Fox Studios' WOLVERINE 3 - LOGAN starring Hugh Jackman (2017) 8 8

[kav]

15 minutes ago, Gatsby771 said:

Curious - what screenplay books would you recommend?

I've read Straczynski's -- but it was published more than 15 years ago and focused primarily on his work for Murder, She Wrote and Babylon 5.

And William Goldman's two books, although the second one (Which Lie Did I Tell?) was better, if only for the hilarious chapter on Ghost and the Darkness.

anything by syd field.  four screenplays is great.  

Good scripts bad scripts.

making a good --script great

writing screenplays that sell

the tools of screenwriting 

how not to write a screenplay

essentials of screenwriting

crafty screenwriting

how to build a great screenplay

and of course joseph campbell's hero's journey

I've read these books over and over-I do not want to write screenplays I am just fascinated by how stories are structured.  And when I watch movies I cant believe the blunders!!!  passive protagonist!!!  No plot-just a series of chases!!!!  Weak antagonist!!  and the worst-EXPOSITIONAL DIALOGUE!!!!   Often in the form of a female computer voice:  "System will self destruct in two minutes unless failsafe engaged by agent resulting in planetwide energy suction which will freeze the planet".....you know-so we'll know.

 

 

 

 

Edited March 10, 2017 by kav

[ComicConnoisseur]

I hope Logan along with Deadpool puts to rest that only Marvel can make great superhero movies.

In fact two of the last three great superhero movies I have seen in about a year where by Fox.

Logan, Deadpool and of course Captain America:Civil War.

[ComicConnoisseur]

6 minutes ago, kav said:

anything by syd field.  four screenplays is great.  

Good scripts bad scripts.

making a good ------script great

writing screenplays that sell

the tools of screenwriting 

how not to write a screenplay

essentials of screenwriting

crafty screenwriting

how to build a great screenplay

and of course joseph campbell's hero's journey

I've read these books over and over-I do not want to write screenplays I am just fascinated by how stories are structured.  And when I watch movies I cant believe the blunders!!!  passive protagonist!!!  No plot-just a series of chases!!!!  Weak antagonist!!  and the worst-EXPOSITIONAL DIALOGUE!!!!   Often in the form of a female computer voice:  "System will self destruct in two minutes unless failsafe engaged by agent resulting in planetwide energy suction which will freeze the planet".....you know-so we'll know.

 

 

 

 

I am going to check those books out. I am into stuff like that. 

Edited March 10, 2017 by ComicConnoisseur

[kav]

41 minutes ago, Bosco685 said:

 

But it goes the other way as well. There are quite a few people loving this movie. Fanatical over it. Trying to explain to them how a proper --script should be structured to make it 'movie-perfect' is most probably not going to swing their view to the negative. They go and enjoy the film, without structuring their experience the way you have done to validate this was done in the most professional filming style. Nothing is wrong with the thoughts either way.

 

It just seems that if I point out wait-this movie is just a series of chases-bad guys catch em, they kill a bunch, escape, repeat....people would go wow-you know-that's right-it is just a series of chases, not an actual story.

And the worst movies on record like the awful 'Paycheck' are the 'series of bad guys chasing em they get away' movies....

[kav]

2 minutes ago, ComicConnoisseur said:

I am going to check those books out. I am into stuff like that. 

get four screenplays first. he analyzes terminator 2 and silence of the lambs.  very perceptive.  Both are found father figure movies.  

[ComicConnoisseur]

Just now, kav said:

get four screenplays first. he analyzes terminator 2 and silence of the lambs.  very perceptive.  Both are found father figure movies.  

Will do. Both those movies I like btw.

 

[kav]

17 minutes ago, ComicConnoisseur said:

Will do. Both those movies I like btw.

 

He explains why we like them-and it is because they are structured perfectly using all the rules of screenplay writing in every book on screenplays.  It is not rocket science.  Not saying its easy to write a screenplay but it is very easy to detect why a bad screenplay is bad.

One example-they filmed an entire scene where john and sarah remove the terminator's chip so they can put it in write mode so he can learn, to explain why a robot begins to act human.  James cameron realized, we don't need any of that all we need is the line' the more contact I have with humans, the more I learn'.  You have to cut out absolutely everything that is not necessary.  Every single scene, line, look, must accomplish some goal of the plot.  Think about it-after the first bad guys catch em scene in Logan, what did all the other exact same scenes accomplish to further a plot?  Nothing.  The bad guys are chasing them-we already know that.  Now if each time they caught them there was a major plot point learned, and the characters began to act instead of react, that would be different.  

Edited March 10, 2017 by kav

[Bosco685]

1 hour ago, kav said:

It just seems that if I point out wait-this movie is just a series of chases-bad guys catch em, they kill a bunch, escape, repeat....people would go wow-you know-that's right-it is just a series of chases, not an actual story.

And the worst movies on record like the awful 'Paycheck' are the 'series of bad guys chasing em they get away' movies....

Or folks won't see your viewpoint on this. And that is always a possibility.

It's when people keep coming back to a thread to counter any positive comments that it starts to go down a different path. Not that this is what you are doing. You are still in Step 2 of the Movie Dissatisfaction Process.

Now, do you take the 3a path or the 3b path. That's the big decision.

Edited March 10, 2017 by Bosco685

[Bosco685]

1 hour ago, kav said:

He explains why we like them-and it is because they are structured perfectly using all the rules of screenplay writing in every book on screenplays.  It is not rocket science.  Not saying its easy to write a screenplay but it is very easy to detect why a bad screenplay is bad.

One example-they filmed an entire scene where john and sarah remove the terminator's chip so they can put it in write mode so he can learn, to explain why a robot begins to act human.  James cameron realized, we don't need any of that all we need is the line' the more contact I have with humans, the more I learn'.  You have to cut out absolutely everything that is not necessary.  Every single scene, line, look, must accomplish some goal of the plot.  Think about it-after the first bad guys catch em scene in Logan, what did all the other exact same scenes accomplish to further a plot?  Nothing.  The bad guys are chasing them-we already know that.  Now if each time they caught them there was a major plot point learned, and the characters began to act instead of react, that would be different.  

Are you meaning after the first time the Reavers come in contact with Logan and Professor Xavier to find X-23, or when they caught them which then leads to Logan and Xavier's escape?

I took it as they were relentless to have X-23 and the other children back in their control. But maybe I wasn't digging deep enough into the plot. What should they have done?

[kav]

9 minutes ago, Bosco685 said:

Are you meaning after the first time the Reavers come in contact with Logan and Professor Xavier to find X-23, or when they caught them which then leads to Logan and Xavier's escape?

I took it as they were relentless to have X-23 and the other children back in their control. But maybe I wasn't digging deep enough into the plot. What should they have done?

One thing I would have done if I was one of those guys is say hey boss-we cant hurt him and he's killing us like crazy-I quit.  

[Gatsby77]

Yeah - but I'm not sure that each fight with the Reavers didn't advance the plot.

As a road buddy movie, I was reminded of Thelma and Louise -- mostly because the character arcs were similar.

In Logan, both Logan and Professor X started with little to live for, and then found that will, and redemption, through Laura & trying to get her across the border while being relentlessly pursued by the Reavers.

In Thelma and Louise, a trapped housewife and bored waitress found redemption, and a life's purpose, through trying to get across the border while being relentlessly pursued by an FBI agent.

Point is, you can argue that the action scenes in both films were repetitive and didn't each specifically advance the plot.

But the key is in both films the cumulative effect of those scenes led to the protagonists' ultimate character changes.

For instance,

Spoiler

the two scenes with X-24. The inital outdoor fight let us know that not even the Reavers could control him. And set us up for the inevitable showdown in the finale. We knew that no matter what other challenges Logan faced, it wasn't over until he once again faced X-24. 

Further, as in Jurassic World, where we knew that the velociraptors alone couldn't defeat the uber-dinosaur, here we knew that Logan alone wouldn't be able to defeat X-24.

 

[Bosco685]

14 minutes ago, kav said:

One thing I would have done if I was one of those guys is say hey boss-we cant hurt him and he's killing us like crazy-I quit.  

 

[Beige]

Too much arty overthinking here.

 

Logan was a brilliant movie, about friendship love and hope.

 

Violent, yes, but necessary.

Saw it last night in Melbourne CBD - 7 sittings - 6 were sold out, so we took the VMAX late night show - still half full.

At the end, the audience just sat silently, even when the lights came up - you could see that everyone there got it.

The turning of the cross was just the perfect end.

Great great movie.

Just go see it your self and make your own mind up.

 

Patrick Stewart (Chuck!!) was brilliant, but kudos to X-23, she scared the krap out of me on more than one occasion.

 

Just go see it.

[Logan510]

I heard an ad on the radio for the movie during my morning commute that stated "Logan, the comic book movie that transcends the genre".

 

 

[Bosco685]

3 hours ago, Logan510 said:

I heard an ad on the radio for the movie during my morning commute that stated "Logan, the comic book movie that transcends the genre".

 

 

Have you had a chance to watch it? It may surprise you. In a good way.

[r100comics]

This is epic, one of the best superhero movies ever made, and I'd be amazed if it doesn't receive Oscar noms.

Loved the parallels with Shane and made me sad to see Jack Palance on screen again.

Can you imagine how good, an actor of his caliber would have been playing the villain in one of these movies.....

I had to Youtube his one-armed press ups at the Oscars when I got back as a tribute.

[Logan510]

12 hours ago, Bosco685 said:

Have you had a chance to watch it? It may surprise you. In a good way.

No, I haven't seen it. My comment and facepalm were not meant as a comment on the quality of the movie 

[Bosco685]

1 hour ago, Logan510 said:

No, I haven't seen it. My comment and facepalm were not meant as a comment on the quality of the movie 

I thought you were doing that because of the marketing message - not the movie. But this may be the movie you have been waiting for. Most savage Wolverine portrayal yet.

[Logan510]

12 minutes ago, Bosco685 said:

I thought you were doing that because of the marketing message - not the movie. But this may be the movie you have been waiting for. Most savage Wolverine portrayal yet.

So, would this be more the Epic Comics version or the MAX comics version of Wolverine?

[kav]

He didn't come across as savage to me -mostly a sickly whiner and running away all the time.

Edited March 12, 2017 by kav