Fantastic Four from Fox Studios (8/7/15) 1 1

[ComicConnoisseur]

The fact that your screen name is "fantastic four" and you disagree with me turns my stomach.

+1

To see Lee and Kirby`s vision bastardized like this is quite concerning.

[ComicConnoisseur]

The fact that your screen name is "fantastic four" and you disagree with me turns my stomach.

 

I'm neutral about any film yet to be released because if you pre-judge it based upon pre-release material, there's virtually no chance you'd ever enjoy it. The fact that you assumed I had a bias in the opposite direction of your own tells me that it'd have to be one of the top 5 superhero films in history to ever break through the wall of pessimism you've already built for yourself.

 

But you do this repeatedly in these threads for multiple films, so I know you get off on it and you'll never stop.

I would agree with you with most movies, but not superhero or sci-fi movies.

You can tell usually when they`re going to be mediocre or bad.

Same thing with Suicide Squad.

 

"If it looks like a mediocre/bad superhero movie, sounds like a mediocre/bad superhero movie and smells like a mediocre/bad superhero movie, it's a mediocre/bad super hero movie"

 

[zosocane]

It doesn`t matter if it sucks, but if the box office is good.

They can make all the new progressive changes they want, but if no one goes, than they don`t make money.

For this to be a successful reboot it has to beat Rise of The Silver Surfer box office.

For it to not be considered a bomb it must beat Ryan Reynolds Green Lantern box office.

It`s as simple as that.

 

+1.

[Bosco685]

International Trailer #2.

 

[Amadeus Arkham]

Rubbish.

[Prince Namor]

Plus, if Stan Lee writes an email to my director saying, “You’re good. I’m okay with this,” who am I to go against that?

 

I've always found it bizarre that Stan is so much more incredibly open to creative changes than most of his fans are.

 

There are a bunch of changes to the team. None of them excite me, but none of them turn me off. If the movie sucks, it won't be because of the changes, it'll be because it sucks. My expectations are low, but it has more to do with the inexperience of the writer/director and the fact that he just got fired from doing the Star Wars spin-offs than what I've seen from the film to date.

 

If it's great, then awesome. If it sucks royally, my great hope is that it sucks REALLY hard so that Fox stops trying to make these films and the rights revert to Marvel. So I'm hoping for extremes either way. I'm sure the odds are that it'll be somewhere in the middle and get mixed reviews like the Tim Story films.

It doesn`t matter if it sucks, but if the box office is good.

They can make all the new progressive changes they want, but if no one goes, than they don`t make money.

For this to be a successful reboot it has to beat Rise of The Silver Surfer box office.

For it to not be considered a bomb it must beat Ryan Reynolds Green Lantern box office.

It`s as simple as that.

 

Box office money = success.

 

Well..not really... I mean it really depends on what the budget of the movie is.

 

If the budget (which hasn't been released) is $100 Million (which I doubt) and it does FFRotSS numbers ($131 Million), that's not a bomb... it's not all that great either, but it's not a bomb.

 

Most likely, it'll have a budget in the $200 Million range, and so, if it does DDRotSS numbers, it'll be a HUGE failure.

 

 

[Bosco685]

Page 73

 

I would be absolutely shocked if this movie, even in an expanded Foreign market - could do 600M worldwide.....

 

Fantastic Four is not the X-Men, and the X-Men: Days of Future Past is the only real breakthrough foreign money comic book movie for Fox Studios...

 

My guess is this movie is, based on what I've seen so far, a $150M domestic at best if it's lucky based upon the name alone. If they're lucky. So far, this has bust written all over it.

 

That means it'd have to do 450M foreign, putting it in the X-Men DOFP (the only comic book Fox movie to break that total).

 

No way I'd make that bet.

 

We shall see. The safer bet is probably $400 MM worldwide, depending on how Fox attempts to market this in the international market.

 

 

You are correct in that only X-Men: DoFP has exceeded $400 MM in the international market. But even if they can pull off The Wolverine numbers on the same production budget, it would be a success.

 

 

Even the 2005 FF movie was a financial success, breaking the 2.5X barrier and leading to a sequel. But it was the lower budget that helped it get there.

 

What is the 2015 FF's budget?

 

Here is what this version of Fantastic Four needs to do in order to achieve or exceed the 2.5X revenue ratio.

 

 

Not even $400 MM, assuming from Fox's common budget trend with these superhero movies ($100 MM to $200 MM). If Fox invested more than $160 MM in this movie, it only makes the final box office target that much higher.

 

If the budget was $160 MM, all this movie has to achieve worldwide is $395 MM. I think it will do $450 MM or better.

[jsilverjanet]

I can't believe this movie is close to 200 million in budget. zero money on advertising, the actors are virtual unknowns, so is the director. I'm sure they were cheap on this.

 

I'm willing to bet it easily does the 2.5x that it needs to make a profit

[Chip Cataldo]

It just looks so dull. Reed isn't Reed, Ben isn't Ben...and then Doom shows up and I just shake my head. I watched the international trailer that was just posted and I have zero desire to see it at all. I've been an FF fan for nearly my entire life...37 of my 43 years, and I have zero desire to see it.

 

They're not doing things right here.

[Prince Namor]

Page 73

 

I would be absolutely shocked if this movie, even in an expanded Foreign market - could do 600M worldwide.....

 

Fantastic Four is not the X-Men, and the X-Men: Days of Future Past is the only real breakthrough foreign money comic book movie for Fox Studios...

 

My guess is this movie is, based on what I've seen so far, a $150M domestic at best if it's lucky based upon the name alone. If they're lucky. So far, this has bust written all over it.

 

That means it'd have to do 450M foreign, putting it in the X-Men DOFP (the only comic book Fox movie to break that total).

 

No way I'd make that bet.

 

We shall see. The safer bet is probably $400 MM worldwide, depending on how Fox attempts to market this in the international market.

 

 

You are correct in that only X-Men: DoFP has exceeded $400 MM in the international market. But even if they can pull off The Wolverine numbers on the same production budget, it would be a success.

 

 

Even the 2005 FF movie was a financial success, breaking the 2.5X barrier and leading to a sequel. But it was the lower budget that helped it get there.

 

What is the 2015 FF's budget?

 

Here is what this version of Fantastic Four needs to do in order to achieve or exceed the 2.5X revenue ratio.

 

 

Not even $400 MM, assuming from Fox's common budget trend with these superhero movies ($100 MM to $200 MM). If Fox invested more than $160 MM in this movie, it only makes the final box office target that much higher.

 

If the budget was $160 MM, all this movie has to achieve worldwide is $395 MM. I think it will do $450 MM or better.

 

How do you figure that?

 

If it does $100 MM domestically and $295 MM foreign that's not a success. Look at Amazing Spider-man 2 - it did $500 MM overseas, but only $200 MM domestically and it was seen as a failure that made Sony partially give control back to Marvel.

 

Actually the failure of this movie could be a GOOD thing - think about it - Marvel got Spider-man partially back because it stumbled - could it happen with the FF if it bombs?

[Chris_Skeleton]

It just looks so dull. Reed isn't Reed, Ben isn't Ben...and then Doom shows up and I just shake my head. I watched the international trailer that was just posted and I have zero desire to see it at all. I've been an FF fan for nearly my entire life...37 of my 43 years, and I have zero desire to see it.

 

They're not doing things right here.

 

If this was titled "Ultimate Fantastic Four", would it interest you? You gotta look at it as what it is, and that's UFF.

 

 

[ComicConnoisseur]

It just looks so dull. Reed isn't Reed, Ben isn't Ben...and then Doom shows up and I just shake my head. I watched the international trailer that was just posted and I have zero desire to see it at all. I've been an FF fan for nearly my entire life...37 of my 43 years, and I have zero desire to see it.

 

They're not doing things right here.

 

If this was titled "Ultimate Fantastic Four", would it interest you? You gotta look at it as what it is, and that's UFF.

Most mainstream people never heard of Ultimate Fantastic Four, and we know how Ultimate Spider-Man with Andrew Garfield turned out.

 

Like I said before if people go see it,than we have a hit.

If they don`t, than it will join it`s place with thousands of other mediocre movies.

[Bosco685]

How do you figure that?

 

If it does $100 MM domestically and $295 MM foreign that's not a success. Look at Amazing Spider-man 2 - it did $500 MM overseas, but only $200 MM domestically and it was seen as a failure that made Sony partially give control back to Marvel.

 

Actually the failure of this movie could be a GOOD thing - think about it - Marvel got Spider-man partially back because it stumbled - could it happen with the FF if it bombs?

 

You are comparing two different situations.

 

1) ASM2: Why was it a failure, other than things like the CEO of Sony stepping in to tell the movie-makers what scenes would work best for audiences, and the poorly crafted story and excessive characters? How about the biggest budget ever invested in a Spider-Man movie, assuming the more they spent the more money they would make?

 

 

A $300 MM budget required this movie to easily exceed $800 MM worldwide in order to be a success. It fell far short of its goal.

 

2) FF Reboot: Like has been pointed out before, with the use of actors that are up-and-comers and a fairly new director that is still establishing himself on a big budget film, this movie is probably costing Fox less than $200 MM.

 

Based on the budgets of the previous two Fantastic Four movies, and referencing what has been spent on the recent X-Men/Wolverine movies ($160 MM, $120 MM, $200 MM), I ballparked $160 MM.

 

 

 

But I feel really good about that number because of detailed analysis. Not a guesstimate.

 

 

That was how I figured that: reality based on historic analysis.

 

But like one NYT reporter determined, studios don't really put much effort into historic analysis. He came up with a decisioning tree to achieve a blockbuster versus a dog.

 

How Does the Film Industry Actually Make Money?

 

 

 

[marvelcollector]

It just looks so dull. Reed isn't Reed, Ben isn't Ben...and then Doom shows up and I just shake my head. I watched the international trailer that was just posted and I have zero desire to see it at all. I've been an FF fan for nearly my entire life...37 of my 43 years, and I have zero desire to see it.

 

They're not doing things right here.

 

Pretty much sums up my sentiments as well.

 

This is not the FF.

 

Sheesh, Roger Corman was truer to the spirit of the source material.

 

Sad.

Edited May 24, 2015 by marvelcollector

[Bosco685]

It looks like the folks on comicbookmovies.com and Superhero News started a social media campaign to discuss a rumor Josh Trank was not the sole director of the movie. Josh Wilding especially, who does articles on a few comic book movie sites.

 

DEBUNKED: Matthew Vaughn Directed FANTASTIC FOUR Reshoots; Josh Trank Responds

 

Matthew Vaughn saved the X-Men franchise, so could the Fantastic Four one be next? It certainly sounds that way, as Superhero News (definitely a reliable source) have heard that the Kingsman: The Secret Service helmer assumed the role of director for reshoots which took place in April. It was previously reported that Trank was present for those, but this obviously sheds some doubt on that.

 

 

At least they finally updated the article to reflect it was all rumors.

 

UPDATE: Fantastic Four director Josh Trank has responded to this article on Twitter to make it clear that he is indeed the sole director of the reboot. As mentioned above, that matches up to what we previously heard about reshoots. Many thanks to Josh for taking the time to set things straight!

[Chris_Skeleton]

It just looks so dull. Reed isn't Reed, Ben isn't Ben...and then Doom shows up and I just shake my head. I watched the international trailer that was just posted and I have zero desire to see it at all. I've been an FF fan for nearly my entire life...37 of my 43 years, and I have zero desire to see it.

 

They're not doing things right here.

 

Pretty much sums up my sentiments as well.

 

This is not the FF.

 

Sheesh, Roger Corman was truer to the spirit of the source material.

 

Sad.

 

 

You're right, it's not FF. It is Ultimate FF.

 

And it looks like it is staying true to the spirit of the source material, and that source material is Ultimate FF.

 

I don't understand people still coming in here saying "this isn't FF", "they screwed the FF up", "this isn't true to the source material".

 

It's based on ULTIMATE FANTASTIC FOUR. If you are going to say it isn't true to the source material, then go read Ultimate FF before you see the movie and then report back.

 

 

 

 

Edited May 24, 2015 by Chris_Skeleton

[CAHokie]

It just looks so dull. Reed isn't Reed, Ben isn't Ben...and then Doom shows up and I just shake my head. I watched the international trailer that was just posted and I have zero desire to see it at all. I've been an FF fan for nearly my entire life...37 of my 43 years, and I have zero desire to see it.

 

They're not doing things right here.

 

Pretty much sums up my sentiments as well.

 

This is not the FF.

 

Sheesh, Roger Corman was truer to the spirit of the source material.

 

Sad.

 

 

You're right, it's not FF. It is Ultimate FF.

 

And it looks like it is staying true to the spirit of the source material, and that source material is Ultimate FF.

 

I don't understand people still coming in here saying "this isn't FF", "they screwed the FF up", "this isn't true to the source material".

 

It's based on ULTIMATE FANTASTIC FOUR. If you are going to say it isn't true to the source material, then go read Ultimate FF before you see the movie and then report back.

 

 

 

 

If it's true to the source material, I need to go back and reread it. I missed the part where Johnny and his dad were Black and Sue was adopted or had a different mother!

[Prince Namor]

How do you figure that?

 

If it does $100 MM domestically and $295 MM foreign that's not a success. Look at Amazing Spider-man 2 - it did $500 MM overseas, but only $200 MM domestically and it was seen as a failure that made Sony partially give control back to Marvel.

 

Actually the failure of this movie could be a GOOD thing - think about it - Marvel got Spider-man partially back because it stumbled - could it happen with the FF if it bombs?

 

You are comparing two different situations.

 

1) ASM2: Why was it a failure, other than things like the CEO of Sony stepping in to tell the movie-makers what scenes would work best for audiences, and the poorly crafted story and excessive characters? How about the biggest budget ever invested in a Spider-Man movie, assuming the more they spent the more money they would make?

 

A $300 MM budget required this movie to easily exceed $800 MM worldwide in order to be a success. It fell far short of its goal.

 

Where does the $300 MM for ASM2 come from? That's your guesstimate based upon what? Even Avengers 2 was only at $250MM and that movie had AT LEAST 5X the high priced stars that ASM2 did.

 

Your $300 MM number makes your math work, but in reality, your foreign income for these movies is still counted as equal to the domestic gross and that just isn't the case. Not knocking what you've put together there, I appreciate seeing all of these numbers together...

 

As an example, the worldwide take for Green Lantern is $219 MM... on $200 MM budget. That's not good, but it looks like another movie could be made.

 

Truth is the studio sees it as the movie did $116 MM domestically (where they make the highest percentage of take) on a $200 MM budget - a complete failure - and you hear no real talk about a sequel. If they did $219 on $200, they'd at least be considering it.

 

 

2) FF Reboot: Like has been pointed out before, with the use of actors that are up-and-comers and a fairly new director that is still establishing himself on a big budget film, this movie is probably costing Fox less than $200 MM.

 

Based on the budgets of the previous two Fantastic Four movies, and referencing what has been spent on the recent X-Men/Wolverine movies ($160 MM, $120 MM, $200 MM), I ballparked $160 MM.

 

Wolverine was a really low budget movie with only one real star (Jackman) and a moderate priced director. Mostly small sets, and really A- special effects. Josh Trank probably did $120 MM just in cocaine.

 

The other thing to take into consideration is that none of these kids have been in a movie that's been a box office hit.

 

Miles Teller $150 MM in Divergent (less in the sequel)

Michael B. Jordan's never been in a movie that's hit $65 MM!

Jaimie Bell wasn't a star in King Kong's $218 MM ten years ago ($207 MM budget), but he hasn't even broken $20 MM in a movie he's acted in since 2008.

 

The lack of stars may help the budget, but it'll most likely hurt the box office.

 

But I feel really good about that number because of detailed analysis. Not a guesstimate.

 

That was how I figured that: reality based on historic analysis.

 

 

It's a budget guesstimate.

 

 

I was looking at some other numbers... with the exception of Guardians of the Galaxy, and I think we can all agree, this won't come anywhere near that movie... no other Superhero movie released in August has ever broken $200 MM domestically, and really the only one that's even close to it was Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

[marvelcollector]

It just looks so dull. Reed isn't Reed, Ben isn't Ben...and then Doom shows up and I just shake my head. I watched the international trailer that was just posted and I have zero desire to see it at all. I've been an FF fan for nearly my entire life...37 of my 43 years, and I have zero desire to see it.

 

They're not doing things right here.

 

Pretty much sums up my sentiments as well.

 

This is not the FF.

 

Sheesh, Roger Corman was truer to the spirit of the source material.

 

Sad.

 

 

You're right, it's not FF. It is Ultimate FF.

 

And it looks like it is staying true to the spirit of the source material, and that source material is Ultimate FF.

 

I don't understand people still coming in here saying "this isn't FF", "they screwed the FF up", "this isn't true to the source material".

 

It's based on ULTIMATE FANTASTIC FOUR. If you are going to say it isn't true to the source material, then go read Ultimate FF before you see the movie and then report back.

 

 

 

 

Then it should be titled Ultimate FF.

 

Of course, then they would lose much of the audience familiar with the comics, because most of them couldn't care less about anything with Ultimate in the title, or flat out hate it.

 

Also, seems like a defense used regarding these movies when they do screw it up deviate from the source material is to explain it as being "ultimate". Even when other large parts of the movie are not "ultimate".

Edited May 24, 2015 by marvelcollector

[Chris_Skeleton]

 

Then it should be titled Ultimate FF.

 

Of course, then they would lose much of the audience familiar with the comics, because most of them couldn't care less about anything with Ultimate in the title, or flat out hate it.

 

Also, seems like a defense used regarding these movies when they do screw it up deviate from the source material is to explain it as being "ultimate". Even when other large parts of the movie are not "ultimate".

 

Perhaps it should be titled Ultimate Fantastic Four. I don't disagree with you there. But people need to realize this is true to the source material, but apparently nobody bothers to find out what it is and just automatically start talking about the 616 FF.

 

As for a defense, it's no defense for this. It's not deviating from the source material. This is Ultimate Fantastic Four, and that may possibly have non-ultimate aspects.

 

The FF meet in the Baxter building which has a government funded program for the smartest young minds. It is ran by Dr. Storm, and this is where the FF meet as well as Doom. Richards has been doing experiments regarding other dimensions since he was a child and has been sending items into the N-zone (such as the car that was seen in the trailer). The Baxter building has something that lets them see into the N-zone, but have no way of interacting with it so they have seen all these items has Richards has sent them in. They develop a way to travel to the N-zone and Doom deliberately tampers with it because he is jealous of Richards. They go in, and are then dispersed and affected by what they encountered.

 

That is like the first 6 or so issues of UFF.

 

And that is exactly what we have seen in the trailers.

Edited May 24, 2015 by Chris_Skeleton