Ocasio-Cortez Comic
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Do you know what constitutes a headline at this level?

A phone call from Jim Lee calling DDP HQ asking him to pull his inventory 

Thats it

Theres your cease and desist 

Theres no lawyers involved, no lawsuit, no propaganda, no Russian collision, no Coup d'etat

 

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35 minutes ago, Aweandlorder said:

Do you know what constitutes a headline at this level?

A phone call from Jim Lee calling DDP HQ asking him to pull his inventory 

Thats it

Theres your cease and desist 

Theres no lawyers involved, no lawsuit, no propaganda, no Russian collision, no Coup d'etat

 

Without the cease and desist, there's no headline. So it's silly to suggest that it's a headline that pushing thing.

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Just now, GeeksAreMyPeeps said:

Without the cease and desist, there's no headline. So it's silly to suggest that it's a headline that pushing thing.

There is no cease and desist. The comic is readily available for thousands of dollars online. No one is stopping this from retailing

Theres your proof

Capture.JPG

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10 hours ago, Aweandlorder said:

There is no cease and desist. The comic is readily available for thousands of dollars online. No one is stopping this from retailing

Theres your proof

Capture.JPG

Just because people aren't complying doesn't mean there wasn't a warning issued.

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On 5/26/2019 at 3:18 PM, Aweandlorder said:

The cop-out answer would be I don't know. However, I'm gonna guarantee you it will be a sought out book because there was a tremendous effort to make this a hit. When this book came out I received notices from many comic book stores, one who I know for a fact were paid by devils due to promote it. It was all over fb and many blogs. People were hyping it massively. 

Think about what we're talking about here for a second it's a comic book about a politician, with no emphasis on story, art and with no key significance. 

Yet it was promoted up the wazoo. 

There were massive money's poured on to this obscure title. For no other reason than to push a political narrative. 

There are many other political figure books, most of which are published by Bluewater Comics, which are as obscure as this comic should've been had it not been promoted and then marketed cleverly by the publisher

There's a stunning amount of not-good-thinking-ness going on here, so let's take some time to unpack it.

"I don't know" isn't the cop-out answer to whether the book will hold its value, it's the only honest answer.

As for there being a tremendous effort to make it a hit--also true of tons of comic books that are not sought out. Some companies even have marketing departments to market their comic books.

I love that you say "I know for a fact" that stores were paid by the publisher to promote their comic book and treat it like a conspiracy. Did you know McDonald's pays TV stations to air their ads? I know that FOR A FACT! #Busted. 

Your notion that those who disagree with you should "Think about what we're talking about here for a second" is condescending but also hilarious. Your suggestion is that it SHOULD be a failure because it doesn't emphasize story or art or key significance. In other words, it lacks the very attributes that make comic books succeed--among the ALMOST INSIGIFICANT number of people who care about comic book stories, art, and key significance. Instead, all this comic book has is its celebration in print form of a politician who is massively popular with millions of people. And yet, despite its failure to reach a niche audience and its potential to reach a mass audience, it was promoted anyway. HMMM!! Suspicious, I tells ya!

The book wasn't marketed or promoted cleverly. No one was talking about it until DC was reported to have sent a cease-and-desist. You have no proof that Devil's Due somehow engineered this happening and yet you freely imply it. You also hint darkly that it's being done to promote a political agenda. The outlets that pushed this the hardest were Fox News and the NY Post. Are the comic's creators clearly sympathetic to AOC? Sure. Are they being bankrolled by George Soros? You have zip evidence to even imply anything close to that, but there you are.

This is a pretty simple story. A small comic book publisher did a bunch of variants of a comic the comic book community didn't care much about. One store--in THE BRONX--did a cover that was VERY well done, that was too close to a MASSIVELY popular pop-culture icon. The confluence of politics, pop culture, and the conflict (media love conflict) of DC opposing the cover--combined with the supposition that the cease-and-desist would limit an already small supply--stimulated heavy interest in MULTIPLE collector communities and constituencies (comics, politics, Latina culture, feminism, etc.) who would naturally feel justified paying high prices since the item's status as a limited-edition collectible had been attested to in mass media.

And, yes, other variants went up, too... AFTER some of those outlets issued confusing reports that weren't clear about WHICH cover was limited--AND some sellers began capitalizing (purposely or unwittingly) on the confusion by marketing some of the variants that seemed vaguely Wonder Woman-ish and/or had appeared in those confusing media reports... leading to a spike of interest (already abating) in some of the wrong variants.

To the vast majority of Americans, the going price of THIS limited comic is FAR more understandable than the going price for, say, a J. Scott Campbell variant or a low-print Spawn variant. 

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36 minutes ago, JTLarsen said:

There's a stunning amount of not-good-thinking-ness going on here, so let's take some time to unpack it.

"I don't know" isn't the cop-out answer to whether the book will hold its value, it's the only honest answer.

As for there being a tremendous effort to make it a hit--also true of tons of comic books that are not sought out. Some companies even have marketing departments to market their comic books.

I love that you say "I know for a fact" that stores were paid by the publisher to promote their comic book and treat it like a conspiracy. Did you know McDonald's pays TV stations to air their ads? I know that FOR A FACT! #Busted. 

Your notion that those who disagree with you should "Think about what we're talking about here for a second" is condescending but also hilarious. Your suggestion is that it SHOULD be a failure because it doesn't emphasize story or art or key significance. In other words, it lacks the very attributes that make comic books succeed--among the ALMOST INSIGIFICANT number of people who care about comic book stories, art, and key significance. Instead, all this comic book has is its celebration in print form of a politician who is massively popular with millions of people. And yet, despite its failure to reach a niche audience and its potential to reach a mass audience, it was promoted anyway. HMMM!! Suspicious, I tells ya!

The book wasn't marketed or promoted cleverly. No one was talking about it until DC was reported to have sent a cease-and-desist. You have no proof that Devil's Due somehow engineered this happening and yet you freely imply it. You also hint darkly that it's being done to promote a political agenda. The outlets that pushed this the hardest were Fox News and the NY Post. Are the comic's creators clearly sympathetic to AOC? Sure. Are they being bankrolled by George Soros? You have zip evidence to even imply anything close to that, but there you are.

This is a pretty simple story. A small comic book publisher did a bunch of variants of a comic the comic book community didn't care much about. One store--in THE BRONX--did a cover that was VERY well done, that was too close to a MASSIVELY popular pop-culture icon. The confluence of politics, pop culture, and the conflict (media love conflict) of DC opposing the cover--combined with the supposition that the cease-and-desist would limit an already small supply--stimulated heavy interest in MULTIPLE collector communities and constituencies (comics, politics, Latina culture, feminism, etc.) who would naturally feel justified paying high prices since the item's status as a limited-edition collectible had been attested to in mass media.

And, yes, other variants went up, too... AFTER some of those outlets issued confusing reports that weren't clear about WHICH cover was limited--AND some sellers began capitalizing (purposely or unwittingly) on the confusion by marketing some of the variants that seemed vaguely Wonder Woman-ish and/or had appeared in those confusing media reports... leading to a spike of interest (already abating) in some of the wrong variants.

To the vast majority of Americans, the going price of THIS limited comic is FAR more understandable than the going price for, say, a J. Scott Campbell variant or a low-print Spawn variant. 

I'll reply to you with a simple reply since most of the effort you put into discussing my conclusions are nothing but a lot of wind with no grounds. 

We all believe in what we believe

I believe that an over inflated book spiked due to NOTHING but a headline is shilled. Emphasis on the word OVER INFLATED. Not HEADLINE. There's no conspiracy in that statement. This is business as usual in our market. 

You dont.

It just so happens to be that this time it's directly involving a politician. 

Not a popular TV show/movie. Not a popular writer/ artist. Heck, there wasn't eve a pe*is involved with this one

And that my friend is the beginning of the end. 

Think about what you just allowed to happen here, think about what you accepted as a reality in our hobby. That will set the ground for another big tear in our already suffering industry. And it's because people like you allow it to exist 

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And once again for all of those who BELIEVE otherwise: 

THERE IS NO CEASE AND DESIST ON THIS BOOK 

The book is readily available to purchase on eBay

Until this has changed this is the only piece of news you need to relate to

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17 hours ago, Jimmy Linguini said:

I guess I have to disagree with your assertion that shes relatively unknown.
 

Agreed. I don't know why the runup in prices is so baffling or so troubling; she's as well-known as any celebrity. The idea that lobbyists would be pouring money into promoting an obscure comic book in a nefarious plot to promote AOC or "push her agenda" suggests a limited familiarity with, well, almost anything in this sentence.
 

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On 5/26/2019 at 3:18 PM, Aweandlorder said:

The cop-out answer would be I don't know. However, I'm gonna guarantee you it will be a sought out book because there was a tremendous effort to make this a hit. When this book came out I received notices from many comic book stores, one who I know for a fact were paid by devils due to promote it. It was all over fb and many blogs. People were hyping it massively. 

Think about what we're talking about here for a second it's a comic book about a politician, with no emphasis on story, art and with no key significance. 

Yet it was promoted up the wazoo. 

There were massive money's poured on to this obscure title. For no other reason than to push a political narrative. 

There are many other political figure books, most of which are published by Bluewater Comics, which are as obscure as this comic should've been had it not been promoted and then marketed cleverly by the publisher

 

33 minutes ago, Aweandlorder said:

And once again for all of those who BELIEVE otherwise: 

THERE IS NO CEASE AND DESIST ON THIS BOOK 

The book is readily available to purchase on eBay

Until this has changed this is the only piece of news you need to relate to

Your willingness to just assert things as fact without any basis is kind of amazing/terrifying.

Just because DC hasn't unleashed the lawyers to pro-actively quash any sales doesn't mean they never issued a cease-and-desist letter. One news/gossip outlet reported that DC did just that. DC HAS NOT DENIED IT.

You've cited ZERO proof that DC sent NO cease-and-desist letters. If you have that proof, please share it. Otherwise, the statement that "THERE IS NO CEASE AND DESIST ON THIS BOOK" is utterly baseless. Maybe it wasn't sent to EVERYONE. Maybe DC hasn't bothered to follow it up with legal action. Maybe, just maybe the cease-and-desist was pro forma so they can cite it in future copyright battles. But you have literally NO source to claim that DC issued NO cease and desist. I will admit, of course, that you putting it in all caps sure feels impressive, though. So, I guess if font size is the new substitute for facts, you've proved your point. 

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44 minutes ago, Aweandlorder said:

I'll reply to you with a simple reply since most of the effort you put into discussing my conclusions are nothing but a lot of wind with no grounds. 

We all believe in what we believe

I believe that an over inflated book spiked due to NOTHING but a headline is shilled. Emphasis on the word OVER INFLATED. Not HEADLINE. There's no conspiracy in that statement. This is business as usual in our market. 

You dont.

It just so happens to be that this time it's directly involving a politician. 

Not a popular TV show/movie. Not a popular writer/ artist. Heck, there wasn't eve a pe*is involved with this one

And that my friend is the beginning of the end. 

Think about what you just allowed to happen here, think about what you accepted as a reality in our hobby. That will set the ground for another big tear in our already suffering industry. And it's because people like you allow it to exist 

My grounds? For what? If you're disputing the factuality of something I'm saying, share with the class. What have I said that's untrue?

Your proof that the book is shilled rests on the following:

- The book is over inflated. That's a subjective opinion.

- It spiked to to nothing. Sorry, "NOTHING." Again, subjective. I and others have laid out multiple reasons OTHER PEOPLE might have for the price spike.

Your belief in the subjective opinion of over-inflation, and your groundless ignoring of the fact that OTHER PEOPLE have genuine reasons to want this book... do not constitute proof that it's been shilled. Shilling is a pretty well-defined phenomenon that others on this site have proven adept at documenting. Try that.

Your claim that I just killed the hobby, I think, does more to undercut your credibility than anything here. So, thanks.

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For anyone not sure whether Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez is famous:

Associated Press: https://www.apnews.com/cfbdab50d2be4ba9bc9bcf499dbb85fe

USA Today: https://www.google.com/search?q=fox+news+ocasio-cortez+hours&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS824US824&oq=fox+news+ocasio-cortez+hours&aqs=chrome..69i57j69i64.5543j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

Here's Fox News' AOC coverage. You'll note that lately they're averaging one new AOC story EVERY DAY: https://www.foxnews.com/category/person/alexandria-ocasio-cortez

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13 minutes ago, JTLarsen said:

 

Your willingness to just assert things as fact without any basis is kind of amazing/terrifying.

Just because DC hasn't unleashed the lawyers to pro-actively quash any sales doesn't mean they never issued a cease-and-desist letter. One news/gossip outlet reported that DC did just that. DC HAS NOT DENIED IT.

You've cited ZERO proof that DC sent NO cease-and-desist letters. If you have that proof, please share it. Otherwise, the statement that "THERE IS NO CEASE AND DESIST ON THIS BOOK" is utterly baseless. Maybe it wasn't sent to EVERYONE. Maybe DC hasn't bothered to follow it up with legal action. Maybe, just maybe the cease-and-desist was pro forma so they can cite it in future copyright battles. But you have literally NO source to claim that DC issued NO cease and desist. I will admit, of course, that you putting it in all caps sure feels impressive, though. So, I guess if font size is the new substitute for facts, you've proved your point. 

The proof is the book has not been issued a cease & desist warning by DC to sellers as the news has claimed. 

The proof is that the book is readily available by tens of vendors with no interruption by DC as article has claimed on eBay  

I'm just like you now. Reading the news and taking at face value without getting into details. 

How arrogant of me!

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9 minutes ago, JTLarsen said:

For anyone not sure whether Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez is famous:

Associated Press: https://www.apnews.com/cfbdab50d2be4ba9bc9bcf499dbb85fe

USA Today: https://www.google.com/search?q=fox+news+ocasio-cortez+hours&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS824US824&oq=fox+news+ocasio-cortez+hours&aqs=chrome..69i57j69i64.5543j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

Here's Fox News' AOC coverage. You'll note that lately they're averaging one new AOC story EVERY DAY: https://www.foxnews.com/category/person/alexandria-ocasio-cortez

Are you asserting that her popularity (or lack of) warrants the ridiculous high prices we've experienced on the market as of late with said book?

Or did you just find ground to promote her with this thread

please elaborate 

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17 minutes ago, JTLarsen said:

My grounds? For what? If you're disputing the factuality of something I'm saying, share with the class. What have I said that's untrue?

Your proof that the book is shilled rests on the following:

- The book is over inflated. That's a subjective opinion.

- It spiked to to nothing. Sorry, "NOTHING." Again, subjective. I and others have laid out multiple reasons OTHER PEOPLE might have for the price spike.

Your belief in the subjective opinion of over-inflation, and your groundless ignoring of the fact that OTHER PEOPLE have genuine reasons to want this book... do not constitute proof that it's been shilled. Shilling is a pretty well-defined phenomenon that others on this site have proven adept at documenting. Try that.

Your claim that I just killed the hobby, I think, does more to undercut your credibility than anything here. So, thanks.

Ahh the good old "Me and others vs You" line lol 

A little egotistical to state that don't you think. 

Are you as arrogant with people you meet in real life as well or just with people online 

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Read carefully what I wrote again:

i don't say that my opinions are facts. They're mine to have. You're entitled to yours. 

If you think that I have better things to do than sit here and spoon feed you logical market trends and political wrong doings as they take place in both arenas every day. Guess again. 

So instead, sit back on your high horse and enjoy arguing with yourself about what YOU believe. 

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58 minutes ago, Point Five said:

Agreed. I don't know why the runup in prices is so baffling or so troubling; she's as well-known as any celebrity. The idea that lobbyists would be pouring money into promoting an obscure comic book in a nefarious plot to promote AOC or "push her agenda" suggests a limited familiarity with, well, almost anything in this sentence.
 

She's a politician. Not a celebrity. 

Her campeign is taking the "celebrity" approach to push her political narrative. That's also how she got into comic books.

understanding that, and that alone, will make you realize why a comic book hobbyist like myself will find it outrageous that she is now a "thing" in a market like ours

 

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16 minutes ago, Aweandlorder said:

She's a politician. Not a celebrity.

Um. Have you seen any headlines since 2016?
 

17 minutes ago, Aweandlorder said:

Her campeign is taking the "celebrity" approach to push her political narrative. That's also how she got into comic books. 

She was elected last year and no longer has a campaign. (shrug) If you mean her current staff in Washington, I'm confident they have better things to do than this.
 

19 minutes ago, Aweandlorder said:

understanding that, and that alone, will make you realize why a comic book hobbyist like myself will find it outrageous that she is now a "thing" in a market like ours 

There have been comic books featuring celebrities and politicians as far back as the 1950s. No big deal.

 

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4 minutes ago, Point Five said:

Um. Have you seen any headlines since 2016?
 

She was elected last year and no longer has a campaign. (shrug) If you mean her current staff in Washington, I'm confident they have better things to do than this.
 

There have been comic books featuring celebrities and politicians as far back as the 1950s. No big deal.

 

Lets just agree that your definition of politician is different than mine.

A politician is not, and should never be, considered a celebrity. Im very well aware of the shifts in our political climate in recent years. It allows you to accept that as long as it (hopefully?) feeds your political perspective.

I chose NOT to accept it, once again, because it gets into other mediums.

Yesterday it was music. Today its comic books.

An active politician in congress ALWAYS have active lobbyists. Its a little naive to think that all you need a campaign for is to get elected. If youre doing it right, you ALWAYS have a budget working for you.

And yes, Im sure by now that you think that her paid staff has better things to do. Of course, she has a HOT selling comic book based on its content alone

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My eighteen year old daughter is fascinated by AOC as a politician. I mentioned this comic book to her and prices etc. She said "this is silly, only 50 year old men would think that's worth collecting or a means of promoting herself, she has 4+ million twitter followers alone, she doesn't need a comic book"...so there ya go. One perspective from the young-uns

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