Moderns that are heating up on ebay! 70 70

[Shoomanfoo]

2 hours ago, wiparker824 said:

Okay but you’re comparing apples and oranges. The horrible spider-man show from the 70’s was just that - a horrible show. The movies in the MCU are not horrible, in fact they are so popular that they are breaking all kinds of box office records. Are you really trying to say you expected the same price bump to AF15 from that 70’s Spider-Man show as you saw from the first Spider-Man MCU movies bump?

Very well said. There's alot of people just reaching at straws to play down the importance of a female Thor.

I actually read comics and I read that entire arc.

I'm one of those people that was pissed about a female Thor but the reception was actually very well and many people were vested.

I remember not even being able to find variants the day of release at my comic shop. 

 

Was very big with investor spec as well as actual readers.

Even all the bad press was good press...now here we are.

Edited July 26, 2019 by Shoomanfoo

[kairos70]

56 minutes ago, maidenmate91 said:

Yes, but #1s typically sell at high numbers. However how did the rest of the run do? I would wage that there was a massive drop off in sales by #3. Not to mention, #1 New Thor speculation driven numbers. 

Sales of subsequent issues wasn't the discussion. The sustainability of the recent high sales of issue 2014 #1 was. He said #1 wasn't well received. I believe it was. Issues 2-7 were pretty much fillers with the big reveal in #8. Even though #2 is a first full appearance issue it really isn't recognized as so. There are filler issues for every title so not really much discussion needed for that.

Edited July 26, 2019 by kairos70

[valiantman]

1 hour ago, maidenmate91 said:

1 hour ago, kairos70 said:

I don't know about that. 4 printings sold out years before a movie announcement.

Yes, but #1s typically sell at high numbers. However how did the rest of the run do? I would wage that there was a massive drop off in sales by #3. Not to mention, #1 New Thor speculation driven numbers. 

https://comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/2014.html

The fact that there were 4 printings might be indicative of good reception, but publishers were planning "sold out" announcements before the books were ordered by 2014.  If you believe you have a book that could sell around 175,000 copies, then you can just print 175,000 and hope for the best, but you probably won't get any headlines in the trade publications... it's good, but not great.

However, publishers realized that if you can sell 140,000 copies of a book that will probably sell around 175,000 copies, then you can plan to get a headline that it is "FIRST PRINTING SOLD OUT" (140,000) then get another headline for selling 10,000 second printings that "sold out" then get another headline for selling 10,000 third printings that "sold out" and get another headline for "fourth printing now available!!!" then you get a bunch of trade publication headlines for selling fewer than 175,000 copies.  

That's the same number of books in both cases, around 175,000, but one marketing plan includes propaganda headlines that are free advertising for your brand.

[kairos70]

1 minute ago, valiantman said:

https://comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/2014.html

The fact that there were 4 printings might be indicative of good reception, but publishers were planning "sold out" announcements before the books were ordered by 2014.  If you believe you have a book that could sell around 175,000 copies, then you can just print 175,000 and hope for the best, but you probably won't get any headlines in the trade publications... it's good, but not great.

However, publishers realized that if you can sell 140,000 copies of a book that will probably sell around 175,000 copies, then you can plan to get a headline that it is "FIRST PRINTING SOLD OUT" (140,000) then get another headline for selling 10,000 second printings that "sold out" then get another headline for selling 10,000 third printings that "sold out" and get another headline for "fourth printing now available!!!" then you get a bunch of trade publication headlines for selling fewer than 175,000 copies.  

That's the same number of books in both cases, around 175,000, but one marketing plan includes propaganda headlines that are free advertising for your brand.

Sold out denotes all the Diamond distribution supply has been sold to retailers. There's no way to know when every retailer in the country/world has sold out because there is no reporting system for that.That's what drives my theory that publisher's deliberately fragment some character's "first appearance". They don't want customers to just focus their monies on one title or an issue at a time. Speculators want to simplify collecting to "key issues". Publishers want you to buy every issue.  

[Shoomanfoo]

Who cares if a publisher knew 140,000 issues would be order allowing a 2nd, 3rd, or 4th print for marketing reasons? That's smart business.

We the fans, collectors, and investors bought all those copies...but it was not well received???🤔

Just wow.

[Second Blight]

41 minutes ago, Shoomanfoo said:

Who cares if a publisher knew 140,000 issues would be order allowing a 2nd, 3rd, or 4th print for marketing reasons? That's smart business.

We the fans, collectors, and investors bought all those copies...but it was not well received???🤔

Just wow.

Marvel plans additional printings ahead of time, even before the 1st print gets released. Its why there's so many in the Walmart 3-packs.

[fufat]

Pertaining to Thor #1 1st appearance & Thor #2 1st full appearance multiple printings, comichron shows:

#1

10/14 1st print 150,862

11/14 2nd print 10,576

12/14 3rd print didn't make the top 300 aprox. under 5,000

02/15 4th print didn't make the top 300 aprox. under 4,800

#2

11/14 1st print   89,131

12/14 2nd print didn't make the top 300 aprox. under 5,000

03/15 3rd print didn't make the top 300 aprox. under 5,000

 

 

 

[fastballspecial]

8 hours ago, GeeksAreMyPeeps said:

I haven't read TGOT #25. Is it possible that the female Thor pictured is a different female Thor (i.e. not Jane Foster)?

No that part I am sure its the same Thor. She looks exactly like her.

 

[fastballspecial]

6 hours ago, kairos70 said:

Sales of subsequent issues wasn't the discussion. The sustainability of the recent high sales of issue 2014 #1 was. He said #1 wasn't well received. I believe it was. Issues 2-7 were pretty much fillers with the big reveal in #8. Even though #2 is a first full appearance issue it really isn't recognized as so. There are filler issues for every title so not really much discussion needed for that.

Aaron's run was well received. Everyone thought it was Roz who would be Thor. We were all reading and waiting for the reveal.

 

[awakeintheashes]

21 hours ago, Shoomanfoo said:

Who cares if a publisher knew 140,000 issues would be order allowing a 2nd, 3rd, or 4th print for marketing reasons? That's smart business.

We the fans, collectors, and investors bought all those copies...but it was not well received???🤔

Just wow.

[RonS2112]

On ‎7‎/‎26‎/‎2019 at 1:08 PM, kevhtx said:

Collecting in general has changed though over these past 30 years. Not just comics. For plentiful books, you may be right, but the core superheroes and villains are pretty safe bets. First appearances and keys. I think pretty cover art books and many moderns may fall into the fads category with a few exceptions. Thus, why this thread is popular for flipping.

The business has definitely changed, but what the MCU (DC to a certain extent as well) has done is create many, many new fans. So, as certain first appearances and keys hibernate in many collector's PCs, they will mostly rise over time (with maybe some slight dips along the way).

Since Hollywood figured out the cash cow of these worlds and characters, they will continue to find ways to get these successful characters into movies, TV and other consumer media/products. Some may go dormant for brief periods, but you can be sure they will always reappear at some point.

Certainly some new fans, but also a lot of new speculators,  One can argue that these are a temporary blip on the radar, but when I go to a con and see booths stocked with $100 slabbed copies of Venom: Lethal Protector #1, something is wrong.

[RonS2112]

On ‎7‎/‎26‎/‎2019 at 1:46 PM, wiparker824 said:

Okay but you’re comparing apples and oranges. The horrible spider-man show from the 70’s was just that - a horrible show. The movies in the MCU are not horrible, in fact they are so popular that they are breaking all kinds of box office records. Are you really trying to say you expected the same price bump to AF15 from that 70’s Spider-Man show as you saw from the first Spider-Man MCU movies bump?

No......the AF15 bump didn't correlate with the McGuire SM movies.  It happened before that.  Likewise, there wasn't an appreciable bump with either Hulk movie.  What I'm trying to say is that the bumps associated with the MCU are a recent phenom, confined to the last 7 or 8 years.

[paul747]

On 7/26/2019 at 1:51 PM, Shoomanfoo said:

Very well said. There's alot of people just reaching at straws to play down the importance of a female Thor.

I actually read comics and I read that entire arc.

I'm one of those people that was pissed about a female Thor but the reception was actually very well and many people were vested.

I remember not even being able to find variants the day of release at my comic shop. 

 

Was very big with investor spec as well as actual readers.

Even all the bad press was good press...now here we are.

Its also DISNEY!! dont think for one minute that comics went global on their own. Disney is worldwide, not one Disney/marvel character should be overlooked. this is just the start.

[fastballspecial]

2 hours ago, RonS2112 said:

On 7/26/2019 at 12:08 PM, kevhtx said:

Collecting in general has changed though over these past 30 years. Not just comics. For plentiful books, you may be right, but the core superheroes and villains are pretty safe bets. First appearances and keys. I think pretty cover art books and many moderns may fall into the fads category with a few exceptions. Thus, why this thread is popular for flipping.

The business has definitely changed, but what the MCU (DC to a certain extent as well) has done is create many, many new fans. So, as certain first appearances and keys hibernate in many collector's PCs, they will mostly rise over time (with maybe some slight dips along the way).

Since Hollywood figured out the cash cow of these worlds and characters, they will continue to find ways to get these successful characters into movies, TV and other consumer media/products. Some may go dormant for brief periods, but you can be sure they will always reappear at some point.

Certainly some new fans, but also a lot of new speculators,  One can argue that these are a temporary blip on the radar, but when I go to a con and see booths stocked with $100 slabbed copies of Venom: Lethal Protector #1, something is wrong.

You are right. The rush to slab books has made people slowly realize that the slab market is a smaller, but growing area of the hobby. The problem is there are too many speculators in a market that cant support them currently. Economic Darwinism will weed many out of the next couple of years. They will choke on their inventory when they cant sell it.

Disney may save some, but those chasing big dollars in the indy area will get hurt as well. Spreading out your risk is highly important. This isn't the first time I have seen this.
Its actually the 3rd time. The market in the 90s, the hobbyist during the housing bubble and next who knows.

 

 

 

 

Edited July 28, 2019 by fastballspecial

[manetteska]

The Boys is heating up after the Prime release. Hoping to check out an episode or two tonight. 

May be getting ahead of myself but the formula for streaming shows and selling appears to be to wait for the release (and be good).

[RonS2112]

9 hours ago, fastballspecial said:

You are right. The rush to slab books has made people slowly realize that the slab market is a smaller, but growing area of the hobby. The problem is there are too many speculators in a market that cant support them currently. Economic Darwinism will weed many out of the next couple of years. They will choke on their inventory when they cant sell it.

Disney may save some, but those chasing big dollars in the indy area will get hurt as well. Spreading out your risk is highly important. This isn't the first time I have seen this.
Its actually the 3rd time. The market in the 90s, the hobbyist during the housing bubble and next who knows.

 

 

 

 

The new problem I'm seeing is that some sellers are starting to demand slabbed prices for raw books.  "Well it could sell for X more dollars, so that's what I'm going to charge."  Likewise for potential key issues -- because a book could figure into the MCU, charge more now, because the book could appreciate years from now.  Have actually run into this thinking at my LCS.

[divad]

4 hours ago, RonS2112 said:

The new problem I'm seeing is that some sellers are starting to demand slabbed prices for raw books.  "Well it could sell for X more dollars, so that's what I'm going to charge."  Likewise for potential key issues -- because a book could figure into the MCU, charge more now, because the book could appreciate years from now.  Have actually run into this thinking at my LCS.

This is not a problem. This is short-sightedness and frankly, the sense of entitlement on the buyer's side. The only case in which this may be appropriate is when the seller does it on a brand-spanking new book right off the presses. If this is what you are referring to, my apologies. A smart seller should be rewarded for his (or her) efforts.

[500Club]

2 hours ago, divad said:

6 hours ago, RonS2112 said:

The new problem I'm seeing is that some sellers are starting to demand slabbed prices for raw books.  "Well it could sell for X more dollars, so that's what I'm going to charge."  Likewise for potential key issues -- because a book could figure into the MCU, charge more now, because the book could appreciate years from now.  Have actually run into this thinking at my LCS.

This is not a problem. This is short-sightedness and frankly, the sense of entitlement on the buyer's side. The only case in which this may be appropriate is when the seller does it on a brand-spanking new book right off the presses. If this is what you are referring to, my apologies. A smart seller should be rewarded for his (or her) efforts.

It’s a problem in proportion to the seller’s inability to grade.  I know you get some stick for your grading, but it’s small potatoes compared to some people’s grading.

[fastballspecial]

6 hours ago, RonS2112 said:

16 hours ago, fastballspecial said:

You are right. The rush to slab books has made people slowly realize that the slab market is a smaller, but growing area of the hobby. The problem is there are too many speculators in a market that cant support them currently. Economic Darwinism will weed many out of the next couple of years. They will choke on their inventory when they cant sell it.

Disney may save some, but those chasing big dollars in the indy area will get hurt as well. Spreading out your risk is highly important. This isn't the first time I have seen this.
Its actually the 3rd time. The market in the 90s, the hobbyist during the housing bubble and next who knows.

 

 

 

 

The new problem I'm seeing is that some sellers are starting to demand slabbed prices for raw books.  "Well it could sell for X more dollars, so that's what I'm going to charge."  Likewise for potential key issues -- because a book could figure into the MCU, charge more now, because the book could appreciate years from now.  Have actually run into this thinking at my LCS.

Well a fool and his money is soon parted I guess.

I do charge a smaller premium for a NM+ copy, but not enough to compare it to a slab. That being said if enough sales returns show me that pattern I am
going to move with the price of the book though.

My local shop does this with everything and a lot of their variants just plain sit. Just charge enough to make a profit and then recoup the rest as $1 books of
regular issues if you have to. Their is slight/good profit and a repeat customer or their is Greed and stupidity. Its not a hard choice.

 

Edited July 28, 2019 by fastballspecial

[divad]

2 hours ago, 500Club said:

It’s a problem in proportion to the seller’s inability to grade.  I know you get some stick for your grading, but it’s small potatoes compared to some people’s grading.

Yep, which is always why it should be caveat emptor!