Primetime Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 (edited) 5 hours ago, pemart1966 said: Not only is there vast variation in the registration but there is also vast variation in the colours. Look at the Torch's hair - it seems to range from pink to orange to red. Look at the colours of the lettering. There's a huge range of colours there too. How can that be explained? I can't think of any other book that has this scenario. Some of the variations might be explained by photography but certainly not all of them. Marvel 1s colors are unique in that the cover was printed using process colors (yellow, black, magenta, cyan) instead of the typical primary colors (red, yellow, black, blue). This resulted in a wider chromatic range and the cover resembled a pulp than a comic book. This is no surprise as Goodman was a master pulp publisher in the 1930’s and selected a popular pulp artist (Frank R. Paul) to draw the Marvel 1 cover. Edited September 18, 2019 by Primetime szav, Larryw7 and Get Marwood & I 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Primetime Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, Ameri said: Congrats to Woo Woo and Primetime. #1 and #2 appear the clearest. The wishbone on the cheek seems to move around a lot as Primetime pointed out. Registration problems were rampant with this book and I’m sure it drove Goodman nuts. He switched publishers immediately after the Nov copy was printed to a place on Lord St. in Buffalo, NY. The printing appeared improved but he switched again in late 1940 to Meriden, Conn which is where all his Timleys were published from that point on. The registration on Marvel 1 seems to have most of the problems on the logo, Torch's face/hair, and arms. There must have been an issue with that plate. Edited September 18, 2019 by Primetime Knightsofold and szav 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knightsofold Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 1 hour ago, tth2 said: Whoa, hadn't realized there were so many! CA 1 is the IH 181 of GA! Isn’t Batman #1 the GA key with the most copies in the census? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pemart1966 Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, sfcityduck said: Verzyl family's Mile High copy. But, the photo of the MH copy might be cropped. The corners are super sharp and there seems to be less paper on the top AND bottom than on the 9.4. Not only might it be cropped but it's pretty grainy too. Not really a fair comparison given said photo quality but I get your point. Now what we need is a recent high res photo of the Mile High copy! Edited September 18, 2019 by pemart1966 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfcityduck Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 (edited) 51 minutes ago, Chicago Boy said: Church copy ( I refuse to call it Mile High ) Why? They were called Mile High's when the whole concept of charging a premium for a "pedigree" was first invented by Chuck, and there is no doubt that dealers owe him a huge debt of gratitude for that. Other pedigrees are also named after the stores that discovered them, and most pedigrees don't reference the orginal owner - more likely a purely marketing name ("curator") or place name ("Allentown") designed to hide the OO's identity (and I suspect that is usually the dealer's choice, not the OO's). I think Chuck deserves the credit he gets by the reference to his store in the MH/Edgar Church books. Edited September 18, 2019 by sfcityduck Badger and AJD 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pemart1966 Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 22 minutes ago, Primetime said: No and interesting that cgc does not even change the 11/39 date on their labels to 10/39 for October copies. Chicago Boy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crowzilla Posted September 18, 2019 Author Share Posted September 18, 2019 25 minutes ago, Knightsofold said: Isn’t Batman #1 the GA key with the most copies in the census? Yes, but only 3 universal copies graded 9.0 or higher. It's interesting, Batman #1 has 118 universal copies, but 60 of them (51%) are 2.5 or lower. A very strong rate for such a common book. Captain America has 20 out of 83 universal copies at 2.5 or lower, while Superman #1 has 39 out of 60 universal copies at 2.5 or lower. Gotham Kid 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gotham Kid Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 20 minutes ago, Crowzilla said: Yes, but only 3 universal copies graded 9.0 or higher. It's interesting, Batman #1 has 118 universal copies, but 60 of them (51%) are 2.5 or lower. A very strong rate for such a common book. Captain America has 20 out of 83 universal copies at 2.5 or lower, while Superman #1 has 39 out of 60 universal copies at 2.5 or lower. Interesting data Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Robot Man Posted September 18, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted September 18, 2019 49 minutes ago, sfcityduck said: Why? They were called Mile High's when the whole concept of charging a premium for a "pedigree" was first invented by Chuck, and there is no doubt that dealers owe him a huge debt of gratitude for that. Other pedigrees are also named after the stores that discovered them, and most pedigrees don't reference the orginal owner - more likely a purely marketing name ("curator") or place name ("Allentown") designed to hide the OO's identity (and I suspect that is usually the dealer's choice, not the OO's). I think Chuck deserves the credit he gets by the reference to his store in the MH/Edgar Church books. I’m with you. A lot of people are just jealous of Chuckle’s good fortune. At the time the collection was found and marketed, it was always referred to as the Mile High collection. No one really knew about Edgar Church. One look at one of these books and I didn’t care what they were called. You just knew these were probably the best copies on the planet and history has pretty much proven it in general. At this point, I refer to the collection as the Edgar Church/Mile High collection. Edgar should get top billing for having put it together in the first place and Mile High should get second billing for finding and saving these amazing books for us to marvel at for all this time. If not for lucky Chuck, these books may have never made their way into our collections... Get Marwood & I, Hutch88, porcupine48 and 3 others 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasterChief Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 4 hours ago, Mmehdy said: Has it been determined that this is a new copy or is it grade bump... Are these the same? I cannot validate the certification number for the 9.0 copy. It has been deleted from CGC's database. Marvel Comics #1 (Timely, 1939) CGC VF/NM 9.0 Cream to off-white pages sfcityduck 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfcityduck Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 13 minutes ago, MasterChief said: Are these the same? I cannot validate the certification number for the 9.0 copy. It has been deleted from CGC's database. Marvel Comics #1 (Timely, 1939) CGC VF/NM 9.0 Cream to off-white pages Except for the page quality upgrade, it looks like the answer is "yes" based on the spots on the man in the foreground to the right of the black circle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gotham Kid Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 19 minutes ago, MasterChief said: I cannot validate the certification number for the 9.0 copy. It has been deleted from CGC's database. that definitely clinches it. 9.0 went to 9.4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluechip Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 7 hours ago, telerites said: I must be doing something wrong. Before I posted I looked at the census and did again just now, I only see the a census for issue date of 11/39 and no other listing for a Marvel Comics #1 from 1939. I knew the October would bring a premium, I was just musing how much more of a multiple if a 9.4 came to market. Is there any data on print runs between the two? Thanks all. It will be fun to watch. I love this book and have always since I saw the cover as a kid in the early 70s. Still hasn't lost its appeal to me. The hobby has been hugely inconsistent re book with multiple printings. TMNT #1s show a huge difference in value for first and 2nd printings, but when it comes to books like Marvel 1, Superman 1 and Batman 1, all of which had more than one printing, the attitude of many in the hobby ranges from indifference to determined resistance. It may be as simple as the fact that TMNT 2nd and 3rd printings have words inside that say, very plainly, it's a second or 3rd printing, making it impossible to ignore. Chicago Boy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfcityduck Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 17 minutes ago, Gotham Kid said: that definitely clinches it. 9.0 went to 9.4 Actually, 8.5 c-ow went to 9.0 c-ow and then 9.4 ow: pemart1966, MasterChief, Gotham Kid and 1 other 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gotham Kid Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 4 minutes ago, sfcityduck said: 23 minutes ago, Gotham Kid said: that definitely clinches it. 9.0 went to 9.4 Actually, 8.5 c-ow went to 9.0 c-ow and then 9.4 ow: cue @tth2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crowzilla Posted September 18, 2019 Author Share Posted September 18, 2019 3 minutes ago, Gotham Kid said: cue @tth2 I love this hobby. Now to be fair, the 8.5 does seem extremely tight. But we are back to the "for $5,000 to regrade, the 9.0 I thought I saw, was most certainly a 9.4". Gotham Kid 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
comicartcom Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 4 hours ago, Crowzilla said: Human Torch #1 also has 6 copies in 9.0 or higher. What it is about Timely's that enabled more high grade copies to be preserved than their DC counterparts? Weren't read as much, or better cover stock? Young Allies #1 has an amazing 10 copies in 9.0 universal or better, even All-Flash #1 (one of the most common DC keys from that period) only has 6 copies in 9.0 or better. Timely in this period appear to have more 'sizing' aka, the chemical gloss layer, and a different paper stock than DC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pemart1966 Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, sfcityduck said: Actually, 8.5 c-ow went to 9.0 c-ow and then 9.4 ow: Holy metamorphosis Batman!!!! If you were thinking of bidding on this initially, would this new information alter your thinking? It will be interesting to see whether HA addresses this history in its description. Edited September 18, 2019 by pemart1966 Chicago Boy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfcityduck Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 14 minutes ago, pemart1966 said: Holy metamorphosis Batman!!!! If you were thinking of bidding on this initially, would this new information alter your thinking? It will be interesting to see whether HA address this history in its description. The Action 1 that sold for $3M went 8.0 to 8.5 to 9.0. The Denver CA 1 which is now a 9.4 started, if I recall correctly, as a 9.0. So this is not an isolated instance. Seems like either CGC's grading (and paper quality) standards are declining over time or the pressing techniques are really improving (especially as they can now upgrade PQ). PopKulture and telerites 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago Boy Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 2 hours ago, Knightsofold said: Isn’t Batman #1 the GA key with the most copies in the census? Yes in terms of what most people consider “keys”. Cap 1 is up there though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
