Where do you see the hobby in 25 years 4 4

[kav]

4 hours ago, theCapraAegagrus said:

And how expensive is that art? How many people are collecting it? The 99th percentile. How wealthy is the next generation compared to the old boys club that has most of the rarest "key" comics today?

Paintings from the 15th century are 1-of-a-kind. Comic books are not. Just look at streaming services; People are buying disc less and less. They don't want to own much.

People collect art at all levels.  Not every art collector has Monets.  There are plenty of $500-$1000 art pieces from long ago.  There are second, third, fourth tier artists from the 1500s, 1600s, 1700s, etc.  People also pay for valuable prints.  They are not one of a kind.  Warhol prints are quite valuable.  

[thunsicker]

9 minutes ago, Hollywood1892 said:

What does that have to do with collectibles?

Nobody bought their wedding crashers on dvd thinking it was going to pull in a fortune down the road

So, you're saying most people won't hold onto their copies?  

[Bookery]

56 minutes ago, Myowncollector said:

I see zero chance of changing your thoughts on things, don't think you will believe anything I say so not even going to try. Appreciate your reply though. If there are any long time overstreet advisors or shop owners who you trust and respect and will believe what they tell you, then you can take your ?s to them. 

I didn't know this was a battle to change thoughts per se.  I thought it was about bringing in perspectives and having a conversation.  I have no idea what your last statement even means.  Why would I need to go to a shop owner.  I am a shop owner.  I've been doing this for 40 years... and not just comics but an array of collectibles.  I've written books on the subject.  That doesn't make me right... because this is mostly opinion (save for historical documented trends, which was mostly what I was bringing up and which you made no effort to respond to)... but at least my opinion is formed from decades of experience and observation.  You have a different perspective, fine.  But I don't get the rude and dismissive attitude from someone who's been here less than 2 months.

[Myowncollector]

3 minutes ago, Bookery said:

I am a shop owner.  I've been doing this for 40 years

Nothing rude or dismissive at all. I know you are a shop owner. That is why I didn't want to get into a discussion with you. What could I possibly say to make you think otherwise.  Don't want you think otherwise. You can feel however you want about whatever you want. I appreciated the reply but I haven't heard of anyone else having your view points. Not a single person. Especially on the movies. I thought everyone who collects comics and keeps tabs on the price knows movies effect their value. Different people and areas so I believe you. Just every shop owner and dealer I know says every year that they keep thinking it is time for the bubble to burst yet every year is the best year they ever had. This year will probably be different to say the least. Friend had a shop next to a movie theater. Soon as movie ended people would come over and buy iron man comics or whatever movie just ended. After heath ledger joker, sold out anything joker from any age. 2012 I seen every single one of my mega keys double in value with the avengers movie. I had many c and d list characters books thst nobody cared about increase crazy amounts because of a tv or movie. So you have had different results, fair enough. It will never be like the 90s with hot titles selling half a million copies and no book will ever sell over a million copies unless they make it super cheap or something crazy. But the fact that books still sell 30 to 100 k physical copies at $4 and $5 is just as impressive. Who knows what the digital numbers are but the fact people actually pay for them is impressive.

Sure comic collecting became more popular in the 70s and gained each decade after. And yes non key issues don't gain any value. Especially now that there are how many titles released each month all with numerous variants. I am just judging the comic collectible market by comics that are actually collectible. 

That's my viewpoint and that of ever shop owner and dealer I know. Nothing you say will change it. Not being rude. We just have no reason to discuss the topic unless you tell me what I said altered your opinion. But in 2 months I have never seen a single person say oh wow, you was right wa wrong or you opened my eyes. Or any such thing. 

[Myowncollector]

2 hours ago, Bookery said:

When I started all back-issues were considered a premium item.  A comic was released at 75-cents.  Two months later it went into back-stock as an out-of-print item for $1.00

When I started collecting they were 30 cents. Not a competition. I know guys who have been collecting for 5 years and know a ton. Whether 30 40 50 75 cents their was 1 or maybe a couple of each title. There wasn't 7 x-MEN titles and 10 Spider-man with 50 different variant covers and no internet to read the comics for free. Just my reasoning for this. No idea if I am right or not. I know no nothing of the relationship of James bond and mash books sales related to their movies so I can't discuss it. 

[1Cool]

36 minutes ago, Myowncollector said:

Nothing rude or dismissive at all. I know you are a shop owner. That is why I didn't want to get into a discussion with you. What could I possibly say to make you think otherwise.  Don't want you think otherwise. You can feel however you want about whatever you want. I appreciated the reply but I haven't heard of anyone else having your view points. Not a single person. Especially on the movies. I thought everyone who collects comics and keeps tabs on the price knows movies effect their value. Different people and areas so I believe you. Just every shop owner and dealer I know says every year that they keep thinking it is time for the bubble to burst yet every year is the best year they ever had. This year will probably be different to say the least. Friend had a shop next to a movie theater. Soon as movie ended people would come over and buy iron man comics or whatever movie just ended. After heath ledger joker, sold out anything joker from any age. 2012 I seen every single one of my mega keys double in value with the avengers movie. I had many c and d list characters books thst nobody cared about increase crazy amounts because of a tv or movie. So you have had different results, fair enough. It will never be like the 90s with hot titles selling half a million copies and no book will ever sell over a million copies unless they make it super cheap or something crazy. But the fact that books still sell 30 to 100 k physical copies at $4 and $5 is just as impressive. Who knows what the digital numbers are but the fact people actually pay for them is impressive.

Sure comic collecting became more popular in the 70s and gained each decade after. And yes non key issues don't gain any value. Especially now that there are how many titles released each month all with numerous variants. I am just judging the comic collectible market by comics that are actually collectible. 

That's my viewpoint and that of ever shop owner and dealer I know. Nothing you say will change it. Not being rude. We just have no reason to discuss the topic unless you tell me what I said altered your opinion. But in 2 months I have never seen a single person say oh wow, you was right wa wrong or you opened my eyes. Or any such thing. 

Who are you?  Do you attend many big Cons?  I thought you were 20 years old based on your usual writing style but you say you have big sales and have been collecting for 40 years.  

[1Cool]

8 minutes ago, Myowncollector said:

When I started collecting they were 30 cents. Not a competition. I know guys who have been collecting for 5 years and know a ton. Whether 30 40 50 75 cents their was 1 or maybe a couple of each title. There wasn't 7 x-MEN titles and 10 Spider-man with 50 different variant covers and no internet to read the comics for free. Just my reasoning for this. No idea if I am right or not. I know no nothing of the relationship of James bond and mash books sales related to their movies so I can't discuss it. 

I’m unsure on how the total number of titles has much to do with the conversation other then possibly explaining why most books have terrible sales.  Movies have not translated into a plethora of new young collectors - they have spawned a way for “key” comics to go up in price and massively  increased the demand for a few titles every year.  The millions of people who watch marvel movies or super hero tv shows are not flocking to comic shops.  Comic books are manufactured collectibles more then ever and history does not paint a pretty picture for these type of collectibles.

[Myowncollector]

3 minutes ago, 1Cool said:

Who are you?  Do you attend many big Cons?  I thought you were 20 years old based on your usual writing style but you say you have big sales and have been collecting for 40 years.  

Don't worry about it. Don't need my personal opinions on things effecting my business. Haven't been to a con in 13 years. Got too expensive to justify doing it personally and seemed they put comics on the back burner. Writing style is I type as fast as I can think and type and I don't worry about grammar spelling etc. I don't fight the autocorrect either and mine stinks. The grammar police can block or avoid reading my post. Soon as lock down is over or sports comes back I am most likely gone. Maybe sooner. I wondered why the forum was dead. Starting to see why. 

[kav]

As longs as comics as a whole continue to climb in value there is no data that would indicate comics are dead as a collectible.  People have been saying this for decades yet they continue to climb in value.  

[1Cool]

6 minutes ago, Myowncollector said:

Don't worry about it. Don't need my personal opinions on things effecting my business. Haven't been to a con in 13 years. Got too expensive to justify doing it personally and seemed they put comics on the back burner. Writing style is I type as fast as I can think and type and I don't worry about grammar spelling etc. I don't fight the autocorrect either and mine stinks. The grammar police can block or avoid reading my post. Soon as lock down is over or sports comes back I am most likely gone. Maybe sooner. I wondered why the forum was dead. Starting to see why. 

I am far from perfect in my grammar.  You just come across very bluntly with your opinions and I’ve no idea who you are or your background in the comic field.  I’d think anyone who pops into a well established message boards and starts throwing around their weight after only a couple months would find some resistance - don’t you think?

[Myowncollector]

6 minutes ago, kav said:

As longs as comics as a whole continue to climb in value there is no data that would indicate comics are dead as a collectible.  People have been saying this for decades yet they continue to climb 

 

Then how come 30 to 40 years ago I could take a 75 cent comic that just came out and in a few weeks put it in back issues and sell it for a $1? I cant take a $4 comic and sell it for $5 It goes into the dollar bin. On the other hand a brand new $4 can instantly sell for $40 if it has a 1st appearance. And variants are another thing. Interesting and guess it's all how you view things.

[kav]

1 minute ago, Myowncollector said:

Then how come 30 to 40 years ago I could take a 75 cent comic that just came out and in a few weeks put it in back issues and sell it for a $1? I cant take a $4 comic and sell it for $5 It goes into the dollar bin. On the other hand a brand new $4 can instantly sell for $40 if it has a 1st appearance. And variants are another thing. Interesting and guess it's all how you view things.

well I'm talking about books that are actually valuable to start with.  They have not declined in value.  Or, books that were never valuable become suddenly valuable.  Valuable books as a whole have not declined in value, as would be necessary to bolster an argument that comics as a collectible are dying.

[JJ-4]

20 hours ago, bobotski said:

I can guarantee you, in 25 years boardies will still talk about Liefeld's artistic skills.

Or lack there of

[kav]

1 minute ago, JJ-4 said:

20 hours ago, bobotski said:

I can guarantee you, in 25 years boardies will still talk about Liefeld's feet.

Or lack there of

FTF you guys.

[Myowncollector]

21 minutes ago, 1Cool said:

I am far from perfect in my grammar.  You just come across very bluntly with your opinions and I’ve no idea who you are or your background in the comic field.  I’d think anyone who pops into a well established message boards and starts throwing around their weight after only a couple months would find some resistance - don’t you think?

I am what to me seems like a rare person. Able to have a neutral standing on things and self reflection. If I am wrong I won't continue to argue. I am not wrong often, not because I know everything, but I simply avoid conversations or subjects I don't know much about. I don't think I ever called anyone any names or anything. I enjoy hearing other people's opinions. At the very least it gives me and idea of what others think or feel. I give my opinions and people can take them or leave them. I don't care what others think of them or myself. I can be a whole or smart bass. Just how I am. Not too PC or sensitive. People I hang with its like a comedy roast all the time. Comic market treated me great. 2012 to 2018 were by far the most amazing years. I think that is over. I sold it seems any relevant books. No more mcu super stars to emerge as I see it. If I find a mega mcu key in the wild it will be sold. For speculation and selling the hobby has peaked imo. But I don't believe it will go the way of blockbuster VHS pogs beanie babies. Those that think that good for them. They could be right. 

[Myowncollector]

18 minutes ago, kav said:

well I'm talking about books that are actually valuable to start with.  They have not declined in value.  Or, books that were never valuable become suddenly valuable.  Valuable books as a whole have not declined in value, as would be necessary to bolster an argument that comics as a collectible are dying.

I know what you meant. That is just the argument some people like to make. Well only the keys have gained. Well most art is under $100 heck most has trouble selling for $10 at a thrift sale or yard sale. I have a basement and garages full of under $5 comics that 99.9% of them will remain that way. That was the problem me another person had on a forum about comics as an investment. I was talking about the fraction of percent of comics and they were talking about all comics in general. 

Hobby is always dying though. I know lots of people who sold in the 90s because they thought that was the peak. Then more that sold in 2000s because they didn't see any gains and wanted the $ for other life things. I agreed with them. I never seen the mcu craziness coming. But I never seen prices plummeting either. I think Af 15 hulk 181 have peaked. Get a little bump from movies. But if in 10 years the tripled in price it wouldn't surprise me. 

[Hollywood1892]

4 minutes ago, Myowncollector said:

 

Hobby is always dying though. I know lots of people who sold in the 90s because they thought that was the peak. Then more that sold in 2000s because they didn't see any gains and wanted the $ for other life things. I agreed with them. I never seen the mcu craziness coming. But I never seen prices plummeting either. I think Af 15 hulk 181 have peaked. Get a little bump from movies. But if in 10 years the tripled in price it wouldn't surprise me. 

If someone is buying for investment then those are the blue chip books they need to put their money into

[Myowncollector]

1 minute ago, Hollywood1892 said:

If someone is buying for investment then those are the blue chip books they need to put their money into

I respect your opinion and you could very likely be right and majority agree with you. I am by far in the minority. I don't own, and I ever find a deal on one I will sell asap or soon as movie comes out any of these books ff 1,2,3,5,48,49 avg 1,2,4 xmen 1,2,4,12, any 1st appearance of any character that has appeared in a movie or tv show the past 5 years. With a small handful of exceptions. Inhumans daredevil hulk 1 I would wait on. 

And I can see them going up. Especially ones that were fox properties. Just considering only $ investment purposes, I feel there are better options.

[kav]

17 minutes ago, Myowncollector said:

I know what you meant. That is just the argument some people like to make. Well only the keys have gained. Well most art is under $100 heck most has trouble selling for $10 at a thrift sale or yard sale. I have a basement and garages full of under $5 comics that 99.9% of them will remain that way. That was the problem me another person had on a forum about comics as an investment. I was talking about the fraction of percent of comics and they were talking about all comics in general. 

Hobby is always dying though. I know lots of people who sold in the 90s because they thought that was the peak. Then more that sold in 2000s because they didn't see any gains and wanted the $ for other life things. I agreed with them. I never seen the mcu craziness coming. But I never seen prices plummeting either. I think Af 15 hulk 181 have peaked. Get a little bump from movies. But if in 10 years the tripled in price it wouldn't surprise me. 

Its not MCU that keeps book valuable plenty of books like planet or venus or nearly any GA continue to climb.  There is zero evidence for comics as a collectible dying and continuing evidence for the opposite for the last 40 years running.

[Myowncollector]

2 minutes ago, kav said:

Its not MCU that keeps book valuable plenty of books like planet or venus or nearly any GA continue to climb.  There is zero evidence for comics as a collectible dying and continuing evidence for the opposite for the last 40 years running.

For sure. But if disney got planet comics and put some characters in a avengers movie look out haha. I don't even think about golden age when talking about the comic market. A lot of those books are so hard to find and seem immune from the speculation and movies.