe). Both of them have been in business for quite awhile now, so they probably serve a niche market for regional collectors.

Wasn't there a service that advertised that they would only grade individual comic book pages? I have to assume they've gone away, right? Right??

 

[I’m Rick Jones bitch]

On 4/8/2021 at 8:38 PM, AJD said:

https://halocertificationptyltd.com/index.html

Lol, Was just about to post this 

https://www.ebay.ca/itm/124518694139

[adampasz]

 

[Qalyar]

6 minutes ago, LoST Ups said:

Also ACE run by Royal Maxey 

 

Ah, yes. ACE bit the corporate bucket long enough ago that I'd sort of forgotten it was ever a going concern. ACE did actually slab books, though. But like a lot of these little grading companies, it was largely dedicated to the dealer-owner's own books.

Others I know I skipped:

• The Pacific Comic Exchange, which wasn't a traditional grading service. It sort of a weird escrow sales site with its own internal grading service applied to the books. I don't think PCE slabbed books or even put stickers on bags. One party sent a book to PCE to be held for sale, PCE assigned it a grade and listed it for sale at that grade, and then -- presumably -- someone eventually bought it. I forget how the offering prices were worked out. I never really understood why anyone would do this. I don't think it lasted very long, so maybe no one else did, either!
• Rob Gustaveson's "Paper Mountain Comics". As with so many of these, a dealer offering his own grading service. I don't know that he offered any sort of encapsulation. I think you just sent him a book and five books and he sent it back with a number, although I could be wrong there. Again, I don't think he did much grading business.
• Pop Culture Certified did do a sort of encapsulation. They graded books, and shipped them back in a Mylite, sealed with a PCC grade sticker. As I recall, you could pay more for a COA that they'd slip in behind the backer board (and that was supposed to be linked to an online index, like a clunky version of the CGC census). I don't know if the online index ever existed, or indeed, if there were ever more than a handful of books handled there. I've never seen one.

None of them, including ACE, made it to 2010, so I doubt that there are extant slabs (well, "slabs") from any of them. Maybe a few ACE books?