Jaydogrules Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 (edited) 8 minutes ago, divad said: What's really interesting is why anyone would pay $5,000 for modern krap. It's deja vu all over again I tells ya! Brought to you by "the haters club", est. circa 2003. -J. Edited July 23, 2017 by Jaydogrules Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazyboy Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 4 minutes ago, Jaydogrules said: Wrong again. I point out when books actually ARE being shilled and it's obvious. Zero/low feedback bidders/ 100% bidding activity with the same sellers, and then the same book reappearing a very short time later for sale again. It's like I said a few posts back, this book sells so infrequently, if somebody were to attempt to do that here, even if they were attempting to subsequently sell the book privately, setting a price using and referencing the two eBay 9.8 sales (though I notice you continue to ignore the various other sales that happened across other grade and label colours in the two years prior as this book began to spike again), it wouldn't be very hard for a buyer with even a modicum of savvy (and one would hope that would be the case if he is looking at a $5k-$6k book to purchase) can simply look at the eBay sales, or GPA and say "hey, didn't that exact same book supposedly just sell for $XXXX? What are you trying to pull here?" But since none of these books have actually reappeared anywhere publicly since then, the only thing that we do know with any certainty is that- that they have not been offered for sale publicly since they were purchased. Publicly available books can be found at stores, conventions, and even on websites that don't report to GPA. 4 minutes ago, Jaydogrules said: Anything else beyond that is gross supposition that only someone chewing on sour grapes would repeatedly suggest. Which I actually find ironic, given how hostile you use to get everytime someone sought to even casually suppose a book's print number via comichron. -J. I only questioned why somebody would so desperately go after multiple copies. I never made any claims about any kind of manipulation. I certainly didn't do anything even remotely similar to inventing specific numbers for books based on other numbers that are unrelated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Lazyboy said: Publicly available books can be found at stores, conventions, and even on websites that don't report to GPA. I only questioned why somebody would so desperately go after multiple copies. I never made any claims about any kind of manipulation. I certainly didn't do anything even remotely similar to inventing specific numbers for books based on other numbers that are unrelated. Like minds are of course always free to disagree. I always can appreciate a good back and forth as long as it doesn't get overtly personal, insulting, or vulgar. But I think at the end of the day, the biggest difference between me, and many who contribute to these boards, is that I am acutely aware that absolutely nothing that is said on here, either good or bad, will remotely affect what happens to books in the greater marketplace at large. Nothing. So I type with a half smirk on my face, tongue often in cheek, and try to enjoy the occasional back and forth with the usual suspects. -J. Edited July 23, 2017 by Jaydogrules Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bababooey Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 @Jaydogrules Were you aware that one buyer bought three of these in March/April and that he bought two of those books from the same seller when you announced that the Bats 608 variant had achieved number one status in your "dirty dozen" thread when you wrote this in June? Quote #1- Batman #608 RRP (2002)- We have a new sheriff in town. The granddaddy of the RRP's (and arguably all modern variants) vaults to #1. And why not? The combination of it being Batman, a first appearance of a new character, Part One of a story line that put the Batman title back on top, deep within the run of a popular, long running title, 15 years old, ridiculously rare, and by the highly regarded Jim Lee, might make this the "perfect variant". With multiple public sales of 9.8's breaking $5k, and even a couple eclipsing $5500, 9.6's reaching $2300 and raw copies hitting $2100, and copies seeming to have all but disappeared into personal collections, don't expect to get this one on the cheap ever again (if you can even find one). Like a few other long time entries on this list, this book will probably end up being synonymous with our current Age of comics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 1 minute ago, bababooey said: @Jaydogrules Were you aware that one buyer bought three of these in March/April and that he bought two of those books from the same seller when you announced that the Bats 608 variant had achieved number one status in your "dirty dozen" thread when you wrote this in June? Of course I was aware of those two sales, as well as the other 6 or 7 others both before and after that which got it to #1. And even if one single buyer made a run on every single copy that became available because he heard from a friend of a friend of a friend that Hush was going to be the storyline of the next Batman movie, it still would have made #1. -J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awax Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
divad Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 Really? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazyboy Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, Jaydogrules said: Like minds are of course always free to disagree. I always can appreciate a good back and forth as long as it doesn't get overtly personal, insulting, or vulgar. But I think at the end of the day, the biggest difference between me, and many who contribute to these boards, is that I am acutely aware that absolutely nothing that is said on here, either good or bad, will remotely affect what happens to books in the greater marketplace at large. Nothing. So I type with a half smirk on my face, tongue often in cheek, and try to enjoy the occasional back and forth with the usual suspects. -J. That's simply untrue. You can debate the degree of influence these boards have on the market, but anything (true/false, objective/biased who cares?) that brings attention to an issue can influence prices. For example, Batman 227 was nothing special before it started being posted incessantly on these boards, including winning "Top Bronze Cover" polls. Coincidence? Yeah, right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevhtx Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 Ill add my experience with 608 RRP. I bought a 9.6 slabbed from a boardie. I had always wanted one simply because Im a huge Batman fan and Ive always loved the cover. I think i paid $2k or $2200? I can't remember exact number. It was about a year ago or so. As others have seen earlier in the thread, I got it pressed, signed by Lee at FXD in April and its a 9.8 CGC SS now. Since then, Ive had multiple boardies private message me and ask if I want to sell it and if I ever do to let them know. This book is in demand. Plain and simple. Was there manipulation on price on eBay with some auctions? Maybe so. Did it affect the overall market price? We will probably never know, but the book is rare, valuable and people want it. The facts about the book are clear though. Its extremely rare, debatably the most popular comic character of all, one of the most top cover artists of all time and a great story of that character's arc. So, it shouldn't be a surprise that the book is in demand and high up or at the top of the list of valuable modern variants. Im not sure why there is so much argument about it really. ADAMANTIUM and Lethal_Collector 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallace Flowers Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 Colleagues, good day to you. I can provide the appropriate clarity regarding this matter, specifically as it relates to the three purchases of Batman 608 RRP cgc 9.8 (one being a SS signed by Jim Lee) made on my part earlier this year. First, please be advised there are no questionable motive(s) on my part, as I consciously made the decision to pursue the acquisition of these books during the time they were auctioned. I truly have an affinity for this particular edition, given its limited quantity/availability, especially at the 9.8 grade, in conjunction with the fact that I had the funds available to me at the time and I took advantage of it. I truly regretted selling the books I previously owned and made the decision to acquire at least a couple of them if the timing were right. I'm not at all concerned about the price paid on my part because I wanted the books. I feel especially fortunate to have been able to purchase the 9.8 Lee SS. There was no communication between me and the sellers, other than the feedback I provided subsequent to my taking receipt of the books. My intent is to keep at least two of the books and possibly sell the third copy at some point in the future, but no time soon. Ultimately, Jaydogrules is correct in his observation of this particular activity. Regards... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bababooey Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 32 minutes ago, Wallace Flowers said: Colleagues, good day to you. I can provide the appropriate clarity regarding this matter, specifically as it relates to the three purchases of Batman 608 RRP cgc 9.8 (one being a SS signed by Jim Lee) made on my part earlier this year. First, please be advised there are no questionable motive(s) on my part, as I consciously made the decision to pursue the acquisition of these books during the time they were auctioned. I truly have an affinity for this particular edition, given its limited quantity/availability, especially at the 9.8 grade, in conjunction with the fact that I had the funds available to me at the time and I took advantage of it. I truly regretted selling the books I previously owned and made the decision to acquire at least a couple of them if the timing were right. I'm not at all concerned about the price paid on my part because I wanted the books. I feel especially fortunate to have been able to purchase the 9.8 Lee SS. There was no communication between me and the sellers, other than the feedback I provided subsequent to my taking receipt of the books. My intent is to keep at least two of the books and possibly sell the third copy at some point in the future, but no time soon. Ultimately, Jaydogrules is correct in his observation of this particular activity. Regards... WTTB Wally/e-bay buyer referree00157 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SquareChaos Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 We'll get to the bottom of this yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bababooey Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 (edited) 9 hours ago, SquareChaos said: We'll get to the bottom of this yet. I was hoping @Wallace Flowers might be more than a one and done'r, I'm sure many of his colleagues here would love to see a group shot or might even learn something if he shares any insight into his e-bay bidding strategy. Edited July 24, 2017 by bababooey Lethal_Collector 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broke as a Joke Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 Curious to how Wallace was informed of this thread... Oh yeah, let's get a group shot so we can admire those 608's side by side. Lethal_Collector 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lethal_Collector Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 Jerome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallace Flowers Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 Colleagues, good day to you. The only bidding strategy formulated on my part was to simply make it obvious that I intended to win the specific Batman 608 rrp 9.8 auctions in question by denoting a notable number of bids in advance accordingly. While I generally do not take this approach, I was willing to pay more than what I thought the general market would deem 'reasonable' because I wanted them at least two of them at that time. I was actually very surprised to see the three 608 rrp's auctioned during that particular timeframe, especially the signature series copy at that grade. Relative to how I became aware of this thread, I essentially stumbled upon it while perusing the CGG site and associated forums...I was hoping to chance upon anything being noted about the popularity - or possibly lack thereof - of the Batman 608 rrp. Needless to say, I was very surprised to read through the back-and-forth discussion and speculation occurring between several of you regarding my purchases. I honestly just happened to be in a fortunate position to acquire the three books at that time. Regards... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ebtorres Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
divad Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 On 7/23/2017 at 0:13 PM, kevhtx said: Ill add my experience with 608 RRP. I bought a 9.6 slabbed from a boardie. I had always wanted one simply because Im a huge Batman fan and Ive always loved the cover. I think i paid $2k or $2200? I can't remember exact number. It was about a year ago or so. As others have seen earlier in the thread, I got it pressed, signed by Lee at FXD in April and its a 9.8 CGC SS now. Since then, Ive had multiple boardies private message me and ask if I want to sell it and if I ever do to let them know. This book is in demand. Plain and simple. Was there manipulation on price on eBay with some auctions? Maybe so. Did it affect the overall market price? We will probably never know, but the book is rare, valuable and people want it. The facts about the book are clear though. Its extremely rare, debatably the most popular comic character of all, one of the most top cover artists of all time and a great story of that character's arc. So, it shouldn't be a surprise that the book is in demand and high up or at the top of the list of valuable modern variants. Im not sure why there is so much argument about it really. I don't think anyone is arguing about its "market value" . . . but whether it's justified or not. That will always be the subject of some skepticism. Lethal_Collector 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
divad Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 7 hours ago, bababooey said: I was hoping @Wallace Flowers might be more than a one and done'r, I'm sure many of his colleagues here would love to see a group shot or might even learn something if he shares any insight into his e-bay bidding strategy. Don't like this . . . LOVE it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevhtx Posted July 25, 2017 Share Posted July 25, 2017 6 hours ago, divad said: I don't think anyone is arguing about its "market value" . . . but whether it's justified or not. That will always be the subject of some skepticism. I believe the points I made at the end of my post were what I was getting at in terms of why I think its justified. Has anyone who actually owns the book chimed in to say they are disappointed in their purchase because they think their purchase was manipulated? Or, is everyone who is complaining, people who dont actually own the book? Market value is complex and trying to narrow down one book's value to a couple specific sales seems to be a little narrow in terms of determining that value. If there were a lot of people complaining that their purchases were influenced by them, maybe I would be more inclined to believe it. But, a few people who dont own the book just complaining about a possible shady eBay user, Im not persuaded. If you guys own the book, I stand corrected though. Lethal_Collector 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
