Marvel Mystery 4 crazy price Brittle 2 2

[Primetime]

5 minutes ago, woowoo said:

MM 9 is a Better cover to me #4 is just a Sub Cover #9 has both. Do not care what anyone says that book never should have sold for 21k or even half  I think people that don't understand comics buying comics is a no no ? Like me trying to buy poke man cards with 100k to invest.  I wind up with when i try and sell

Excluding #1 from discussion- #9,5,4 in that order for me but they are all necessary as a Timely enthusiast. 

[podboy66]

If these prices hold up, i wonder what these would go for now?!

[sagii]

2 hours ago, pemart1966 said:

PQ should never be ignored.  Brittle/tan/brown are a complete non starter for me.

The seller did incredibly well for a book in that condition.  

Personally I'm ok with Tan to Off White , but to each their own 

[pemart1966]

1 hour ago, podboy66 said:

If these prices hold up, i wonder what these would go for now?!

What's the PQ on each?

[podboy66]

16 minutes ago, pemart1966 said:

What's the PQ on each?

4 - white, 5 ow to w, 9 cr to ow

[pemart1966]

23 minutes ago, podboy66 said:

4 - white, 5 ow to w, 9 cr to ow

Your personal copies I presume?

[podboy66]

18 minutes ago, pemart1966 said:

Your personal copies I presume?

yes, my keepers!  don't think that i can afford to upgrade anymore

Edited April 19, 2021 by podboy66

[gino2paulus2]

3 hours ago, podboy66 said:

If these prices hold up, i wonder what these would go for now?!

In this market a couple million ALL DAY!!!! Kidding aside that is a beautiful set of books brother that I am sure you would do very well on. My personal preference or favorite of those 3 is #9 to me that an all-timer not just all-time Timely!!!! 

With X-Men #1 going up about 3K a week these days who knows. The spec game is seriously out of control to the point where SA books may soon pass GA classics and I can’t figure out the rhyme or reason when they are so much more plentiful but either the demand is that great or the flippers are just flipping back and forth to eachother creating new records each week which has been my prediction all along but At some point (right now actually) the average Joe can’t afford many of the these books. 

[pemart1966]

2 hours ago, podboy66 said:

yes, my keepers!  don't think that i can afford to upgrade anymore

Nice copies!

[woowoo]

19 hours ago, podboy66 said:

If these prices hold up, i wonder what these would go for now?!

Love that 4 and 9 both 100% great and even tho i dont coll Timely tho's 2 books would be keepers

[Dark Knight]

Yep those 3 plus Marvel 1 would be my top choices to have in my collection. Bravo! Those are beauties!

[Vince G]

20 hours ago, gino2paulus2 said:

In this market a couple million ALL DAY!!!! Kidding aside that is a beautiful set of books brother that I am sure you would do very well on. My personal preference or favorite of those 3 is #9 to me that an all-timer not just all-time Timely!!!! 

With X-Men #1 going up about 3K a week these days who knows. The spec game is seriously out of control to the point where SA books may soon pass GA classics and I can’t figure out the rhyme or reason when they are so much more plentiful but either the demand is that great or the flippers are just flipping back and forth to eachother creating new records each week which has been my prediction all along but At some point (right now actually) the average Joe can’t afford many of the these books. 

I posted this comment on a different thread but think it's relevant here:

------

My question has always been, where's the money coming from?  This has been driving me crazy for the past month or two but I think I partially answered my own question after doing some research.  I think part of what we're seeing is the 401k penalty-free withdrawal provision of the 2020 Cares Act.  I did not know this, but there is no penalty for withdrawing up to 100k, and you can spread the income taxes on the withdraw over three years.  Additionally, if you can pay the full amount you withdrew back, you can claim a refund on those taxes.  So, it could very well be that some are pulling money and splurging, particularly on collectibles, but others may be buying with the hope of reselling at a profit, before replacing their initial withdrawal.  Then again, maybe it's just all those investors who cashed out on Bitcoin and GameStop then decided to throw some money into comics?  

If you're interested in a short high-level blurb about the 401k provisions in the Cares Act, here's a link:  https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/investing/cashing-out-401k-covid-19 

-----

In addition, I've talked to a couple financial peeps I know and they tell me that some of their fellow brokers/portfolio managers are telling investors to put about 10% of their portfolios into collectibles as a hedge against the market.  Makes sense with the market at an all time high and 1% yields on bonds, that investors are looking for other places to make money (including digital currency).   Essentially, comics are now lumped into that alternative asset class of investments, which means speculation becomes part of the game.  Definitely a bummer in my mind, especially for me as one who collects for the love of the books, and as one who had hoped to procure a nice gold key or two that have been on my want list forever.

[tpetty]

This is one of my all time favorite covers - and I'm not even a Sub Mariner fan. 

I always put in token bids for this issue, but WAY out of my price range though....

[Rezin1234]

1 hour ago, Vince G said:

I posted this comment on a different thread but think it's relevant here:

------

My question has always been, where's the money coming from?  This has been driving me crazy for the past month or two but I think I partially answered my own question after doing some research.  I think part of what we're seeing is the 401k penalty-free withdrawal provision of the 2020 Cares Act.  I did not know this, but there is no penalty for withdrawing up to 100k, and you can spread the income taxes on the withdraw over three years.  Additionally, if you can pay the full amount you withdrew back, you can claim a refund on those taxes.  So, it could very well be that some are pulling money and splurging, particularly on collectibles, but others may be buying with the hope of reselling at a profit, before replacing their initial withdrawal.  Then again, maybe it's just all those investors who cashed out on Bitcoin and GameStop then decided to throw some money into comics?  

If you're interested in a short high-level blurb about the 401k provisions in the Cares Act, here's a link:  https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/investing/cashing-out-401k-covid-19 

-----

In addition, I've talked to a couple financial peeps I know and they tell me that some of their fellow brokers/portfolio managers are telling investors to put about 10% of their portfolios into collectibles as a hedge against the market.  Makes sense with the market at an all time high and 1% yields on bonds, that investors are looking for other places to make money (including digital currency).   Essentially, comics are now lumped into that alternative asset class of investments, which means speculation becomes part of the game.  Definitely a bummer in my mind, especially for me as one who collects for the love of the books, and as one who had hoped to procure a nice gold key or two that have been on my want list forever.

It’s a multitude of factors. Lots of money sloshing around. Stock market is at an all time high and people are looking for different outlets. It’s why almost every alternative investment is hot right now. 
 

comics have the added issue that you take the top 20 comics from silver age and it’s just not many total copies. Take the top 20 baseball cards from the 1950s-1960s and the total quantity is astronomically more. Therefore comics can have a much faster jump than cards which are also sky high but on a more gradual basis. 
 

add to that the fact that almost everyone selling a book is reinvesting it in other books and as a result money isn’t exiting the hobby even on sales. 
 

The one big question mark is whether or not comics outside of the epic grails like ac1 are being viewed as investment assets by money managers. If that is the case you could see money really flocking towards the second tier golden age but more notably the first tier silver age like ff1 asm1 etc. 

also some speculate people whose jobs weren’t effected typically are well off people and due to inability to go out have more disposable income for online shopping. If this is the case then a drop could come once the world opens up again. 
 

many unknowns. I think the biggest risk is that anyone who recently put money in comics are seeing 100% success rates and think it’s a sure thing a la housing back in the mid 2000s. If a drop starts to occur it could turn into a full on significant unwinding of all the profits of the last 6 months. 
 

tons of unknowns. Question really is what timetable are people putting money into comics? What’s their risk tolerance? If we knew this we could really say where this is headed. 

[Vince G]

1 hour ago, Rezin1234 said:

It’s a multitude of factors. Lots of money sloshing around. Stock market is at an all time high and people are looking for different outlets. It’s why almost every alternative investment is hot right now. 
 

comics have the added issue that you take the top 20 comics from silver age and it’s just not many total copies. Take the top 20 baseball cards from the 1950s-1960s and the total quantity is astronomically more. Therefore comics can have a much faster jump than cards which are also sky high but on a more gradual basis. 
 

add to that the fact that almost everyone selling a book is reinvesting it in other books and as a result money isn’t exiting the hobby even on sales. 
 

The one big question mark is whether or not comics outside of the epic grails like ac1 are being viewed as investment assets by money managers. If that is the case you could see money really flocking towards the second tier golden age but more notably the first tier silver age like ff1 asm1 etc. 

also some speculate people whose jobs weren’t effected typically are well off people and due to inability to go out have more disposable income for online shopping. If this is the case then a drop could come once the world opens up again. 
 

many unknowns. I think the biggest risk is that anyone who recently put money in comics are seeing 100% success rates and think it’s a sure thing a la housing back in the mid 2000s. If a drop starts to occur it could turn into a full on significant unwinding of all the profits of the last 6 months. 
 

tons of unknowns. Question really is what timetable are people putting money into comics? What’s their risk tolerance? If we knew this we could really say where this is headed. 

Excellent synopsis.  I agree 100%.  Lots of factors but I think many have seriously underestimated the weighting of the investor class as part of the price escalation.  We probably won't know much of anything until 2022 at the earliest.  Until then, it's all theories

[pemart1966]

5 hours ago, Vince G said:

I posted this comment on a different thread but think it's relevant here:

------

My question has always been, where's the money coming from?  This has been driving me crazy for the past month or two but I think I partially answered my own question after doing some research.  I think part of what we're seeing is the 401k penalty-free withdrawal provision of the 2020 Cares Act.  I did not know this, but there is no penalty for withdrawing up to 100k, and you can spread the income taxes on the withdraw over three years.  Additionally, if you can pay the full amount you withdrew back, you can claim a refund on those taxes.  So, it could very well be that some are pulling money and splurging, particularly on collectibles, but others may be buying with the hope of reselling at a profit, before replacing their initial withdrawal.  Then again, maybe it's just all those investors who cashed out on Bitcoin and GameStop then decided to throw some money into comics?  

If you're interested in a short high-level blurb about the 401k provisions in the Cares Act, here's a link:  https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/investing/cashing-out-401k-covid-19 

-----

In addition, I've talked to a couple financial peeps I know and they tell me that some of their fellow brokers/portfolio managers are telling investors to put about 10% of their portfolios into collectibles as a hedge against the market.  Makes sense with the market at an all time high and 1% yields on bonds, that investors are looking for other places to make money (including digital currency).   Essentially, comics are now lumped into that alternative asset class of investments, which means speculation becomes part of the game.  Definitely a bummer in my mind, especially for me as one who collects for the love of the books, and as one who had hoped to procure a nice gold key or two that have been on my want list forever.

I hope for the sake of the investors that these "brokers/portfolio managers" are providing a thorough analysis of what they consider to be blue chip "collectibles" and why, rather than just providing blanket advice based on a page 3 read of the WSJ saying that Action #1 has just set a new record price. 

Edited April 21, 2021 by pemart1966

[jimbo_7071]

On 4/19/2021 at 10:54 AM, sagii said:

I think the biggest take away is when it comes to important and or rare /scarce/ seldom offered gold , PQ is becoming less of a deal breaker to a lot of collectors. 

I don't get it. I don't even buy books with cream-to-off-white pages. I've bought raw books that turned out to have C/OW pages, and I don't throw them away or anything like that, but I've never purchased a slabbed book with a cream-to-off-white designation.

[jimbo_7071]

5 hours ago, Rezin1234 said:

It’s a multitude of factors. Lots of money sloshing around. Stock market is at an all time high and people are looking for different outlets. It’s why almost every alternative investment is hot right now. 
 

comics have the added issue that you take the top 20 comics from silver age and it’s just not many total copies. Take the top 20 baseball cards from the 1950s-1960s and the total quantity is astronomically more. Therefore comics can have a much faster jump than cards which are also sky high but on a more gradual basis. 
 

add to that the fact that almost everyone selling a book is reinvesting it in other books and as a result money isn’t exiting the hobby even on sales. 
 

The one big question mark is whether or not comics outside of the epic grails like ac1 are being viewed as investment assets by money managers. If that is the case you could see money really flocking towards the second tier golden age but more notably the first tier silver age like ff1 asm1 etc. 

also some speculate people whose jobs weren’t effected typically are well off people and due to inability to go out have more disposable income for online shopping. If this is the case then a drop could come once the world opens up again. 
 

many unknowns. I think the biggest risk is that anyone who recently put money in comics are seeing 100% success rates and think it’s a sure thing a la housing back in the mid 2000s. If a drop starts to occur it could turn into a full on significant unwinding of all the profits of the last 6 months. 
 

tons of unknowns. Question really is what timetable are people putting money into comics? What’s their risk tolerance? If we knew this we could really say where this is headed. 

I've never heard of any money managers treating comic books as a serious investment. Some collectors do, but professional money managers are way more risk-averse than that. Comic books are still very volatile. I've seen high-grade pedigree books lose two-thirds of their value over just a few years—I've seen it many, many times. Take the Mile High Green Lanterns, for example.

I know that Bill Hughes and a few other guys have tried to push comic books as serious investments, but most people recognize the volatility. Mega keys were pretty safe for a long time (and probably still are), but most books are very, very risky as long-term investments.

[sagii]

21 minutes ago, jimbo_7071 said:

I don't get it. I don't even buy books with cream-to-off-white pages. I've bought raw books that turned out to have C/OW pages, and I don't throw them away or anything like that, but I've never purchased a slabbed book with a cream-to-off-white designation.

I love my cream to off whites 

[Rezin1234]

42 minutes ago, jimbo_7071 said:

I've never heard of any money managers treating comic books as a serious investment. Some collectors do, but professional money managers are way more risk-averse than that. Comic books are still very volatile. I've seen high-grade pedigree books lose two-thirds of their value over just a few years—I've seen it many, many times. Take the Mile High Green Lanterns, for example.

I know that Bill Hughes and a few other guys have tried to push comic books as serious investments, but most people recognize the volatility. Mega keys were pretty safe for a long time (and probably still are), but most books are very, very risky as long-term investments.

Action comics 1 and books of that caliber are held as an investment class by many. Similar to the rare honus Wagner. These specific assets are held in similar regards as far as investing as buying a painting etc. 

there are some unique alternative investment portfolios out there that allow you to pay into assets like this. The question really is whether it’s remained limited to just the action comics 1 or expanded to say amazing fantasy 15, fantastic four 1 etc. 

baseball cards have expanded over the decades, for example portfolio managers do not have an issue with money being put into the purchase of say a Mickey mantle rookie card. 
 

As I stated money is looking for new places to grow. There is concern the stock market is too frothy and not a great place to invest in at the moment. Collectibles have gained steam. 
 

The fact of the matter is a money manager could buy every amazing fantasy 15 on the market tomorrow and it would be a rounding error as far as portfolio exposure. The quantity is just so limited.