Record Breaking Coverless Copies? 0

[sfcityduck]

Here's a thought experiment:

What price for each of these -

* coverless Action 1 in VG

* cover of Action 1 in VG

* married cover with coverless Action 1 in VG

[Wayne-Tec]

9 hours ago, Jaydogrules said:

Oh yes no doubt.  And the price that the coverless Cap 1 just went for only a plus or minus $500 what another coverless copy went for earlier this year.   

-J.

Cap #1, to me, is one of the most desirable GA books to own coverless. Like Action #1, the splash page kicks off the origin and first appearance of the character. Joe Simon's Captain America on the splash page (correct me if I'm mistaken) predates Kirby's classic cover. Like Action #1, of course you'd prefer to have the cover, but the book is chock full of content which enhances the desirability.

Edited September 14, 2017 by Wayne-Tec

[Wayne-Tec]

7 hours ago, sfcityduck said:

Here's a thought experiment:

What price for each of these -

* coverless Action 1 in VG

* cover of Action 1 in VG

* married cover with coverless Action 1 in VG

I could see the two parts individually, potentially selling for more than they would together.

Completing a copy is an incredible achievement, but what is sometimes overlooked are the collectors who buy coverless books, loose covers, wraps or pages, not necessarily to "complete" a copy but because that's entry-level for the biggest books.

In the same way that we have seen record prices for 0.5's or 1.0's as "entry-level" copies, books like Action #1 have pulled out of range for 99.9% of collectors. Some swing for the fence for coverless copies knowing they'll never find a cover or be able to afford a cover in the rare event one ever surfaced.

For the best of the best, you treasure whatever parts you can acquire. Complete copies of far less significant/desirable books are nice, but there are only so many true "holy grail" type books.

[rjpb]

On 9/13/2017 at 1:51 PM, sfcityduck said:

Here's a thought experiment:

What price for each of these -

* coverless Action 1 in VG

* cover of Action 1 in VG

* married cover with coverless Action 1 in VG

 Coverless Action 1 in VG  12 -15% of unrestored VG FMV

Cover of Action 1 in VG     20 -25% of unrestored VG FMV

Married cover with coverless Action 1 in VG  50-60% of unrestored FMV

[zen514]

On 2017-09-12 at 3:43 PM, Wayne-Tec said:

I think the coverless Cap #1 in the CC auction will sell for 12-15K.

There is also a coverless Superman #1 in the same auction, already up to 13K. I wouldn't be surprised to see that one sell for anywhere between 20-30K.

 

The Superman 1 ended at 14.2k. A steal since the unerestored 1.0 sold for 110k and the restored one Sold for 150k at the same auction.  i see it being worth  25-30k . A great stal for a complete Superman 1 coverless unrestored.

[Robot Man]

On 9/13/2017 at 8:54 PM, Wayne-Tec said:

Cap #1, to me, is one of the most desirable GA books to own coverless. Like Action #1, the splash page kicks off the origin and first appearance of the character. Joe Simon's Captain America on the splash page (correct me if I'm mistaken) predates Kirby's classic cover. Like Action #1, of course you'd prefer to have the cover, but the book is chock full of content which enhances the desirability.

I would agree but I have to throw Batman #1 in there. What a book. Origin of the Batman, First Joker and first Catwoman. Just packed with great material. If I mention to my non collecting friends that I have a coverless copy, their first question is "What is it worth? Can't be much without a cover" When I tell them, they can't believe it. They have no idea what Action #1 or Detective #27 are until I tell them but they all know what a Superman or Batman #1 are. Has always been one of the biggest "holy grail" books.

[Wayne-Tec]

14 minutes ago, Robot Man said:

I would agree but I have to throw Batman #1 in there. What a book. Origin of the Batman, First Joker and first Catwoman. Just packed with great material. If I mention to my non collecting friends that I have a coverless copy, their first question is "What is it worth? Can't be much without a cover" When I tell them, they can't believe it. They have no idea what Action #1 or Detective #27 are until I tell them but they all know what a Superman or Batman #1 are. Has always been one of the biggest "holy grail" books.

You can't top the 1st appearances of Superman and Batman, but from a first page to last perspective, no Golden Age books have more historically significant content than Captain America Comics #1 and Batman #1. It's unbelievable that so much relevant, withstanding the test of time content made its way into both two of those books.

 

Captain America Comics #1

-1st app. of Captain America

-Origin of Captain America

-1st cover app. of Captain America (classic cover)

-1st app. of the Red Skull

-1st app. of Bucky Barnes (later to become the Winter Soldier)

 

Batman #1

-1st and 2nd app. of the Joker

-1st app. of Catwoman

-2nd app. of Hugo Strange (final pre-Robin story)

-3rd app. of Robin

-Classic cover

[rjpb]

5 hours ago, Wayne-Tec said:

You can't top the 1st appearances of Superman and Batman, but from a first page to last perspective, no Golden Age books have more historically significant content than Captain America Comics #1 and Batman #1. It's unbelievable that so much relevant, withstanding the test of time content made its way into both two of those books.

 

Captain America Comics #1

-1st app. of Captain America

-Origin of Captain America

-1st cover app. of Captain America (classic cover)

-1st app. of the Red Skull

-1st app. of Bucky Barnes (later to become the Winter Soldier)

 

Batman #1

-1st and 2nd app. of the Joker

-1st app. of Catwoman

-2nd app. of Hugo Strange (final pre-Robin story)

-3rd app. of Robin

-Classic cover

I would agree that both these books are chock full of cool stuff that would make them exceptional first issues of a run, even if the characters weren't as significant. I'd also mention that Captain America #1 has the first Hitler cover in comics. I'd also argue that Batman #1 has a simple iconic cover deliberately meant to recall Detective #27, but I don't know that it's "classic". The measure being that if it were the cover to Batman #7 would it be a breakout book? On the other hand a Kirby cover of Cap punching Hitler would be in demand no matter what issue it was on.

[Wayne-Tec]

25 minutes ago, rjpb said:

I would agree that both these books are chock full of cool stuff that would make them exceptional first issues of a run, even if the characters weren't as significant. I'd also mention that Captain America #1 has the first Hitler cover in comics. I'd also argue that Batman #1 has a simple iconic cover deliberately meant to recall Detective #27, but I don't know that it's "classic". The measure being that if it were the cover to Batman #7 would it be a breakout book? On the other hand a Kirby cover of Cap punching Hitler would be in demand no matter what issue it was on.

I do not believe Cap #1 is the first Hitler cover in comics, although it is the first Hitler cover in the Timely (Marvel) universe.

Without question, Cap #1's cover personifies the meaning of "classic cover." But to me, "classic" is not always defined by the quality of artwork. To me, Detective Comics #27 is a more classic cover than Detective Comics #31. Most would likely beg to differ. But the historical significance of certain books, like Detective Comics #27 and Batman #1, elevate the status of their covers. If I can do to the mall and buy a Batman #1 t-shirt, the fact that something published over 75 years ago is alive today makes it classic.

[Robot Man]

I wouldn't call either cover "classic". "Iconic" maybe on both. The first thing you see when you open a Bat#1 is "The legend of the Batman and how he came to be". Really starts the book and the series right. 

[Wayne-Tec]

4 minutes ago, Robot Man said:

I wouldn't call either cover "classic". "Iconic" maybe on both. The first thing you see when you open a Bat#1 is "The legend of the Batman and how he came to be". Really starts the book and the series right. 

If the cover of Cap #1 doesn't warrant the "classic" label, I don't know what book does.

[Robot Man]

9 minutes ago, Wayne-Tec said:

If the cover of Cap #1 doesn't warrant the "classic" label, I don't know what book does.

Oh, I would say so on that one. Not so much on Tec27 or Bat 1 though.

[Wayne-Tec]

Just now, Robot Man said:

Oh, I would say so on that one. Not so much on Tec27 or Bat 1 though.

Oh, I misread your post. But for the reasons I stated above, I consider Tec #27 and Batman #1 to be classic covers. But I definitely get where you're coming from.

[rjpb]

18 minutes ago, Wayne-Tec said:

I do not believe Cap #1 is the first Hitler cover in comics, although it is the first Hitler cover in the Timely (Marvel) universe.

 

Hitler appeared in comics earlier than that, but I'm not aware of any earlier cover appearance.

[Robot Man]

1 minute ago, Wayne-Tec said:

Oh, I misread your post. But for the reasons I stated above, I consider Tec #27 and Batman #1 to be classic covers. But I definitely get where you're coming from.

I would give Action 1 classic status though!

[LDarkseid1]

I bought this Coverless Superman 1 from a dealer at comic con this past year. Through partial trade/cash it cost me about $8K. It's missing the cover, 1st wrap, 2nd wrap and centerfold, but I'm pretty happy. Pages are pretty solid.

[Robot Man]

Wow, 8 grand for a copy missing cover, two wraps and the centerfold. Not much left to play with. If it had the wraps or centerfold it would be usuable for parts. In this shape, its one of those books people "page out" and have slabbed. And a page like this one with not even one page featuring Superman, who would even want it? I can see the Action #1 page that Comicdonna had with Superman throwing the car. That is iconic. But without the Man of Steel, it looks like just an average boring GA early DC page.

[Wayne-Tec]

17 hours ago, LDarkseid1 said:

I bought this Coverless Superman 1 from a dealer at comic con this past year. Through partial trade/cash it cost me about $8K. It's missing the cover, 1st wrap, 2nd wrap and centerfold, but I'm pretty happy. Pages are pretty solid.

Sans the cover and the 3 wraps listed, 29 of 33 wraps remain (including the cover as a wrap), which means 87.8% of the book is all there. Even without a dynamic Superman page to display, lots of great stuff is still there. A Tec #27 minus all Batman parts sold for something like $22,000 and what was displayed through the slab was a color copy cover.

All copies of Superman #1 are to be cherished. It's the No. 3 book in our hobby out of seemingly limitless comic books published over the past 75+ years.

I don't know if you have other pages that are loose, but I can tell you that in the picture you posted, the reprinted Action #3 story is displayed. There were well more than 2 wraps before the one on display. I'd do a page-count of all the parts you have to make sure you know what you have.

Edited September 19, 2017 by Wayne-Tec

[LDarkseid1]

2 hours ago, Wayne-Tec said:

Sans the cover and the 3 wraps listed, 29 of 33 wraps remain (including the cover as a wrap), which means 87.8% of the book is all there. Even without a dynamic Superman page to display, lots of great stuff is still there. A Tec #27 minus all Batman parts sold for something like $22,000 and what was displayed through the slab was a color copy cover.

All copies of Superman #1 are to be cherished. It's the No. 3 book in our hobby out of seemingly limitless comic books published over the past 75+ years.

I don't know if you have other pages that are loose, but I can tell you that in the picture you posted, the reprinted Action #3 story is displayed. There were well more than 2 wraps before the one on display. I'd do a page-count of all the parts you have to make sure you know what you have.

Here are the exact pages of story/ads I'm missing and the 15th wrap is detached. My copy is kind of weird because it was folded inside out. So everything minus the 15th wrap is attached, but the stories are essentially in the wrong order. I've thought about seeing if CCS can fix it, but we'll see.

Edited September 19, 2017 by LDarkseid1

[Wayne-Tec]

1 hour ago, LDarkseid1 said:

Here are the exact pages of story/ads I'm missing and the 15th wrap is detached. My copy is kind of weird because it was folded inside out. So everything minus the 15th wrap is attached, but the stories are essentially in the wrong order. I've thought about seeing if CCS can fix it, but we'll see.

The reproduced pages above are Wrap 1 (page 1 & 32), Wrap 2 (page 2 & 31) and the centerfold (page 16 & 17). I believe those page numbers are correct. I'm not sure exactly how your book looks inside and out, but if there were a way to get the wraps in the proper order, that would be great. I do not know of such rearrangement would warrant a green or purple label. Nevertheless, I think you have one awesome book. A "complete" coverless copy with lesser PQ just sold for 14K so I don't think 8K for a copy less three wraps is out of bounds.