Two-Gun Kid #60 - the forgotten key? 2 2

[pemart1966]

Overstreet notates that "handwritten issue number on cover" exists, and that a typeset version exists, but that is incorrect.

 

 

Sounds like another case of someone making the assumption that since all previous issues in this title and in fact comics since their dawn had all been typeset, that this issue must have been typeset too - at least some of the copies.

 

I can think of at least one other case in Overstreet where an incorrect assumption way back when is still being listed as "fact".

Edited August 29, 2016 by pemart1966

[seredynskib]

Picked this up at Soda City Con in Columbia, SC this past weekend. Low grade but I'm happy to add it to my collection.

 

Nice book, I would have bought it too!

 

Not only is this book the forgotten key, but with no posts since 2013 it is also the forgotten thread! Nice job of resurrecting it.

 

Thanks! I've avoided the Marvel westerns until now but I couldn't resist this key. Looking through the issue, it reads exactly like any origin issue of any Lee/Kirby super-hero book but in a western setting.

For you guys that collect westerns, how do Rawhide Kid and Kid Colt Outlaw compare to Two-Gun? Did Lee/Kirby also do any of those or were they mostly drawn by Ayers and company?

 

I agree 100% with you that this story reads just like a Marvel Superhero book. That's why Two-Gun Kid is my favorite western hero. Even after his origin story, the sequential books have 'villains' and a hero who is juggling his superhero identity along with his romantic life.

 

Rawhide Kid and Kid Colt don't read the same in my opinion. Kid Colt faces a few cool villains (Most notably Iron Mask) and Rawhide Kid is more of a true western comic. Neither have that "superhero feel" to them.

[Dave2739]

That's exactly what I was hoping to find out. Looks like Two-Gun Kid 60 will be the start of my run. Fun book!

[*Bronze age fan*]

Great comic!!!

 

[KirbyJack]

Yup, Two-Gun is the DD/Matt Murdock of the West. But for pure Kirby goodness, check out Rawhide Kid. #17 is a big-time key in my book!

 

[Dave2739]

Great comic!!!

 

 

Ha! You show-off! BAF, the TwoTwo-Gun Kid Kid!

[Dave2739]

Yup, Two-Gun is the DD/Matt Murdock of the West. But for pure Kirby goodness, check out Rawhide Kid. #17 is a big-time key in my book!

 

Thanks KirbyJack. I'm a total noob when it comes to these Atlas/Marvel westerns so I appreciate the tip. Any other Marvel western keys or just cool issues? From what I've seen it looks like there's plenty of cool covers if nothing else.

[KirbyJack]

The earliest issues, Two Gun 60-63, RHK 17-20, and even Non-Kirby Kid Colts, can be really tough to find, even in low or mid-grades. High grades are brutal!

Outside of these, there is a lot of interest in the "monster" books, ie westerns with PreHero Marvel- type covers.

Two-Gun 58, Rawhide 22, Kid Colt 100, etc.

[electricprune]

Kid Colt Outlaw 97 is another book with hand written numbers. Does anyone know if any similar issue does have both hand written and type set numbers? I have not seen KCO 97 with type set numbers.

[Aman619]

The reason the entire masthead looks hand drawn is because ALL comics logos are handdrawn. Nearly all logos anyway, because back then, paying some letterer was cheaper than typesetting. We are talking years before desktop publishing put fonts and typesetting in everyone's hands beginning in the 80s.

 

I don't know if all copies have the handdrawn 60, but ive never seen a typeset one either.

 

Seems the typeset 60 piece fell off the cover mechanical somewhere on the way to the printer, who noticed it and just wrote the 60 in place probably at the deadline when delaying would have cost press time fees and Marvel back in NY said kit, write it in!

 

And the pence copy also has the handdrawn 60 because they received the US printing setup (stats) to build their version of the cover with, swapping out the price into local currency.

[Dave2739]

...Seems the typeset 60 piece fell off the cover mechanical somewhere on the way to the printer, who noticed it and just wrote the 60 in place probably at the deadline when delaying would have cost press time fees and Marvel back in NY said kit, write it in!....

I've been in the newspaper biz for many years now and I have to say this sounds like a very likely scenario of what happened. I can picture some prepress guy with a marker feverishly scribbling in the "60" as pressmen in blue uniforms hover around him impatiently tapping their toes and looking at the clock.

[EwanUK]

Seems the typeset 60 piece fell off the cover mechanical somewhere on the way to the printer, who noticed it and just wrote the 60 in place probably at the deadline when delaying would have cost press time fees and Marvel back in NY said kit, write it in!

 

And the pence copy also has the handdrawn 60 because they received the US printing setup (stats) to build their version of the cover with, swapping out the price into local currency.

 

Pretty much proof that the UK variants were printed at the same time on the same presses as the US ones then

[Aman619]

not necessarily. they would have a deal with the publishers that they are sent final printing plates, final negatives and or photostats with which to make their language etc changes in order to locally print the comics. Certainly for overseas markets where printing here and shipping would have been slow and expensive.

 

Canada was probably printed at Sparta same as USA comics though. Don't know about UK. But since they had a viable comics industry, including local printers well versed in comics production, chances are they created their covers and interiors etc from supplied materials and made changes.

 

Edited August 30, 2016 by aman619

[Dave2739]

not necessarily. they would have a deal with the publishers that they are sent final printing plates, final negatives and or photostats with which to make their language etc changes in order to locally print the comics. Certainly for overseas markets where printing here and shipping would have been slow and expensive.

 

Canada was probably printed at Sparta same as USA comics though. Don't know about UK. But since they had a viable comics industry, including local printers well versed in comics production, chances are they created their covers and interiors etc from supplied materials and made changes.

This makes sense, although I would have to guess that the mechanicals or photostats would have been the way to go to send materials overseas to be printed. The printers in the UK could easily remove and replace the price info if they had the actual mechanicals and then shoot their own negatives.

The modern equivalent would be sending a fellow printer the InDesign file with all the links and fonts.

[01TheDude]

interesting - I've always read on this forum that folks thought the UK books were printed at the same time and place as the US version. It would seem to make sense to send the means to print them rather than the bulk books. I've never heard anyone write this until now. Is there any supporting evidence?

[Aman619]

I don't have a timeline about British comics. Frankly I'm not really sure their comics were same as our format . 32 pages plus covers. But I seem to recall they do...

 

Anyway, if they were printing their own comics over the pond, they were sent printing materials. And if not, then US publishers changed the plates and printed them for them.

 

But maybe just English speaking countries. I doubt Atlas, Marvel or even DC would bother translating and re lettering entire comics so they could print them in the states and ship them.

 

Who here has some of those cool foreign editions of early marvels? Tell us if they say where they were printed please!

[thecopperagekids]

I don't have a timeline about British comics. Frankly I'm not really sure their comics were same as our format . 32 pages plus covers. But I seem to recall they do...

 

Anyway, if they were printing their own comics over the pond, they were sent printing materials. And if not, then US publishers changed the plates and printed them for them.

 

But maybe just English speaking countries. I doubt Atlas, Marvel or even DC would bother translating and re lettering entire comics so they could print them in the states and ship them.

 

Who here has some of those cool foreign editions of early marvels? Tell us if they say where they were printed please!

 

I have a TGK 60, a 9 pence copy.As well as a TGK 60 12 cent copy.

 

 

Just checked my 9 pence copy, I'd have to dig for my 12 cents copy but it appears as though the pence copy has exactly the same information given in the indicia as the cents copy.

 

The indicia on my pence copy is located on the inside of the FC, bottom of the page....can't recall if the indicia is printed in that same spot on the inside FC or if it was printed in that area, on the first page.

 

Either way, it all reads the same as a 12 cents copy, right down to the notation that Two Gun Kid is 12 cents per issue.

 

"November 1962 issue"...12 cents in the indicia..." Printed In The USA"

 

...below all of the rest of that standard stuff is the following, in slightly larger typeset:

 

"SOLE DISTRIBUTORS IN THE UNITED KINGDOM - THORPE & PORTER LTD."

 

The price box has "9d", in place of "12 c"....

 

To me, that indicates both the UK and US versions of the book were printed at the same time.

 

Would cements that to me, beyond just the November 1962 notation in the indicia of my pence copy, is that my pence copy also has a handwritten "60" in the issue number box.Not typeset.

 

All copies that I have seen have a handwritten "60", far as I can see, the number plate wasn't used on any copies.

 

Not sure how Overstreet managed to eff up on that notation in the guide, he even lists 2 different price spreads for this book with the " #60 hand written edition" as having slightly more value than the "typeset 60 version".

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[thecopperagekids]

Here's a pic of the FC to my TGK 60 pence copy...I snapped a pic of the indicia, too but Photobucket is a pain in the balls and I'm tired.

 

If someone else posts up a pic of the indicia of their cents copy of TGK 60, that'd be helpful....

 

Two Gun Kid 60 - Pence Copy

 

Here's a shot of a CGC 1.8 TGK 60 cents copy, that I sold a while back.....catch the CGC label notes about "handwritten edition exists blah blah"....all the CGC label notes say the same thing, just like the Overstreet guide.

 

TGK 60 CGC 1.8 Cents Copy

 

To set this straight, I'll dig out my raw TGK 60 cents copy (but probably not til after Baltimore) and will post up a shot of the indicia page from both my pence and cents raw copies.

 

 

 

 

[thecopperagekids]

]Double posting cuz I love this book...haha[/url]

[EwanUK]

I think I wasn't clear

 

The fact that the hand-written "60" WASN'T changed adds credance to the view that both the UK and USA copies were printed at the same time. Surely if the USA were sending stats across the pond, the time delay would allow such things to be fixed?

 

The USA & UK copies are indentical in size and conent apart from price and date

In most copies, the indicia has extra distribution text added (as above)

 

There are anomalies both ways to this, some copies are cents with the added indicia

Some don't have the indicia text at all

 

These pence priced variants are totally different from UK versions of USA comics like those published by Alan Class, L Miller etc

 

ANYWAY, I didn't want to hijack this thread into the USA/ UK debate

 

Two-Gun Kid is a very cool book! I think much rarer than people think!