OtherEric Posted March 16, 2021 Share Posted March 16, 2021 (edited) There has been some disagreement on what qualifies as Pepé Le Pew's first appearance in comics, with most of us on the Looney Tunes thread saying it's Daffy Duck #27 but other sources saying it's Looney Tunes #240. The situation is genuinely complicated enough that I wanted to get some other opinions on the subject, hopefully from people with a bit less of bias, and see what people think, if it's one or the other or we should just call it a tie. Daffy Duck #27: Indicia date October-December 1961, date on cover is simply December. Grand Comics Database has an on-sale date of 1961-08-01, taken from 1961 Periodicals, Copyright Office, Library of Congress. Looney Tunes #240: Indicia Date October 1961, date on cover is simply October. Grand Comics Database has an on-sale date of 1961-08-17, taken from 1961 Periodicals, Copyright Office, Library of Congress. So, the situation is: They tie, more or less, on indica date, Looney Tunes #240 wins on the printed date actually on the cover, Daffy Duck #27 wins on the LoC on sale dates. What do people think is best considered the first appearance, or is it a tie? Does anybody own a copy with a date stamp? Edited March 16, 2021 by OtherEric Get Marwood & I 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffro. Posted March 16, 2021 Share Posted March 16, 2021 6 hours ago, OtherEric said: Daffy Duck #27: Indicia date October-December 1961, date on cover is simply December. Grand Comics Database has an on-sale date of 1961-08-01, taken from 1961 Periodicals, Copyright Office, Library of Congress. Looney Tunes #240: Indicia Date October 1961, date on cover is simply October. Grand Comics Database has an on-sale date of 1961-08-17, taken from 1961 Periodicals, Copyright Office, Library of Congress. I'd be very interested to know which one passes the smell test Spoiler porcupine48, HotKey, bc and 1 other 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pemart1966 Posted March 16, 2021 Share Posted March 16, 2021 On sale date trumps all IMO IngelsFan and williamblood 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagii Posted March 16, 2021 Share Posted March 16, 2021 I'd be happy to call it a tie (until I snag a 'nice' Daffy 27 ) .....(but now...is one a cameo and the other a full?) A little Hulk 181 humor folks OtherEric, porcupine48 and HotKey 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrWeen Posted March 16, 2021 Share Posted March 16, 2021 Are the dates provided by the library of congress release dates or files copyright dates. Also the data from this era is not always accurate. It seems odd to me that 240 would be released on a Thursday when all other comics appear to have Tuesday dates. I am not sure we can trust the information on this. OtherEric 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OtherEric Posted March 16, 2021 Author Share Posted March 16, 2021 3 hours ago, pemart1966 said: On sale date trumps all IMO 1 hour ago, MrWeen said: Are the dates provided by the library of congress release dates or files copyright dates. Also the data from this era is not always accurate. It seems odd to me that 240 would be released on a Thursday when all other comics appear to have Tuesday dates. I am not sure we can trust the information on this. And that's the issue at the heart of this; we have on sale dates but we're not 100% sure how reliable they are 60 years later. Although the difference in the day of the week on release dates isn't that surprising; I've seen release dates in house ads that are on different days of the week. There wasn't really a single release date until comic shops became a thing. I would love to see copies with date stamps; I have both of the issues but neither of them have a date stamp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williamblood Posted March 21, 2021 Share Posted March 21, 2021 on sale date wins, unless some new info is found daffy duck #27 is the 1st app. i tried to tell the kcc app guy about the date but he refused to change his alert. guys ego doesnt want to admit he's wrong OtherEric and IngelsFan 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atomised Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 ok there's an elephant in this room and we all know it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagii Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 Isn't this similar to the 1st Peanuts in comic books situation between Tip Top 173 and United 21? I think both books get notated on the label "ties with" the other for the distinction. Was one on the stands a few weeks before the other but cover date is the same so that makes that a wash as opposed to a monthly vs quarterly date situation, clouding things a bit? OtherEric, porcupine48 and Tri-Color Brian 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pemart1966 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 On 3/16/2021 at 2:18 AM, OtherEric said: There has been some disagreement on what qualifies as Pepé Le Pew's first appearance in comics, with most of us on the Looney Tunes thread saying it's Daffy Duck #27 but other sources saying it's Looney Tunes #240. The situation is genuinely complicated enough that I wanted to get some other opinions on the subject, hopefully from people with a bit less of bias, and see what people think, if it's one or the other or we should just call it a tie. Daffy Duck #27: Indicia date October-December 1961, date on cover is simply December. Grand Comics Database has an on-sale date of 1961-08-01, taken from 1961 Periodicals, Copyright Office, Library of Congress. Looney Tunes #240: Indicia Date October 1961, date on cover is simply October. Grand Comics Database has an on-sale date of 1961-08-17, taken from 1961 Periodicals, Copyright Office, Library of Congress. So, the situation is: They tie, more or less, on indica date, Looney Tunes #240 wins on the printed date actually on the cover, Daffy Duck #27 wins on the LoC on sale dates. What do people think is best considered the first appearance, or is it a tie? Does anybody own a copy with a date stamp? It would be hard to get a better source than the one from which you've drawn. That said - it's Daffy Duck #27 unless better information comes along. Let's not forget that a date stamp may not do it. It's 1961 that we're talking about, so the books may not have been initially on the stands on the same date in LA; NYC; Peoria; Sheboygan; Ottawa, Ontario etc etc OtherEric and IngelsFan 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OtherEric Posted March 23, 2021 Author Share Posted March 23, 2021 This one is less ambiguous, at least. First Pepe cover, 5th overall appearance. Just got it today: Jayman, IngelsFan and aardvark88 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagii Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 (edited) 7 hours ago, OtherEric said: This one is less ambiguous, at least. First Pepe cover, 5th overall appearance. Just got it today: Very nice! Covers like this put in perspective how many stars the franchise launched (and there are STILL a few missing here -Speedy, Marvin, Penelope, Granny, Sylvester Jr) Congrats! Edited March 23, 2021 by sagii OtherEric 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pemart1966 Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 Pwese refresh my momowie. Who's the owl with the glasses at the back? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OtherEric Posted March 23, 2021 Author Share Posted March 23, 2021 10 minutes ago, pemart1966 said: Pwese refresh my momowie. Who's the owl with the glasses at the back? Owl Jolson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pemart1966 Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 (edited) Thanks - from which cartoon/cartoons? I've seen A LOT of LT and MM over the decades but this guy's not ringing a bell... Edited March 23, 2021 by pemart1966 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OtherEric Posted March 23, 2021 Author Share Posted March 23, 2021 2 minutes ago, pemart1966 said: Thanks - from which cartoon/cartoons? I've see A LOT of LT and MM over the decades but this guy's not ringing a bell... “I Love to Singa”, from 1936. They were only in one of the classic cartoons but it really is one of the classics. With that said, now that I think about it I’m not 100% that’s who it’s meant to be... but I can’t think who else it could be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pemart1966 Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 (edited) Bizarre that they would put a 1936 character on the cover of what was then a current comic. I've seen that cartoon but I think that the last time I saw it was 1936 I can't think of what character it would be. The only one that comes to mind that's similar is Old Widow Hen's little boy from the Fog Horn Leg Horn cartoons - but this is not him. Does he appear in any of the stories in that comic? Nice comic BTW - great condition. Edited March 23, 2021 by pemart1966 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IngelsFan Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 GCD says it’s “Ollie Owl”. He appeared in 8 shorts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OtherEric Posted March 23, 2021 Author Share Posted March 23, 2021 10 minutes ago, IngelsFan said: GCD says it’s “Ollie Owl”. He appeared in 8 shorts. I think he’s the more likely candidate. I’ll check the book when I get home for appearances Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pemart1966 Posted March 24, 2021 Share Posted March 24, 2021 3 hours ago, IngelsFan said: GCD says it’s “Ollie Owl”. He appeared in 8 shorts. These 8 shorts spanned 1935-36. I say again, very strange character choice for that cover. Interestingly enough, a very similar looking character with the identical name also appeared in Paramount cartoons! How did that happen?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
