Attrition rate for re-slabs

[drbanner]

Went to a show yesterday and was talking to a BSD (well, mostly he was talking to me...talkative fellow that he is) about the practice of buying undergrades, having them pressed, re-subbing for a higher grade, and flipping for a profit. He's done this with numerous golden age books that show up in the Heritage auctions, and tells me he's constantly looking for the opportunity to press for an upgrade.

 

This practice, along with re-subbing apparently undergraded books without making any "cosmetic changes", leads me to believe that over time, there will be a significant attrition rate in the number of under-graded slabbed copies, and it will get to the point where the majority of high-dollar books are maxed out on the CGC grade. In theory, the end of result of the "re-slab 'n press" game will be that the majority of high-$$ slabbed books will end up on the low end of the acceptable range for the grade.

 

I've cracked open several slabbed books that appear undergraded, but won't do it on apparent overgrades and imagine there are a lot of "hot potatoes" being passed around amongst the flippers for this very reason.

 

Thoughts?

[WillFury]

Forgive my naivete, but what is a "BSD?" A Big Shot Dealer?

[Mushroom]

Big Swinging D**k.....

[drbanner]

Forgive my naivete, but what is a "BSD?" A Big Shot Dealer?

]

 

BSD is a phrase (defined above) blazingbob coined for the deep-pocketed collectors/dealers. Actually whipping it out may or may not be a pre-requisite for the label - does anyone know if you can be a BSD and keep a low profile, or do you actually have to swing it around for others to see to join the club?

[Mushroom]

You have to swing it around....on con days you should wrap it around your neck and use it as a scarf. You should take every possible opportunity to tell everybody about its' length and girth and how much you have spent on it....otherwise why have it.

[thecomicsheet]

And according to my latest spam, increasing it's dimensions by 3 inches should be no problemo!

[scottish]

You have to swing it around....on con days you should wrap it around your neck and use it as a scarf. You should take every possible opportunity to tell everybody about its' length and girth and how much you have spent on it....otherwise why have it.

 

 

[drice6900]

Man the water's deep, and cold too!

[thecomicsheet]

 

An old one but a good one.

[blazingbob]

I like that, throw it right on the table.

 

Don't forget the Diamond pinky ring and rolex watch.

 

Quote me the car you drive, show me pictures of your big house and tell me you paid $10,000 for the chandelier (Whoops, flashback from visiting Showcase Dan's house)

[goldust40]

Interesting conversation, and strangely one I've not been privy to, well not in that context. Do the CGC graders not mention as to whether a book has been pressed (but nothing else)? If the pressing is done well enough, is it that difficult to spot? I've seen PLODs with "Cleaned and Pressed" as the reason for the color of the label, but not "Pressed" on its' own.

 

A bit of a sad development, you have to say though. It fudges everything. How many big books will end up being pressed for profit? It sounds like a handful of the "intelligentsia" will have the inside track here, whilst others will be clueless (unless they're experts at spotting pressing and are foolhardy enough to always crack open every slab they win).

 

Also if you crack open an apparently undergraded book, it's a gamble. You can't see absolutely everything through the case. Sounds as if you've had success the odd time you've done it.

[drbanner]

Before you joined up there was plenty of discussion on pressing - the bottom line is that when done correctly, there's no way to know if a book has been pressed or not. Nothing was added or taken from the book, and pressed books are not considered restored. You can basically press a book flat by squeezing too many into a box! "Cleaned and pressed" is not the way to go however, and that will get you a plod.

 

Nah, I've never re-subbed...the other part of the discussion I had with the BSD was that books have to be worth 4 figures+ to make it worth the press-n-resub. Pressing will run you $50-100 (or so I hear), the re-slab is around $50 for the more expensive books, etc.

[joe_collector]

Nah, I've never re-subbed...the other part of the discussion I had with the BSD was that books have to be worth 4 figures+ to make it worth the press-n-resub. Pressing will run you $50-100 (or so I hear), the re-slab is around $50 for the more expensive books, etc.

 

Not to mention working at, or having access to, a major auction house to see these books up close and personal, and then inputting the serial numbers, checking out the exact damage, calling CGC for grader's notes, and then and only then, deciding if it's a resub candidate.

[AllTop8Me]

Do the CGC graders not mention as to whether a book has been pressed (but nothing else)?

 

I think that pressing is one of the few forms of conservation that does not earn a purple label. Tape removal and pencil erasure are similarly tolerated. None of these are addative processes, which seems to be the main criteria for the purple label. I'm not sure why washing gets the PLOD, but perhaps the thought is that some of the cleaning agent gets absorbed into the pulp. It's a pity that other forms of conservation are not treated as charitably as pressing. Ernie Gerber discussed five classes of restoration and conservation in the Introduction to the picture books, some of which he wholeheartedly embraced, and if CGC had been more inclined to his approach fewer books might be going unpreserved.

[sfilosa]

Why is pressing so expensive?

 

Are they actually taking the cover off the book or are they pressing the whole book?

 

I thought removing the staples was a No, No and would get you a PLOD.

 

 

[drbanner]

Why is pressing so expensive?

 

Are they actually taking the cover off the book or are they pressing the whole book?

 

I thought removing the staples was a No, No and would get you a PLOD.

 

No, I don't believe you have to remove the staples to press a book. As for the price, the going rate for an hour of someone's (Matt Nelson, Susan Cicconi, etc., - I'm not even sure who does pressing) time is probably what you're paying for. Likewise, before CGC if you wanted a resto check from one of the "resto experts", you would probably have to lay out a similar amount just for the resto check!

[Rickdogg]

Big Swinging D**k.....

 

[Rickdogg]

And according to my latest spam, increasing it's dimensions by 3 inches should be no problemo!

 

Another

[garthgantu]

I like that, throw it right on the table.

 

Don't forget the Diamond pinky ring and rolex watch.

 

Which do you put on it first, the watch or the ring?

[fantastic_four]

Are they actually taking the cover off the book or are they pressing the whole book?

 

They don't have to remove the cover, but sometimes they do--you can put the staples back in such a way that it's not detectable beyond a reasonable doubt that the cover was removed. We've posted before-and-after scans here in the forums on books that went from one lower CGC grade to a higher CGC grade where it was quite obvious the cover had been removed because the wrap was different on the "after" scan. Pressing can be detected if the pressing doesn't totally remove the crease--this is true if the paper fibers are damaged. I've got a book that I know was pressed because there's still an extremely faint line you can only see when the book is angled sideways under fluorescent lighting.

 

The resub game is happening weekly, if not daily--several forum members are playing it. I've seen some forum members post scans of census-topping books that I watched them buy on E-Bay at a lower grade!!!

 

If piece replacement is like getting fake boobs...and trimming is like getting a nose job and liposuction...then dry-cleaning and light pressing are like going for a day at the spa. I've been trying to decide for months whether it's ethical, but it's so incredibly minor that I can't see much of a problem with it.